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  • #16
    Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    Butter is not food. It is refined fat, the most fattening and one of the least nutritious substances on Earth. Just eat food.
    You know Choco, I'm still waiting on you to find that study that says that fat is the most "fattening" macronutrient. You preach it like it's religion, and maybe, just maybe, it's even true! But you have yet to provide a study demonstrating it.

    I'm willing to learn from you, if you're willing to teach with citations and examples, and not just make statements that you haven't backed up.
    "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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    • #17
      Cinnamon Rice Chex taste exactly like Cinnamon Toast Crunch, and they don't have gluten. Not paleo, but you could do worse.

      Or you could just eat some butter, because it's better for your mitochondria, apparently. The shit you learn here.

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      • #18
        But does it help your midi-chlorians?
        I find your lack of bacon disturbing.

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        • #19
          Well or you could melt butter, add cocoa and chex mix and stick in the fridge for breakfast balls.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
            You know Choco, I'm still waiting on you to find that study that says that fat is the most "fattening" macronutrient. You preach it like it's religion, and maybe, just maybe, it's even true! But you have yet to provide a study demonstrating it.

            I'm willing to learn from you, if you're willing to teach with citations and examples, and not just make statements that you haven't backed up.
            You shall be waiting a long time I'm afraid. Tough to produce something that doesn't exist. On the other hand, if you say something enough times that just automatically makes it true right? Isn't that how commercials work?

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
              You shall be waiting a long time I'm afraid. Tough to produce something that doesn't exist. On the other hand, if you say something enough times that just automatically makes it true right? Isn't that how commercials work?
              Hey, you know, he could be absolutely right about that. You know, I'll give him that.

              But then he goes into those CI/CO threads saying "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie," then he comes here and says "fat is the most fattening." I don't see how you can have it both ways.

              It isn't that he must necessarily be wrong, it's just... The logic fails me on how the two concepts are compatible. Can anyone explain that to me?
              "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                Or you could just eat some butter, because it's better for your mitochondria, apparently. The shit you learn here.
                Oh, I don't actually eat bulletproof coffee myself. But yeah, you know SCFA are suppose to be good and all right? Dunno if there is an optimal dose response and there's a lot more being talked about in the RS arena, but hey I can't see anything wrong with assuming a bit of butter may help things along. Guess I shouldn't call one "better", but yeah butter is churned cream and rice chex is....well you see the list.

                There is a lot more out there on it but just for instance here http://pen.sagepub.com/content/early...89833.abstract

                I know its in a certain set of population and all, but I do like to at least give people somewhere to start to pick up the trail. Sepsis does have several things in common with severe metabolic syndrome so its relevant I think. Not to our OP, but we are beginning to turn off track anyhow.

                Don't matter I actually agree that one could do worse...especially at 16. I know I did. And I let my kids have it once in a while. Well actually just one of em. The other one is on a more strict diet. I know a fella that pours half and half on his to help keep his weight up.
                Last edited by Neckhammer; 09-07-2013, 07:29 PM.

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                • #23
                  From my understanding... And I could be wrong on this, but let's have a go.

                  Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
                  You know Choco, I'm still waiting on you to find that study that says that fat is the most "fattening" macronutrient. You preach it like it's religion, and maybe, just maybe, it's even true! But you have yet to provide a study demonstrating it.

                  I'm willing to learn from you, if you're willing to teach with citations and examples, and not just make statements that you haven't backed up.
                  The idea is, your body stores the majority of your food intake before it begins using it. Carbohydrate is usually shuttled off to be stored as glycogen, and then fat is stored in fat. From there, your body begins to access stuff on a requirements needed basis. In this case, the fat you eat is "fattening," because it's stored as fat.

                  Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
                  Hey, you know, he could be absolutely right about that. You know, I'll give him that.

                  But then he goes into those CI/CO threads saying "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie," then he comes here and says "fat is the most fattening." I don't see how you can have it both ways.

                  It isn't that he must necessarily be wrong, it's just... The logic fails me on how the two concepts are compatible. Can anyone explain that to me?
                  To continue from above, it's the same thing. It is more "fattening," but in a caloric deficit, it doesn't matter. But, by consuming larger amounts of fat, while in a surplus, you will more than likely store that fat, burn far less than you consume, and then it just adds up, making you fat.

                  Fat is largely the only thing that gets stored as fat, as de novo lipogenesis isn't going to happen under normal conditions, even under the SAD's RDAs, there's nothing else to really store as fat. But people don't really follow the SAD's RDAs anyway.

                  ___

                  As for butter, the preference is for nutrient density compared to the caloric density. Butter fails this test. A pat of butter is about 40 calories, and trace amounts of various vitamins that hardly scratch at your nutrient needs. Hence "empty" calories. Going with the bulletproof coffee nets you more calories, on roughly the same nutrient density, which could be better spent on other, more nutrient dense foods.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
                    Hey, you know, he could be absolutely right about that. You know, I'll give him that.

                    But then he goes into those CI/CO threads saying "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie," then he comes here and says "fat is the most fattening." I don't see how you can have it both ways.
                    His point is that it's all about CICO, except when it's fat, which is fattening, or carbs, which you can eat unlimited quantities of because they don't count.

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                    • #25
                      This is what the study was about:

                      Bearing the above-mentioned disadvantages of the “traditional” LCFAs/LCTs in mind, the integration of SCFAs/SCTs or MCFAs/MCTs in the nutrition regimen of intensive care patients might offer advantages: unlike LCFAs/LCTs, the metabolism of SCFAs/SCTs and MCFAs/MCTs is less complex and independent of many transport systems. When applied enterally, these fatty acids are rapidly absorbed and digested. They are capable of diffusing directly into the mitochondria in a carnitine-independent manner. By bypassing the highly regulated transport systems for LCFAs, SCFAs/MCFAs can be regarded as direct fuel for β-oxidation.
                      Not relevant to general mitochondrial function, but this thread is about Chex, so...

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                        His point is that it's all about CICO, except when it's fat, which is fattening, or carbs, which you can eat unlimited quantities of because they don't count.
                        Where did he say you can eat unlimited quantities of carbs because they don't count? He said that they are the least likely to be stored as fat in a surplus. They can still make you fat if overeaten.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                          Butter is not food. It is refined fat, the most fattening and one of the least nutritious substances on Earth. Just eat food.

                          Better options: eggs, sausage, potatoes, fruit, yogurt, meat, vegetables...virtually everything but grain flour and refined fat.
                          How is butter a "refined fat"? Are you suggesting it is refined the same way canola or corn oil is refined? You do know how to make butter, just take cream and shake it until butter is formed? Not really most peoples definition of refined. So I guess rending animal fat also makes it refined?

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                            His point is that it's all about CICO, except when it's fat, which is fattening, or carbs, which you can eat unlimited quantities of because they don't count.
                            Ouch, if you just waited a minute more and read Euphorics post you might not have made such a stupid post. You probably still would have though.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                              Butter is not food. It is refined fat, the most fattening and one of the least nutritious substances on Earth. Just eat food.
                              What a crock of $H!T !! There's TONS of sciencey links to studies on the MANY MANY of the benefits of butter on the internets. Why the constant repeating of such shite?!
                              This is from our good friend, PrimalToad's website: 10 Reasons Why You Should Eat More Butter - primaltoad.com/butter/‎ Per tablespoon, grass-fed butter has 10% of your daily value of Vitamin A. Butter from ... At 700 calories per meal, I could eat a meal of butter for only 93 cents!
                              Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                              Better options: eggs, sausage, potatoes, fruit, yogurt, meat, vegetables...virtually everything but grain flour and refined fat.
                              Sausage?? Yikes, elbows, noses & knee caps, haha (Yeah I know, cartilage & collagen is good fer ya..) I do or rather will eat sausage, rarely...but bacon on the weekends, sure no problem!
                              "Science is not belief but the will to find out." ~ Anonymous
                              "Culture of the mind must be subservient to the heart." ~ Gandhi
                              "The flogging will continue until morale improves." ~ Unknown

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                                This is what the study was about:



                                Not relevant to general mitochondrial function, but this thread is about Chex, so...
                                The only other thing I can find is this blog post Whole Health Source: Butyric Acid: an Ancient Controller of Metabolism, Inflammation and Stress Resistance?

                                It's been a while since I've looked at this and I actually don't keep lists of studies on my hard drive. Peter at hyperlipid did some stuff on it too at one point I think.

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