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'New Paleo' Guidelines What do you think?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by jammies View Post
    Beans are very high in a lot of types of lectins. I would guess many of them are destroyed with cooking, but not all.

    I was resistant to removing beans until I realized that several of the compounds that I use in the lab to stimulate the crap out of immune cells are actually extracts derived from beans.
    This is the common argument against beans and is true if you were talking about raw beans. This is why you soak beans for 12+ hours, before cooking, to greatly reduce the amount of phytates and lectins. Sprouting and fermenting is also beneficial and can reduce lectin by up to 98%.

    Stephen Guynet has also covered this:
    Whole Health Source: Beans, Lentils, and the Paleo Diet
    http://lifemutt.blogspot.sg/ - Gaming, Food Reviews and Life in Singapore

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Reventon View Post
      This doesn't look like "New Paleo". The nicest name I can think of is Transitional Paleo... but I'd lean more towards "I Can't Believe it's Not Paleo."
      ^ Hehe, post of the day!

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      • #18
        Originally posted by AMonkey View Post
        So much in the same way as beans, they are nutritious and not harmful, so why cut them out? Also there is no mention of making them a staple in Richard's post.
        What about in point no. 1? Where it is written that folks should "REPLACE all wheat and other gluten grains (barley & rye) from bread, pasta, cereals WITH white rice, beans, and potatoes (or other starchy veggies) as your "staple" foods and substrates for your proteins (meat, fish, shellfish, fowl, veggies)."
        If you're interested in my (very) occasional updates on how I'm working out and what I'm eating click here.

        Originally posted by tfarny
        If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/

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        • #19
          Beans aren't very nutritious unless one has to rely on plants for food. IOW in comparison to other plants, they don't suck. In comparison to animals, they are the ugly step child.

          And you don't have to soak meat for half a day to make it okay to eat.

          I don't much care what other people eat - to each his own. But the whole "beans are a great source of protein," comes from the same mindset as Meatless Monday and plant-based diets. It's wrong minded thinking shoved down our throats at the same time we were being told that beef would give us heart disease.
          "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

          B*tch-lite

          Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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          • #20
            As someone who has had bean poisoning several times, I seriously marvel at anyone who tries to call them healthy. It's not like rice bran where the negatives are sort of theoretical and you have to go to an extreme to really notice them. It's more like wheat where some people like me are going to REALLY notice right away and other people are on a curve from there. But it's even MORE than wheat because everyone will get sick or even die given the appropriate dose.
            In God we trust; all others must bring data. W. Edwards Deming
            Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

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            • #21
              'New Paleo' Guidelines What do you think?

              Beans are okay. Same with rice IMO from a "how much should I worry about this" pov. I just don't like beans much anymore. They taste like fillers to me. Rice is still yummy in pilafs and sushi.

              I also would not base my diet around beans/rice. If I want starch it is potatoes, and that is kind of rare unless I am doing a few days of the potato hack to save money. Otherwise my carbs come from fruits... Glorious fruits.
              Last edited by turquoisepassion; 12-03-2013, 07:32 AM.
              ------
              HCLF: lean red meat, eggs, low-fat dairy, bone broth/gelatin, fruits, seafood, liver, small amount of starch (oatmeal, white rice, potatoes, carrots), small amount of saturated fat (butter/ghee/coconut/dark chocolate/cheese).

              My Journal: gelatin experiments, vanity pictures, law school rants, recipe links


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              • #22
                F-yeah corn tortillas. I make my own, such awesome tacos.

                If anyone else does tortillas, get bob's redmill masa harina and try it out. you can also make pupsas!

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by loafingcactus View Post
                  As someone who has had bean poisoning several times, I seriously marvel at anyone who tries to call them healthy. It's not like rice bran where the negatives are sort of theoretical and you have to go to an extreme to really notice them. It's more like wheat where some people like me are going to REALLY notice right away and other people are on a curve from there. But it's even MORE than wheat because everyone will get sick or even die given the appropriate dose.
                  What are the symptoms of bean poisoning? How much and what sort of beans did you eat to get it, and how were they prepared?

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                    What are the symptoms of bean poisoning?
                    I don't know if I've ever had bean poisoning, but I know after a bean-heavy meal people around me sure get it!

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Mr. Anthony View Post
                      I don't know if I've ever had bean poisoning, but I know after a bean-heavy meal people around me sure get it!
                      Hemagglutinin and Food Poisoning from Beans

                      One source mentions vomiting blood. It's a different reaction from the one I had last time I ate a lot of split peas, which was just inflammation for several days.

                      http://www.fda.gov/Food/FoodborneIll.../ucm071092.htm
                      Last edited by eKatherine; 12-03-2013, 10:42 AM.

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                      • #26
                        But it's even MORE than wheat because everyone will get sick or even die given the appropriate dose.
                        A ton, ton, ton of people eat beans as a staple in their diet every day. I hate beans. I really do. But seriously...for probably 90% of humans, the fatal dose of beans is probably more than one would ever care to eat. They are a staple in so many places. I'm sure most people can eat beans, potatoes, grains, rice etc. without ill consequence beyond getting fat if you eat too much of them.

                        I think the guidelines are more realistic than paleo/primal that avoids starches. I imagine most people on the planet simply can't afford a diet of meat/fruit/veggies.

                        http://maggiesfeast.wordpress.com/
                        Check out my blog. Hope to share lots of great recipes and ideas!

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                          What are the symptoms of bean poisoning? How much and what sort of beans did you eat to get it, and how were they prepared?
                          I've gotten it the old fashioned way- undercooked crockpot beans (they will undercook even if you have a good crockpot if you don't use enough water) and from going a little crazy on the quantity of edamame consumed. I've also gotten it from undercooked beans in "Mexican" food, about the only bean exposure I get these days. Vomiting, diarrhea, and intestines that pretty much stop working- a lot like celiac for me, it takes a while for food to stop coming out with the teeth marks still visible from when it went in.

                          Here in NC some church potluck manages to kill off some of their older members from a good case of bean poisoning about once a year it seems.
                          In God we trust; all others must bring data. W. Edwards Deming
                          Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                            What are the symptoms of bean poisoning? How much and what sort of beans did you eat to get it, and how were they prepared?
                            Symptoms: nasty gastric distress. How much you have to eat to get poisoned would depend on the bean. Many contain some of the toxin - phytohaemaglutinin (thank you, Wikipedia) - but among commonly-eaten beans, the dangerous levels are only in red kidney beans. Just a few of those, if not properly cooked, will poison you. 'Properly cooked' = kept at a vigorous rolling boil for 10 minutes, in addition to all the usual soaking and simmering. Just simmering will not destroy the toxin.

                            (Also I think I remember reading years ago that soya beans have plenty of the toxin - but people don't generally try to cook those at home.)

                            When I ate beans, I would soak overnight, discard the water, boil fast for 10 minutes with the lid off the pan, discard the water, bring back to the boil in fresh water and simmer until done. And use in recipes with plenty of carminative spices .

                            More from Wikipedia:
                            If the beans are cooked at a temperature below boiling (without a preliminary boil), as in a slow cooker, the toxic effect of haemagglutinin is increased: beans cooked at 80 C (176 F) are reported to be up to five times as toxic as raw beans.[7] Outbreaks of poisoning have been associated with cooking kidney beans in slow cookers.[7]
                            The primary symptoms of phytohaemagglutinin poisoning are nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Onset is from one to three hours after consumption of improperly prepared beans, and symptoms typically resolve within a few hours.[7] Consumption of as few as four or five raw, soaked kidney beans can cause symptoms.[7]
                            Last edited by Hilary; 12-03-2013, 11:07 AM.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by magnolia1973 View Post
                              But seriously...for probably 90% of humans, the fatal dose of beans is probably more than one would ever care to eat. They are a staple in so many places.
                              People rarely die from it, but the dose of raw red kidney beans that triggers symptoms seems to be 4 or 5 beans. And slow-cooked beans seem to be several times as toxic.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                                People rarely die from it, but the dose of raw red kidney beans that triggers symptoms seems to be 4 or 5 beans. And slow-cooked beans seem to be several times as toxic.
                                Part of the issue with the slow cooker is that when you cook beans, the toxin actually increases as it is first being cooked (I didn't read the whole link you provided, but it might discuss this) and then decreases only as cooking continues.
                                In God we trust; all others must bring data. W. Edwards Deming
                                Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

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