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  • #16
    Maybe you could read them the book in spanish? I have however, read that there are people on here that don't eat eggs due to allergies---

    Anywhoooo, that's my two cents. I am way too new to really give too much feedback. But, I found this post quite fun to read, so I wanted to jump in!

    One thing I do know for sure... you won't be 15 forever!

    Good luck!
    S.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by CarbDodger View Post
      Once you've got your blood tests you'll probably have a lot more ammunition to support your arguments but keep in mind your parents haven't done a bad job within the limits of their knowledge. You aren't overweight for starters; unlike a lot of individuals your age and you sound comparatively fit. You're also bright and even though they're putting blockers on what you'd like to do they have obviously encouraged you to think for yourself.
      Try and get them to buy lamb, even lean lamb is comparatively fatter and you can point out lamb is the least interfered with meat,its not given hormones and antibiotics and is grass fed so is a very good choice as a meat, its not factory farmed and is an 'ethical' choice- that might fit in with their existing life style choices
      Thanks! OK, for now I'll add lamb to my diet, though I doubt it is grass-fed and free of antibiotics and hormones

      Originally posted by EatMoveSleep View Post
      You’re 15 – I assume healthy apart from IBS that is presumably controlled by your diet.

      So what is the point of the blood test and also “nailing it”?

      Do you think you need it to get your parents off your back for eating real food? (and allow you to have more than 1 egg a day)
      Or are they bothering you because you seem too food obsessive (for a 15YO)?
      The point of the blood test is a clear proof of how healthy this diet is and as you said enjoy more freedom, so I can't risk running too low or high of anything.

      And about obsession, well... first it was (non) religion, then ethics, then politics, then economy, then ethics again, then philosophy, then self-development and now mainly sleep, nutrition, exercise, lucid dreaming and emotional introspection. So yes, I guess I'm quite obsessive with things

      Originally posted by shonieb33 View Post
      Maybe you could read them the book in spanish? I have however, read that there are people on here that don't eat eggs due to allergies---

      Anywhoooo, that's my two cents. I am way too new to really give too much feedback. But, I found this post quite fun to read, so I wanted to jump in!

      One thing I do know for sure... you won't be 15 forever!

      Good luck!
      S.
      Well, neither me nor my parents have sooo much time, if there only were a spanish version for the primal blueprint...

      And yes, I try to make my posts near-perfect with OCD dedication and (too many) revisions, so it's no surprise it was fun to you!
      Last edited by Miguelinileugim; 05-30-2013, 07:12 AM. Reason: OCD

      Comment


      • #18
        I would think that your strongest card to play is the disappearance of your IBS. What you really want for the next few years is that they don't try to force you to eat grains, legumes and nuts, right? Surely they're happy that you can eat without IBS symptoms and are happier and healthier for that? You don't need IBS with school work and exams. The lower carb side of it is something you can investigate for yourself when you have more control. If you need to make a concession to CW and eat more potatoes/carrots/starchy veggies to keep them happy, at 15, if you're relatively active, it shouldn't really affect you.

        I'd consider dairy as an option as well, both for fat and for the nod to CW, as long as you can avoid low fat options. i.e. don't bother with lower fat milk but enjoy your cheese and yoghurt and tell them it's good for vit D! But be aware that dairy can be implicated in acne, so that's something to keep an eye on.

        And watch the running. If you're already doing sprints and PBF then you might be better with gentle walks/hikes or easy cycling. Some days should be rest or very easy exercise.

        To be honest, unless you already have a blood problem, I can't see why you wouldn't have good enough results. I'm sure your parents just want to be sure you're not damaging your health. I had a quick google and at least on Amazon UK it looks like there may be a spanish translation of the Gary Taubes book - How We Get Fat and What to Do About It. Would 'Como engordamos' fit that? I would suggest this is probably the next best thing to your parents being able to read PBF as it covers the basics of why high carb CW diets are not working, in plain language for non-scientists and how what you are trying to do does work. Maybe something to help them understand why you feel so strongly.
        Me, My Father and The Alzheimer's - http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread84213.html

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
          The point of the blood test is a clear proof of how healthy this diet is and as you said enjoy more freedom, so I can't risk running too low or high of anything.

          And about obsession, well... first it was (non) religion, then ethics, then politics, then economy, then ethics again, then philosophy, then self-development and now mainly sleep, nutrition, exercise, lucid dreaming and emotional introspection. So yes, I guess I'm quite obsessive with things
          First point 'nailing the blood test'( getting very good numbers - according to the lab and doctors) is NOT proof of how healthy you are or your diet is. Though it may be seen as 'proof' to CW doctors, health insurance companies, ( and parents).

          Consider the often quoted stat : half the people that have heart attacks have normal or low cholesterol numbers (good numbers according to CW doctors but they have heart attacks - so is this clear proof they are healthy ??). Often these people are checked by doctors and eat good CW diets - all is seen as good - but they have a heart attack.

          Some people use cholesterol lowering medication from doctors and go from healthy to depressed and forgetful ( and then need medication for depression) - all this to treat the non-disease of slightly "elevated" cholesterol.

          Its just a number, a high total cholesterol is not a illness and low doesn't mean you're healthy.
          Many indicators make up whether one is healthy or not.

          Secondly : lighten up a bit and have some fun - you're still a kid, enjoy it.
          If you're healthy, just eat plenty, get some simple exercise and I'd suggest you forget about the blood test for a few years (if healthy, I personally wouldn't bother until after 25yo).

          Comment


          • #20
            Why on Earth is a 15 year old getting blood tests?

            What disease process are you monitoring or what symptoms are you having?

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
              The point of the blood test is a clear proof of how healthy this diet is and as you said enjoy more freedom, so I can't risk running too low or high of anything.

              And about obsession, well... first it was (non) religion, then ethics, then politics, then economy, then ethics again, then philosophy, then self-development and now mainly sleep, nutrition, exercise, lucid dreaming and emotional introspection. So yes, I guess I'm quite obsessive with things
              Nevermind... I see.

              Sorry to tell you this, but unless your far outside of healthy then at the age of 15 your numbers should be pretty standard even if you were living on skittles. Usually takes decades to develop diseases of civilization and for test parameters to show abnormalities. Your on a good path to prevent such an end, but there probably isn't gonna be much up front to show for it.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
                Nevermind... I see.

                Sorry to tell you this, but unless your far outside of healthy then at the age of 15 your numbers should be pretty standard even if you were living on skittles. Usually takes decades to develop diseases of civilization and for test parameters to show abnormalities. Your on a good path to prevent such an end, but there probably isn't gonna be much up front to show for it.
                Yes I totally agree.
                A healthy teenager messing around with doctors and blood tests seems in itself not healthy (a contradiction?) .

                Don't go in to this super obsessive pursuit of 'health' - it can lead you the opposite of what you want and trying to achieve (it can actually lead to bad mental and physical health).

                “Avoid grains and process food/drink, sugar junk food, takeaways” - OK
                “Eat meat, veg, eggs, tubers, fruit and full fat dairy etc ( if you can take dairy)” - OK
                "Good sleep and exercise" - OK

                BUT:
                For you as a healthy growing 15yo - DONT DO : Ketosis, calorie limiting, I.F., carb (veg/tubers) avoidance, trying too hard to eat super-high fat diet, excessive exercise, extreme low body-fat %, pursuit of diet/health perfection, blood tests and doctors etc etc etc (these is NOT a healthy pursuit for you now IMO).

                Think of it like an apprenticeship of good health/diet – you wont be and expert overnight. It will literally take you about four years of steady study and practice, slowly over time things will “fall into place”, some years down the track you may consider yourself a practising ‘expert’ (but you never stop learning) – then you have the rest of your life to practice and improve on it if you want.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by awok677 View Post
                  I would think that your strongest card to play is the disappearance of your IBS. What you really want for the next few years is that they don't try to force you to eat grains, legumes and nuts, right? Surely they're happy that you can eat without IBS symptoms and are happier and healthier for that? You don't need IBS with school work and exams. The lower carb side of it is something you can investigate for yourself when you have more control. If you need to make a concession to CW and eat more potatoes/carrots/starchy veggies to keep them happy, at 15, if you're relatively active, it shouldn't really affect you.

                  I'd consider dairy as an option as well, both for fat and for the nod to CW, as long as you can avoid low fat options. i.e. don't bother with lower fat milk but enjoy your cheese and yoghurt and tell them it's good for vit D! But be aware that dairy can be implicated in acne, so that's something to keep an eye on.

                  And watch the running. If you're already doing sprints and PBF then you might be better with gentle walks/hikes or easy cycling. Some days should be rest or very easy exercise.

                  To be honest, unless you already have a blood problem, I can't see why you wouldn't have good enough results. I'm sure your parents just want to be sure you're not damaging your health. I had a quick google and at least on Amazon UK it looks like there may be a spanish translation of the Gary Taubes book - How We Get Fat and What to Do About It. Would 'Como engordamos' fit that? I would suggest this is probably the next best thing to your parents being able to read PBF as it covers the basics of why high carb CW diets are not working, in plain language for non-scientists and how what you are trying to do does work. Maybe something to help them understand why you feel so strongly.
                  Thanks for your amazing reply awok667!

                  Well, about the IBS, I can't prove my parents that this diet has solved it, I'll have to wait at least a month without symptoms before they believe it, that is, unless they rationalise it's not because of the diet (they might do that if they're really fanatical/skeptical)

                  I've read about the issue of calcium and acne (4-hour body) and osteoporosis, so I think that unless I can taste 100% raw and organic milk I'll stop eating dairy (butter excluded!)

                  And yes, I don't force things out, so I basically take a day of rest after any sprint session.

                  And about the book, I think that no book on Earth is enough to overcome the skepticism of my father, beyond any extreme skepticism there's an even more extreme fanaticism, still he doesn't understand that part, he uses ad hominem, golden mean and straw man fallacies like there's no tomorrow.

                  But well, at least he cares about me and gives me more than enough freedom for pursuing this diet, so I can't complain actually, but ignorance is as bad as egoism in most cases.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by EatMoveSleep View Post
                    First point 'nailing the blood test'( getting very good numbers - according to the lab and doctors) is NOT proof of how healthy you are or your diet is. Though it may be seen as 'proof' to CW doctors, health insurance companies, ( and parents).

                    Consider the often quoted stat : half the people that have heart attacks have normal or low cholesterol numbers (good numbers according to CW doctors but they have heart attacks - so is this clear proof they are healthy ??). Often these people are checked by doctors and eat good CW diets - all is seen as good - but they have a heart attack.

                    Some people use cholesterol lowering medication from doctors and go from healthy to depressed and forgetful ( and then need medication for depression) - all this to treat the non-disease of slightly "elevated" cholesterol.

                    Its just a number, a high total cholesterol is not a illness and low doesn't mean you're healthy.
                    Many indicators make up whether one is healthy or not.

                    Secondly : lighten up a bit and have some fun - you're still a kid, enjoy it.
                    If you're healthy, just eat plenty, get some simple exercise and I'd suggest you forget about the blood test for a few years (if healthy, I personally wouldn't bother until after 25yo).
                    Thanks for your reply!

                    I guess that the blood test should somewhat reflect reality, even if my cholesterol were a little high (I doubt it) it would probably be the only bad thing in my blood...

                    And the blood test is half because of my parents and half because I really want to prove them I'm being healthy, so I guess it's a necessity. And if my health is good I'm extremely happy and energetic and social and all (especially after waking up euphoric, then I'm basically god) and I have fun my way, which involves the sensation of constant improvement and a lot of reading, so I guess I'm enjoying life so far.

                    Of course, after this wave of improvements end I'll really start being happy (and I'm enjoying the path too!).

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
                      Why on Earth is a 15 year old getting blood tests?

                      What disease process are you monitoring or what symptoms are you having?
                      A possibly lethal eating disorder known as the primal diet, something extremely dangerous that might or might not kill me at my 120's of telomere shortening and happiness overdose.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
                        Nevermind... I see.

                        Sorry to tell you this, but unless your far outside of healthy then at the age of 15 your numbers should be pretty standard even if you were living on skittles. Usually takes decades to develop diseases of civilization and for test parameters to show abnormalities. Your on a good path to prevent such an end, but there probably isn't gonna be much up front to show for it.
                        Well, at least I'll be able to calm my parents down! They're really worried about all this.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by EatMoveSleep View Post
                          Yes I totally agree.
                          A healthy teenager messing around with doctors and blood tests seems in itself not healthy (a contradiction?) .

                          Don't go in to this super obsessive pursuit of 'health' - it can lead you the opposite of what you want and trying to achieve (it can actually lead to bad mental and physical health).

                          “Avoid grains and process food/drink, sugar junk food, takeaways” - OK
                          “Eat meat, veg, eggs, tubers, fruit and full fat dairy etc ( if you can take dairy)” - OK
                          "Good sleep and exercise" - OK

                          BUT:
                          For you as a healthy growing 15yo - DONT DO : Ketosis, calorie limiting, I.F., carb (veg/tubers) avoidance, trying too hard to eat super-high fat diet, excessive exercise, extreme low body-fat %, pursuit of diet/health perfection, blood tests and doctors etc etc etc (these is NOT a healthy pursuit for you now IMO).

                          Think of it like an apprenticeship of good health/diet – you wont be and expert overnight. It will literally take you about four years of steady study and practice, slowly over time things will “fall into place”, some years down the track you may consider yourself a practising ‘expert’ (but you never stop learning) – then you have the rest of your life to practice and improve on it if you want.
                          Well, I'm not trying to risk my health in the pursuit of greater health of course! But I want to improve my health hard and quick, so while I won't try anything extreme I'll try as hard as I can!

                          And ideally I would "finish" this wave of improvements in my life in a month or so, and making everything fall into place, but now my life is basically chaos, but then everything should become regular.

                          And maybe I'm not an expert, but so far I've given a 30 minutes long exposition about the primal diet in class and educated so many people about this that I've lost count!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
                            Well, at least I'll be able to calm my parents down! They're really worried about all this.
                            So it's the equivalent of passing a compulsory medical exam for work, or for medical insurance.
                            The “pass” is to keep the officials happy that all the official ‘boxes are ticked’ – not to do with health of the individual.

                            On that note, often people “cheat” (eat less fat, take certain supplements, fast, etc ) exclusively to lower their cholesterol to trick the lab test so they can keep their job or insurance. After doing this (and reducing their health in the process by some extreme practices) they go back to their healthier diet/lifestyle (higher fats etc).

                            So you’re maybe trying to do the same – lowering your health, to get lab test numbers that ‘prove’ you’re healthy so you can keep your “job/hobby” (that is continue to be allowed eat Paleo) .

                            It kind of reminds me of a medical joke:
                            “The operation was successful, but the patient died”


                            Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
                            Well, I'm not trying to risk my health in the pursuit of greater health of course! But I want to improve my health hard and quick, so while I won't try anything extreme I'll try as hard as I can!
                            Often takes a lot of time – though many improvements can happen in a short time

                            Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
                            And ideally I would "finish" this wave of improvements in my life in a month or so, and making everything fall into place, but now my life is basically chaos, but then everything should become regular.
                            !
                            Like I said it takes years IMO – especially if you’re sick and spent years getting sick.
                            Being young means you may not be that sick and can recover quickly.

                            Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
                            And maybe I'm not an expert, but so far I've given a 30 minutes long exposition about the primal diet in class and educated so many people about this that I've lost count!
                            Don’t take it the wrong way – from what I read, I’m sure you’ve done plenty.
                            I mean we are all still learning (I certainly am) – so much info out there.
                            Everybody reacts differently to certain foods and ways etc – it takes years to learn what works well with own body and why (often a mystery – that’s where the expertise is). What works well for you, may not work well for me – this is the bit that takes time (again IMO).

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by robtncqe
                              There is not enough fat here.
                              Umm the poster is eating 50g+ of butter a day. That's a lot of butter. Plus 50g+ olive oil. Plus the meat. That's plenty of fat.

                              This thread is awesome; someone smart actually eating right from a young age, and both parents want to stop it from happening. LOL.

                              Keep up the good work! Wish I was as smart as you when I was 15!

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Miguelinileugim View Post
                                Thanks for your amazing reply awok667!

                                Well, about the IBS, I can't prove my parents that this diet has solved it, I'll have to wait at least a month without symptoms before they believe it, that is, unless they rationalise it's not because of the diet (they might do that if they're really fanatical/skeptical)

                                I've read about the issue of calcium and acne (4-hour body) and osteoporosis, so I think that unless I can taste 100% raw and organic milk I'll stop eating dairy (butter excluded!)

                                And yes, I don't force things out, so I basically take a day of rest after any sprint session.

                                And about the book, I think that no book on Earth is enough to overcome the skepticism of my father, beyond any extreme skepticism there's an even more extreme fanaticism, still he doesn't understand that part, he uses ad hominem, golden mean and straw man fallacies like there's no tomorrow.

                                But well, at least he cares about me and gives me more than enough freedom for pursuing this diet, so I can't complain actually, but ignorance is as bad as egoism in most cases.

                                So it's concentrating on showing that you're fit and healthy after 2 months of Primal, especially that your IBS has improved. I'd say you might have to prepare yourself to compromise, just in case, in which case, the grains/legumes/sugar is the one thing you don't want back in your diet. So just be prepared to let them have potatoes and dairy initially. If you find you have an acne problem then you can do down the no-dairy route rather than taking medications, but unless it shows up or disturbs your IBS it's not going to do you any harm for a few years and there's plenty of healthy fats there, also Vit K2 is the butter is grass-fed.

                                It always pays to have a fall-back position worked out and may stop them pushing for full reversion to CW. Best of luck.
                                Me, My Father and The Alzheimer's - http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread84213.html

                                Comment

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