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The Health and Fitness Industry Is Dead (And That Includes You, Paleo)

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  • The Health and Fitness Industry Is Dead (And That Includes You, Paleo)

    This is interesting....your thoughts?

    The Health and Fitness Industry Is Dead. And That Includes You, Paleo. - The Rebooted Body
    Recent Blog: http://www.peakperformanceradio.net/...y-john-saville

    https://www.facebook.com/PaleoJourne...?ref=bookmarks

  • #2
    Originally posted by canuck416 View Post
    Yup, he posts here too once in a while. It fairly correct. Its not that the knowledge isn't available. Its the psychological and/or addictive aspects pervasive in our society that make people not put that knowledge to use. I gave up long ago on "convincing" anybody that they should care for themselves. That is a conclusion one has to come to on their own before I can help them these days. Sure at one point when I was all naive and gunghoe I thought everyone actually WANTED to be healthy and just didn't know how! Well I was way off. Its sad but true. Oh, you can still work to "transform" people as he says, but that person still has to have an inherent WANT to transform. You can not and will not ever instill that WANT in them, no matter how much you try.
    Last edited by Neckhammer; 08-19-2013, 11:47 AM.

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    • #3
      Loved the paper, in fact was thinking the same things for a while: why the heck all those people who have the same idea at heart fight over fruit or dairy or beans or what not when the ideal is the same?

      Loved the Manifesto as well, printing it atm actually.
      My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
      When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
        Yup, he posts here too once in a while. It fairly correct. Its not that the knowledge isn't available. Its the psychological and/or addictive aspects pervasive in our society that make people not put that knowledge to use. I gave up long ago on "convincing" anybody that they should care for themselves. That is a conclusion one has to come to on their own before I can help them these days. Sure at one point when I was all naive and gunghoe I thought everyone actually WANTED to be healthy and just didn't know how! Well I was way off. Its sad but true. Oh, you can still work to "transform" people as he says, but that person still has to have an inherent WANT to transform. You can not and will not ever instill that WANT in them, no matter how much you try.
        Agreed. The article is correct in saying that providing information will not result in weight loss, if that's your goal. It seems as though his theory is that a more fundamental and holistic approach to improving the health of the whole individual is what is required so that "issues" that are blocking change are dealt with and they will want to change. The illusive key to unlocking the desire and will to change will be the next magic bullet in the health and fitness industry.

        Prochaska's - Stages of Readiness to Change - is a good starting point to understanding where you are in this process.

        Stages of Readiness for Change | Taking Charge of Your Health & Wellbeing
        Last edited by canuck416; 08-19-2013, 12:13 PM.
        Recent Blog: http://www.peakperformanceradio.net/...y-john-saville

        https://www.facebook.com/PaleoJourne...?ref=bookmarks

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        • #5
          of people i know well and those i know only in passing, i don't know anybody who eats like i do. however, i can't even count how many i know who lap up "the biggest loser."

          as i sit here eating a dish of pan-seared, free-range, organic chicken livers...

          sure, the information is "out there", but it's not even within a glimmer of approaching being disseminated to, nor accepted by, the mainstream. regardless of observing my n~1, then listening to me about my methods, my friends all still go low-cal, low-fat to lose weight. then rinse and repeat. what i do is "too hard."

          accepting a shift in life-long adherence to cw is a huge hurdle -- one which not many are capable of doing. it means they were "wrong" for decades, casting further doubt on an already shaky self-image. not everybody is willing to be humbled in order to embrace effective change. how many want to be a philosophical outlier? smokers now know smoking is bad, but it took many decades for the smoking paradigm to change. right now we remain stuck with special-k bars, low-fat yoplait and zumba being sooooooooooooooo good for you.
          As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

          Ernest Hemingway

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          • #6
            See, that's exactly the point the article is making, that quibbling over lower fat vs higher fat, Zumba vs barbell. As long as food is natural and doesn't harm you, it doesn't matter if it's liver and spinach or oranges and shrimps or beans and quark. As long as movement is joyful and natural, it doesn't matter if it's deadlift or Zumba.

            Well, that's what I think anyway.
            My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
            When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by canuck416 View Post
              Agreed. The article is correct in saying that providing information will not result in weight loss, if that's your goal. It seems as though his theory is that a more fundamental and holistic approach to improving the health of the whole individual is what is required so that "issues" that are blocking change are dealt with and they will want to change. The illusive key to unlocking the desire and will to change will be the next magic bullet in the health and fitness industry.

              Prochaska's - Stages of Readiness to Change - is a good starting point to understanding where you are in this process.

              Stages of Readiness for Change | Taking Charge of Your Health & Wellbeing
              He is correct in what is "needed", however nobody has come up with a delivery system acceptable to the masses. I mean we are talking in terms of healing emotional scars and basically fixing peoples BELIEF systems. That is a daunting prospect. And as a trainer/practitioner in anything other than the psychological field you are left again with simply pointing out or referencing good information for the individual to follow up on. Unless you're Paul Check usually people arent hiring you as their spiritual, emotional, and physical practitioner all in one.... and suggesting such a relationship could be met with mixed result. I'm not saying there should not be or is not a place for such a practitioner. There is! But you are back to the 1% or less of people actually searching for such a person. Bah, I'm coming off kinda negative on this. I don't mean to be. The problem is I know the positive changes awaiting for people who will just take the plunge, but so few actually put thought into action.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Leida View Post
                See, that's exactly the point the article is making, that quibbling over lower fat vs higher fat, Zumba vs barbell. As long as food is natural and doesn't harm you, it doesn't matter if it's liver and spinach or oranges and shrimps or beans and quark. As long as movement is joyful and natural, it doesn't matter if it's deadlift or Zumba.

                Well, that's what I think anyway.
                perhaps my emphasis is misconstrued? sorry, if that's the case here. most people i know still think that starving themselves on yoplait and lean cuisines while banging out hours of crazy cardio are the way to lose weight. none of which has anything to do with whole foods or natural movements.

                "getting healthy"? "healing the body"? rarely come into the equation.

                i had NO idea how broken i was til i made very serious changes in diet, movement, sleep and outlook.
                As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                Ernest Hemingway

                Comment


                • #9
                  Familiarity and apathy are overwhelmingly. People will cling to an abusive parent or partner or politician and scream if a third party tries to separate them.

                  I never initiate health conversations face to face but people start them with me. I'll give plain simple answers about why I feel some choices are better than others without explicitly recommending them and yet they quickly supply me with rationalization as if my opinion matters. "That's lovely for you but it would never work in my case because...
                  ...time and money"
                  ...age/gender/genes"
                  ...for some reason I'm tired/stressed today"
                  37//6'3"/185

                  My peculiar nutrition glossary and shopping list

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                  • #10
                    I dunno, I generally find that folks around here are very receptive to the ideas. But ideas need proof. Alas, I cannot demonstrate a more desirable body than a girl who runs on elliptical, then on the treadmill, then lifts a few 5 lbs dumbbells, then eats bread or cake. People respond to show rather than tell. For me, Staci's story was a turning point. Unfortunately, I do not have anything impressive to show for many years of adherence. "That's how I look like and I do this", can easily be counteracted by many examples of those who follow CW but have a better appetite control so they look better than I do in my age (and have more kids, etc). In fact, I think most people would think that I looked far better on CW than I do now.

                    So, i do not think I am the right person to promote Paleo lifestyle. Or indeed maybe even live it... what I do want is to enjoy my life. And lose weight, but, oh, well. I have an overabundance of the information, and I still do not know how.
                    Last edited by Leida; 08-19-2013, 01:40 PM.
                    My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
                    When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Only of minor importance, people's psychological failings are extremely hard to pin down and change. So the road to emotional health ( and therefore dietary health) is a very long and arduous one. Also I see another trouble arising from people try to deal with health by dealing with emotions, they end up "fighting" them selfs, wich become a very detrimental thing to do.

                      The "problem" with paleo to me is (as the article alludes to) an overload of unimportant information. It's the whole "peat vs primal" thing. It's the whole "insulin vs calorific excess" thing. So much information is disseminated that the true (and very easy) path to successful health is often lost in the noise.

                      Paleo is only a half job Harry, it has quite successfully shifted the paradigms on "what foods to eat and what foods to avoid" to one that emulates our history. It has completely failed at shifting the (I believe more important) paradigm of "how do we eat food". People eat paleo foods the same way as we did before ancestral health popped up on the radar. There has been NO paradigm shift to emulate HOW we have historically (for millions of years) eaten food, only emulation of the foods we may have come across.

                      As humans vs other animals we have extreme flexibility in WHAT we can eat. Probably the largest food list of the whole animal kingdom. It's "HOW" we eat the foods we do, that we as humans are sensitive to.




                      Sent from my iPhone
                      A little primal gem - My Success Story
                      Weight lost in 4 months - 29kg (64 lbs)

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                      • #12
                        I posted this in Odds and Ends but it's probably more appropriate here.

                        Like many people I originally started a Paleo diet to lose weight, but after much study and refection I've evolved my perspective and now believe too much focus has been placed on body change or weight loss when the real focus should be on getting back in balance and healing the whole person. I've come to realize that my embrace of the Paleo lifestyle has been about seeking optimal health and weight loss has been a byproduct of this journey. For me the Paleo movement is about getting back in touch with our ancestral roots, those things that are the unique pieces of the human puzzle. It is my belief that our approach to what we choose to eat, how we exercise and play and our relationships with people and nature can all benefit from an awareness of our ancestral history and help each of us develop our own unique, more holistic approach, to better health.
                        Last edited by canuck416; 08-19-2013, 02:47 PM.
                        Recent Blog: http://www.peakperformanceradio.net/...y-john-saville

                        https://www.facebook.com/PaleoJourne...?ref=bookmarks

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
                          He is correct in what is "needed", however nobody has come up with a delivery system acceptable to the masses. I mean we are talking in terms of healing emotional scars and basically fixing peoples BELIEF systems. That is a daunting prospect. And as a trainer/practitioner in anything other than the psychological field you are left again with simply pointing out or referencing good information for the individual to follow up on. Unless you're Paul Check usually people arent hiring you as their spiritual, emotional, and physical practitioner all in one.... and suggesting such a relationship could be met with mixed result. I'm not saying there should not be or is not a place for such a practitioner. There is! But you are back to the 1% or less of people actually searching for such a person. Bah, I'm coming off kinda negative on this. I don't mean to be. The problem is I know the positive changes awaiting for people who will just take the plunge, but so few actually put thought into action.
                          Your right, most people are simply not ready to change, they get stuck in contemplation or preparation and never commit to taking action and even when they do they fail to maintain. Hence the 1%. However, I do think embracing a Paleo/Primal lifestyle has increased the odds somewhat.
                          Recent Blog: http://www.peakperformanceradio.net/...y-john-saville

                          https://www.facebook.com/PaleoJourne...?ref=bookmarks

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                          • #14
                            Very true. Great article.

                            Yes, this country (US) truly needs a revolution. My country spends more $$ than it makes, divorce is no-biggie, & we're currently the 2nd fattest country on the planet, BUT still the wealthiest. WE ARE SPOILED ROTTEN. The US is like that kid growing up that always got an allowance, but never did his chores AND called his parents "A**HOLES! to their face"

                            We want what we want, when we want it. We love short cuts, lack patience & about 25 years ago adopted a "Work Smarter, Not Harder" mentality. Committment & patience isn't sexy. The reason that we're fat & "Health & Fitness is dead" is the same reason I have 50 Attorneys for every one engineer/skilled contractor in my phone book. Everyone is looking for the sexy job & shortcut to success (interesting how many stuggling attorneys I know, but my plumber is slammed with work @ $80/hr. Still don't hear anyone interested in becoming a skilled tradesman)

                            Seems like we're more interested in political correctness & entitlement than truth & sensibility. Simply put, this country has an attitude problem & needs to be spanked.
                            Last edited by abc123; 08-19-2013, 03:06 PM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by abc123 View Post
                              Very true. Great article.

                              Yes, this country (US) truly needs a revolution. My country spends more $$ than it makes, divorce is no-biggie, & we're currently the 2nd fattest country on the planet, BUT still the wealthiest. WE ARE SPOILED ROTTEN. The US is like that kid growing up that always got an allowance, but never did his chores AND called his parents "A**HOLES! to their face"

                              We want what we want, when we want it. We love short cuts, lack patience & about 25 years ago adopted a "Work Smarter, Not Harder" mentality. Committment & patience isn't sexy. The reason that we're fat & "Health & Fitness is dead" is the same reason I have 50 Attorneys for every one engineer/skilled contractor in my phone book. Everyone is looking for the sexy job & shortcut to success (interesting how many stuggling attorneys I know, but my plumber is slammed with work @ $80/hr. Still don't hear anyone interested in becoming a skilled tradesman)

                              Seems like we're more interested in political correctness & entitlement than truth & sensibility. Simply put, this country has an attitude problem & needs to be spanked.
                              Actually, I'm pretty sure the linked article says almost the opposite. We are a nation of wounded, emotionally crippled children, grasping at any pathetic thing that feels like love. Fake food has been engineered to feel good. It's cheap and easy and seems like it ought to fill that dark hole inside. Can you imagine if our culture was as cavalier about heroin as it is about super yummy fake food? And then when people look for something to save them from what they've done to their bodies, they are swamped with equally unsatisfying fake "healthy" foods. If they turn to that and chronic cardio, they will get plenty of support for their endeavor, but if they look elsewhere, they will be nearly alone. I'm not surprised so many people feel hopeless.

                              My life changed completely when I realized that my bingeing behavior was as much a way to punish myself as it was to comfort myself. It's a hard thing, though, to accept that the way you treat yourself is as vicious and ugly as the meanest thing anybody ever said to you. A diet with a bunch of rules (and I include PB in this) is a lot easier, emotionally, than facing what's inside you. The fact that hardly anybody can fix their relationship with food from the outside is borne out by the abysmal success rate of dieting.
                              50yo, 5'3"
                              SW-195
                              CW-125, part calorie counting, part transition to primal
                              GW- Goals are no longer weight-related

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