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Eating Paleo, But Don't Believe in Evolution?

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  • Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
    Evolution yes, everything evolves, realizes latent possibilities that are present, also the organic species; they are not fixed platonic forms, at last not when considered under the category of time! But the scientific knowledge about the mechanisms behind biological evolution is incomplete and natural selection may be ruled by higher laws that science don’t understand and probably never will understand due to its limited focus and method. But something seem to be going on in the Universe, it is rather absurd to think that the ongoing evolutionary process that produces more advanced inorganic, organic, and social synthesis throughout time is a product of blind forces or chance. I am not postulating a transcendent Deity, since I find that solution not very satisfying, but an immanent evolving "Logos" like Hegels “Geist” or Spinozas “Deus”…
    I never thought i'd say this...but I agree with gorbag. hell must be freezing over

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    • Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
      just an observation. the majority of humans are religious. the majority of people are assholes. they simply do not live by the basic commandments or tenets that they so highly praise on sundays. I've seen the cars pulling out of the churches, beeping at each other and yelling profanities at each other. I see the way the average person behaves at the supermarket. religious has become an excuse. a free pass to behave like a douchebag all week, then get saved on sundays. it entitles people to behave poorly for their entire lives, then find salvation on their deathbed. religion is, in fact, exactly what tony-in-nj alluded to before the "Survival of the fittest so take as much as you can... you have no higher power to answer to. So as long as you don't get caught its all good." religious people can do whatever they choose to do, and as long as they show up for church on sunday, they are forgiven for their sins. man does not require a fairytale to live the correct way. he doesn't need to be forgiven of his sins. he already knows the right way to live. it's the entitlement and forgiveness that seems to have bred the daily bullshit that people pile on each other. if there were repercussions for this stuff, and not forgiveness, things would most certainly change for the better. if church taught you that if you walk out the door and act like an ashole, the guy in the next car over is going to smash your face in with a tire iron, and that not only was it legal, but that god encouraged it, people would stop acting like assholes.
      the bible verses do state that: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you", just as there can be morals without religion, there can be morals in religion. The problem is neither, it's people's selfish and ignorant nature looking to utilize anything they can to excuse themselves and cherrypicking the parts they want to. I don't consider those people really religious, they're just more victims of current society, and hypocrites. Same as a prisoner who "finds God" in prison after committing a heinous crime; they're just looking for ways to deal with their moral dilemma in the easiest possible way because their innate morals as a human being are eating away at their conscious, and they don't want to face the fact that they're a monster. Odds are, and show, rehabilitated criminals will commit more crimes after they get out of prison.
      Make America Great Again

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      • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
        the bible verses do state that: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you", just as there can be morals without religion, there can be morals in religion. The problem is neither, it's people's selfish and ignorant nature looking to utilize anything they can to excuse themselves and cherrypicking the parts they want to. I don't consider those people really religious, they're just more victims of current society, and hypocrites. Same as a prisoner who "finds God" in prison after committing a heinous crime; they're just looking for ways to deal with their moral dilemma in the easiest possible way because their innate morals as a human being are eating away at their conscious, and they don't want to face the fact that they're a monster. Odds are, and show, rehabilitated criminals will commit more crimes after they get out of prison.
        that's a great point. kind of touches on philosophy a little. are there just good people and bad people, and that's the way of things?
        Last edited by not on the rug; 11-05-2013, 10:28 AM.

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        • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
          I don't consider those people really religious, they're just more victims of current society, and hypocrites.
          I agree with this. I don't think there are very many truly religious people out there. The simple fact that our country is capitalist and yet predominantly Christian is a contradiction.

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          • Personally, I think that debating and arguing about the details of the process of evolution is pointless in the context of deism vs atheism. Either one understands and accepts evolution as a general concept or rejects it entirely in favor of whatever mythology they find comfort in. There is no scientific evidence that will thwart a deist from believing in their faith and no evidence of a deity that will cause an atheist to believe that something unphysical exists.
            http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

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            • Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
              that's a great point. kind of touches on philosophy a little. are there just goo people and bad people, and that's the way of things?
              Right and wrong are directly related to what will keep the ones in power, in power. Devised rules for our society. Just as the bible lays out plans for people to follow, society dictates plans for people to follow. This is why they always change over time, and is a proper prediction of social entropy.

              The problem with current society is now that consumerism is being portrayed as good thing, as is focusing on career to have "money" to buy their merchandise, being selfish and consumed is now societal norm, and less focus is placed on all the good morals that have been laid out before us(whether or not you believe in God or not); which shows what you were talking about in your previous example and prediction of social entropy. It's simply the way things are turning, hence victim of circumstance from current society. This is why crime rates will continue to rise.
              Make America Great Again

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              • Originally posted by Daemonized View Post
                Personally, I think that debating and arguing about the details of the process of evolution is pointless in the context of deism vs atheism. Either one understands and accepts evolution as a general concept or rejects it entirely in favor of whatever mythology they find comfort in. There is no scientific evidence that will thwart a deist from believing in their faith and no evidence of a deity that will cause an atheist to believe that something unphysical exists.
                Sure, but you can't conflate real deism with not believing in evolution, which is the subject of the thread. I object to the insinuation that evolution is a matter for belief more than anything. It's observed on a daily basis. It requires no supernatural hand. It has provided us with a model upon which so many advancements have been built. Denying its role in how things came to be this way is plain silly, no matter how good one is at making internet arguments. I'm certainly not trying to convince anybody that nothing exists, just pointing out that no supernatural being is necessary to explain how the proliferation of life took place.
                The Champagne of Beards

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                • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                  Right and wrong are directly related to what will keep the ones in power, in power. Devised rules for our society. Just as the bible lays out plans for people to follow, society dictates plans for people to follow. This is why they always change over time, and is a proper prediction of social entropy.

                  The problem with current society is now that consumerism is being portrayed as good thing, as is focusing on career to have "money" to buy their merchandise, being selfish and consumed is now societal norm, and less focus is placed on all the good morals that have been laid out before us(whether or not you believe in God or not); which shows what you were talking about in your previous example and prediction of social entropy. It's simply the way things are turning, hence victim of circumstance from current society. This is why crime rates will continue to rise.
                  The problem with current society is that it's utopian. It takes behaviors that people commit and outlaws them, knowing that people will continue to commit them. Daniel Quinn uses the examples of trespassing and interrupting. Both things are annoying, but we have 2 very different ways of dealing with them. Trespassing is a crime, while interrupting is not. The way we deal with interrupting doesn't say "Thou shalt not interrupt," it says "when someone interrupts, the best way to deal with it is ______". We forget that all the laws were formulated this way when we lived in the social system given to us by evolution, the gift from the Gods of this world that was the tribal system. Any new forms of government will still be forms of government. Only when people begin to recognize the wealth that our ancestors took for granted for 2 million years and demand it for themselves that we'll walk away from all the consumerism and other "bad" behaviors you're railing against. Because if we don't realize we can have security and meaningful lives, we'll take HDTV's and toasters, if that's all we recognize as being available.
                  The Champagne of Beards

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                  • Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                    Right and wrong are directly related to what will keep the ones in power, in power. Devised rules for our society. Just as the bible lays out plans for people to follow, society dictates plans for people to follow. This is why they always change over time, and is a proper prediction of social entropy.

                    The problem with current society is now that consumerism is being portrayed as good thing, as is focusing on career to have "money" to buy their merchandise, being selfish and consumed is now societal norm, and less focus is placed on all the good morals that have been laid out before us(whether or not you believe in God or not); which shows what you were talking about in your previous example and prediction of social entropy. It's simply the way things are turning, hence victim of circumstance from current society. This is why crime rates will continue to rise.
                    I agree. the whole victim of circumstance and woe is me nonsense society that we live in is appalling. there was once a time when people were ashamed to be this way. now it's an encouraged way of life. I feel old when I talk like that, but at the age of 34, it's sad that I've seen such a drastic societal decline in such a short time

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                    • Again, you're arguing over pointless details and the line is drawn across the boundary of deists and atheist. An atheist or non-deist at least can accept that there is an evolutionary process whether they choose to understand or not. A deist will find flaws and wants to bring supernatural concepts explanations into the discussion.

                      The original topic is "How can one eat paleo but not believe in evolution?" and my answer is because one is a deist. A person's diet works or doesn't work for them independently of what they believe and the evolution does not require one's belief. To be a deist you must believe in some sort of supernatural concept and that's a very hard thing to let of for many people.
                      http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

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                      • Originally posted by Daemonized View Post
                        Again, you're arguing over pointless details and the line is drawn across the boundary of deists and atheist. An atheist or non-deist at least can accept that there is an evolutionary process whether they choose to understand or not. A deist will find flaws and wants to bring supernatural concepts explanations into the discussion.

                        The original topic is "How can one eat paleo but not believe in evolution?" and my answer is because one is a deist. A person's diet works or doesn't work for them independently of what they believe and the evolution does not require one's belief. To be a deist you must believe in some sort of supernatural concept and that's a very hard thing to let of for many people.
                        Maybe I misunderstood what you mean by deism. If a person's god isn't out there performing miracles, then he simply set the laws of nature in motion and let it play out. Wouldn't a deist accept the reality of evolution by natural selection?

                        Like I said, maybe I misunderstand...

                        Originally posted by Wikipedia
                        Deism holds that God does not intervene with the functioning of the natural world in any way, allowing it to run according to the laws of nature.
                        The Champagne of Beards

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                        • Originally posted by quikky View Post
                          I agree with this. I don't think there are very many truly religious people out there. The simple fact that our country is capitalist and yet predominantly Christian is a contradiction.
                          Christianity and capitalism are compatible. I wouldn't call this country capitalist, though.
                          In matters of style, swim with the current. In matters of principle, stand like a rock.

                          This message has been intercepted by the NSA, the only branch of government that listens.

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                          • The opposite of atheism is theism, not deism.

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                            • And the opposite of deism is adeism...
                              "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                              - Schopenhauer

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                              • Good to know that religious topics always bring heated debate, even on health forums
                                http://lifemutt.blogspot.sg/ - Gaming, Food Reviews and Life in Singapore

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