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  • #31
    Originally posted by Mikee5 View Post
    PaleoHacks is the main Paleo forum.

    Rice is already a Primal approved food, and so is dairy. I agree about the milk and corn but if you want dogmatic, unhelpful responses, PaleoHacks is great. Maybe it's just an observation, I dunno.
    Paleohacks is absolutely a nasty, vile place of Super Paleo Cavemen/Women Who Are Better Than You and GROK HARDER ARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.
    A Post-Primal PrimalPat

    Do not allow yourself to become wrapped up in a food 'lifestyle'. That is ego, and you are not that.

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    • #32
      +1 to noddles
      I am not a bodybuilding/fat loss/strength training "guru" BUT I achieved a lean state with ease after learning the correct way to train and eat and I want to HELP YOU achieve the same.

      Getting fit is also about managing your mindset:
      http://getfitmindset.com

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Nivanthe View Post
        And yet your response is carefully worded to be a subtle dig.

        Primal foods are somewhere under the "Start here" link up top. Main difference between it and traditional paleo is that it includes dairy and starches if you're tolerant.

        Of course, people on the forums have more of a "What works for me" thing going so the restrictive guidelines have loosened. Terrible for newbies, but oh well. Like j3nn, I don't do the 'rules' eating thing, it's too micromanagey and has driven me crazy before.
        But then why use the term "primal?" Isn't the implication that it's somehow "older" or "paleolithic?" Which it clearly would not be. The whole premise behind paleo or "old/traditional methods of eating" is that certain foods were not eaten year round, and some were never eaten (corn for example for most of the world's population) at all. Clearly, no one can say for certain that corn or beans will kill you, or even harm you. We can't say for sure. We're simply trying to emulate what we "think" they ate. And the safest bet is that they ate meat everyday, or just about, and grazed on the odd plant or nut when found. They weren't eating banana's daily, drinking milk, or eating corn and legumes, day in and day out. At least, the archaeological record doesn't show that. That much is common sense, no? But even that may be wrong: look at Gobekli tepe! Civilization may be older than we think!

        I guess the friction with "primal" is that it isn't that at all. It's a diet that essentially says eat that which isn't a problem for you to eat. But be aware: most people that have "problems" with foods are unaware. Not having overt symptoms is not an open door to consumption. Most people would be unaware of whether the corn they're consuming is GMO or not, but most would agree that GMO is something we should avoid. Why? Because there is the potential for trouble. Same as grains and legumes. Potential.

        Anyway, splitting hairs, but I think "primal" is riding the success that paleo is having right now. It wouldn't have the same pizzazz as if it were called what it is: a whole food's diet. For many in the community, it's about selling books after all. And that isn't a direct jab at Mark - I have his books. It's a general statement for the whole "diet" community.
        Last edited by MouthDR; 07-07-2013, 04:02 PM.

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        • #34
          Everything Paleolithic is not beneficial and everything Neolithic is not detrimental. Perhaps our distant ancestors would have lived better and longer with some of the discoveries we have now. I think that's a good gamble. I think it's probably better to start by looking at our most recent ancestors. The ones in our family who live the longest, healthiest, and happiest lives. That's a good starting place, I think. From there you analyze your response to similar habits and modify as needed. Speculating about what our ancient ancestors ate 100,000 years ago is fun and interesting but it's not definitive or absolute. Even the ones who beat the odds of premature death from injury or disease still didn't live beyond the years we live now. See my first sentence.
          Last edited by j3nn; 07-07-2013, 05:18 PM.
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          • #35
            Originally posted by MouthDR View Post
            But then why use the term "primal?"
            Well I certainly didn't, when talking about my own food choices. I can't say I follow it anymore, though I will always be more aware of better quality foods, and wheat is still out for me, under most circumstances.

            Originally posted by MouthDR View Post
            Isn't the implication that it's somehow "older" or "paleolithic?" Which it clearly would not be.

            I guess the friction with "primal" is that it isn't that at all. It's a diet that essentially says eat that which isn't a problem for you to eat. But be aware: most people that have "problems" with foods are unaware. Not having overt symptoms is not an open door to consumption. Most people would be unaware of whether the corn they're consuming is GMO or not, but most would agree that GMO is something we should avoid. Why? Because there is the potential for trouble. Same as grains and legumes. Potential.
            Maybe I threw in a bit of confusion with what people on the forum do, vs. what "Primal" really is. Per your example, corn isn't primal. Otherwise yes, I agree -- This has a bit more leeway with what you can eat vs strict Paleo. But I guess that's why there's Paleo already.

            I don't care about reenactment or what foods the cavemen may have eaten back in the day. In my opinion, the idea of Primal is less about emulating that, and more just to get into the mindset that the "caveman" didn't have his bowl of wheaties every morning, because they didn't exist.

            Of course there are going to be differences when a product or diet is marketed.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by MouthDR View Post
              Wow, a lot of testy responses. Seem to have hit a nerve. Thought we were all on the same page here.
              You sure did. People don't like it when you try to tell them what they think based on incorrect preconceived notions you picked up on some website you found out there. I didn't know we were supposed to think in lockstep. Is that how you think?

              It appears to be that the difference between primal and paleo is this: a person's ability to restrict foods. Primal followers find paleo too restrictive and have relaxed the rules as it were. So where do the food choices stop with primal? Because it seems like the "primal" version some of you follow is nothing more than a simple whole foods diet that most books advocate for, like the Weston A Price diet.

              One thing your primal diet does have going for it though is that it sure as hell will sell more books than a paleo diet. Much easier to follow.
              Wait, no paleo books have been bestsellers? What planet are you from?

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              • #37
                The book WELL FED has a great jicama "home fry" recipe -- you could try that (I like it with sauteed ground beef).
                F, 44 years old, 111.8 lbs, 4 feet 11.5 inches (yes, that half inch matters!)

                **1st place sparring, AAU TKD regional qualifier, 2/15/15 - It's damn good to hit like a girl!**

                **First-ever 5K race 11/28/13: 37 minutes, 18+ seconds, no stopping**

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                  Wait, no paleo books have been bestsellers? What planet are you from?
                  Uh, you are distorting what he said.....
                  Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

                  Griff's cholesterol primer
                  5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
                  Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
                  TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
                  bloodorchid is always right

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by MouthDR View Post
                    Wow, a lot of testy responses. Seem to have hit a nerve. Because it seems like the "primal" version some of you follow is nothing more than a simple whole foods diet that most books advocate for...
                    Nothing hits a nerve for me like using the term "whole food diet." Paleos and Primal like to say "I just eat whole unprocessed foods." Total BS. Bacon is more processed than whole wheat bread. Kombucha is more processed than (real) ice cream. "Healthy CW" likes to call themselves "whole" too. Yeah, whole wheat, whole sweetend yogurt, whole rice,and veggie chips from Whole Paycheck. Stop saying "whole" already! Ditto for "eating clean," another craptacular phrase.

                    Primal is basically Paleo + some dairy + fitness component + 20% leeway for bad oils and such because we don't believe in being ultra snobs when we go out to eat with friends.

                    Most books do NOT advocate Weston Price. They advocate CICO, chronic cardio, and "moderation," with all the associated guilt.
                    5'0" female, 45 years old. Started Primal October 31, 2011, at a skinny fat 111.5 lbs. Low weight: 99.5 lb on a fast. Gained back to 115(!) on SAD chocolate, potato chips, and stress. Currently 111.

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                    • #40
                      Bacon is more processed than whole wheat bread.
                      How so? Do you think it takes less effort to make bread from raw wheat than to make bacon from raw cow? I kind of doubt that, but I'm open to an argument.
                      Primal is basically Paleo + some dairy + fitness component + 20% leeway for bad oils and such because we don't believe in being ultra snobs when we go out to eat with friends.
                      This is precisely what sold me on it. Health schmealth, you can pry the cheese from my cold, dead hands.

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                      • #41
                        Sweet potatoes. I know you said you don't like potatoes but sweet potatoes are very different to most people.

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                        • #42
                          Foods on Mark's Primal Shopping List:
                          Primal Blueprint Shopping List | Mark&#039;s Daily Apple
                          "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by lea View Post
                            How so? Do you think it takes less effort to make bread from raw wheat than to make bacon from raw cow? I kind of doubt that, but I'm open to an argument.
                            bacon? erm... mostly from pigs, but yeah.

                            also, plantains and yucca.
                            As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                            – Ernest Hemingway

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                            • #44
                              mostly from pigs
                              Ha. Duh. My parents just got cows so maybe they are on my mind (not dairy cows, alas. I really wanted to make cheese. Can't convince them to get milking goats either)

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
                                Uh, you are distorting what he said.....
                                Has Mark sold more books than Loren Cordain?

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