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  • #16
    I find that dairy in the morning or late at night sets me up for blood sugar swings that cause me to overeat. Could you try leaving dairy out of your breakfast? Stick with high fat, moderate protein. Perhaps more meat, eggs, and veggies, carbs from tubers, no dairy at all, and a bit less fruit?
    Using low lectin/nightshade free primal to control autoimmune arthritis. (And lost 50 lbs along the way )

    http://www.krispin.com/lectin.html

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Z0oom View Post
      Have you considered moving your smoothie consumption to later in the day? Maybe that is raising and then lowering your blood sugar enough to trigger hunger sensations.

      Have you tried fueling your body on mostly fats? If I were you, I would have your smoothie as a dessert, and eat meat with eggs in the morning. So maybe your day might look like, bacon/sausage/steak/leftovers and eggs for breakfast.

      At lunch maybe just have enough to tide you over, like an avocado with lime and salt.

      Then for dinner have your usual entree, side(s), and your dessert smoothie.

      My idea is just trying to stay low carb/sugar until in the evening. If you still get these hunger spikes....well then I would eat something, maybe you are increasing your energy expenditure and need more food.

      You mentioned meeting your caloric intake, roughly what are you trying to stick around? Depending on your goals, are you trying to increase, decrease or maintain this number?
      Thanks Z0oom. I only added the smoothies in the past couple of weeks because I have been craving them. I can see the risk of blood sugar spiking, but with our without the smoothie, with or without extra fats and meat, I still get hungry. I didn't eat breakfast today but was crazy for a smoothie so had one after my normal lunch. About half an hour later I wanted another one, but I didn't. That craving passed.

      I don't really know what my caloric goals are, probably about 2000 daily would be my requirement. I don't calorie count, except sometimes just to see and sometimes out of blind panic. I might eat between 1300 and 4000 calories depending on my level of restricting or binging, I actually have no real idea. If I'm brutally honest with myself, I could do with a couple of extra kilos.

      [QUOTE=aprimalmomma;1194280]I have the exact same issue and found IF to be a godsend...QUOTE]

      IF is definitely not a godsend for me, I've used it to sink further into restrictive eating and I feel quite stuck by it. I want to stop, but I find the hunger after breakfast and even the guilt of having breakfast overwhelming.

      Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
      Vac, I know the extreme hunger is disturbing But if your body is sending you those signals, you do need the nutrition. I really think the binging is a result from holding back from the body's needs. What are you binging on? Are you having cravings?

      If you're trying to recover you're going to have to accept that you will initially gain. It doesn't mean you'll gain much, or stay at the new weight forever, but there will be some gain.

      I'm trying to think back to when I was in active recovery, and I think the extreme hunger got better with eating lots of liver (in the form of pate). Seriously! I would eat it as if it was a slice of cake. Are you still restricting fruit?
      I'm craving dairy, hence all the smoothies, I'd had one to two a day for the last 10 days. I've started eating fruit too, I only buy seasonal stuff, so there are always at the moment pears and persimmons and frozen berries. I find fruit quite unappealing in winter but these ones I do like. When I binge I either pick at primal food in the fridge and then overeat my evening meal (at which point I'm not hungry, but eat anyway as an act of self-sabotage. Or I hit the Fuck It switch and eat whole packets of highly processed choc chip cookies and oat bars. I eat liver at least once a week, but I'm not sure I could eat pate like cake, my ED head would be screaming at me.

      Originally posted by Black Timber View Post
      It seems like you are on your way to recovery. I would think that if you are more comfortable If'ing then there is no harm there. Being extremely hungry and stressing over it, will be a lot worse for you than any downside of If'ing. You need to feel comfortable with your eating habits. From what I understand, intermittent fasting like the 16-8 breakdown has more benefits than draw-backs. I have not had to deal with an ED but I understand the hunger issue after eating. It's like there is a eating switch that gets turned on as soon as you break fast. For that reason I have been If'ing for a while now, am finding it easier to maintain my weight and have great energy all day. Good luck to you.
      This is my dilemma. I'm not more comfortable IFing, I know that if I want my mind and body to heal and recover then I need to stop. But you're right, the anxiety that ensues from setting off a day of eating doesn't seem worth it. It's all in my head, I know that, but I don't understand why I'm not the same after lunch and this only happens to me at breakfast time.

      Originally posted by Omni View Post
      Firstly, not sure what you mean by the "Stressors" of IFing, plenty of people are doing it, there really is no evidence of it being detrimental and many indications of it being healthy, if skipping breakfast results in a healthier mental position for you than eating it, then there is no reason to force yourself to eat breakfast.



      There is a lot of mental controls involved in those statements above, using punishment to discipline a "disobedient" body, that is the ED, eating should not involve mental anguish. Your body may be lacking calories or vital nutrients or may simply be hoarding because of years of deprivation pattern behaviour as dished out by your brain trying to attain some misguided goal. The only real solution is to change your focus from discipline to love & nurture, when your attitude changes towards your body and you start listening to what it wants, it will then start to heal.
      You need to be able to accept and love yourself and your body no matter it's outward appearance, stop comparing it to artificial mental ideals, it is an N=1 process, the ultimate for yourself can not be compared to anyone else irrespective of what your brain or the rest of the world tries to tell you. Healthy diet, fitness and mental state are your measures not scales, mirrors and calorie counters, eat according to your body's desires, keep active and relax your minds desire to control everything, your mind is only in control of your interaction with the outside world, but inside your body is and always will be in charge, when you support your body nutritionally and emotionally it will give you far more than you could have dreamed of.
      Intellectually, I know this. But years of self-punishment seem monumental right now. I need to start with eating what I need based around 3 meals a day plus whatever else is required. I barely know how to listen to my body any more.

      There may be many people IFing, but that doesn't make it a good thing. I am a lean, calorie restricted woman with young children who doesn't get enough sleep and my hormones are so out of whack I bleed sporadically and haven't had a regular period for over 6 years. Fasting is not a good thing for women like me and I wish I'd never been tempted by it.

      Paleo for Women | Fasting

      Should Women Fast? | Mark's Daily Apple

      Originally posted by dacec View Post
      I agree with listening to your body!

      I am an early in the day eater, meaning I consume most of my calories by 2. I just eat and eat and eat. Honestly most of the time I am not very hungry at dinner, but I ALWAYS listen to my body and eat when I am hungry.

      With an eating disorder, your brain and your body may have a disconnect. That is something to that may need work but I worry about you IFing, perhaps right now that is not the best route for you.
      Thanks dacec I worry about myself too. I don't know how to listen to my body. I start eating and it can turn into a food fight before I even know it. I admire people who can listen to their body, I have a friend who does just that and leaves food on her plate or had two lunches depending on her hunger. An ectomorph, but still, I'm so envious.

      Originally posted by jammies View Post
      I find that dairy in the morning or late at night sets me up for blood sugar swings that cause me to overeat. Could you try leaving dairy out of your breakfast? Stick with high fat, moderate protein. Perhaps more meat, eggs, and veggies, carbs from tubers, no dairy at all, and a bit less fruit?
      The dairy aspect is quite new for me Jammies. I was using it to try and fill myself up.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by CiKi90
        Hey VW, I understand where you're coming from, completely! It's great that you're aiming for 3 meals a day, but I have some questions for you to consider so that I can help you out as best as I know how.

        1. What time do you wake up, and what time do you try to eat breakfast?
        2. Are you planning your meals out, or counting calories/macros?
        3. What time do you eat your last meal before you go to bed?
        4. How do you feel, emotionally, while preparing breakfast, or after you've just eaten it?
        5. What is your schedule like during the day? Do you have to go out to work as soon as you're finished eating, or do you stay at home?
        6. Are you restricting and depriving yourself of cravings (if you're having them) or trying to eat strictly in a certain way?

        There are so many reasons why you may feel so hungry right after breakfast. I, personally, went through the same thing. During active recovery, I was obviously obsessed with food -- but I was allowing myself to actually eat it! I did still try to plan out meals, but in no way did I count calories. I ate what I liked, as long as it was nutrient-dense, and allowed plenty of treats in between meals. Honestly, maybe you need the calories. I'm going to say that if you physically feel hungry, you do need food. Whenever you get back to me on all those questions I asked, I'll have better insight and try to give you more adequate advice!

        Listen to your body, it really knows best. I know, easier said than done. It can be scary! But we're all here to support you.
        Thanks Cierra, I would appreciate your input as I know you have good experience.

        1.I wake at 4.45am so I can have time to journal and do my recovery readings and meditation before my children wake up around 5.30-6.00am. I try to have breakfast with them at about 7am. When I don't eat I still sit with them and drink coffee.
        2. I vaguely plan my meals in terms of what there is in the fridge and if I need to go to the shops. Otherwise I try not to plan as it increases the obsession. I do eat two nutritious and large meals, but large does include a lot of vegetables some days.
        3. We eat at about 6.30pm at night. I normally eat lunch which to my horror gives me a 19/5 window, I didn't realize I fasted for so long. That's really bad.
        4. I find mornings really stressful....fighting children, wet beds, laundry, homework etc. I do as much as I can the night before, but my children are still young (3 and 5) so a lot of attention and time is needed. Also cooking eggs 3 ways is a stress in itself! Sometimes when I do sit down to eat I'm already stressed out. But not always. Sometimes (recently) I feel fabulous after breakfast because I know I really needed the food and I feel full and vital. Sometimes I feel a it guilty and ask myself whether I could have done without it.
        5. My schedule is non-stop. I take my eldest to school then work through any appointments, cooking, housework etc. I go to the gym 3 mornings a week, fasting doesn't seem to affect my workout but recently I have felt quite depleted sometimes. Then I work as soon as my husband gets home, then as soon as I've done that I get the family dinner then the kids to bed then I crash at about 8.30. I like a schedule, I feel much better with a routine.
        6. I vacillate wildly (of course) between mindsets. So one day I might be recovery-tastic and launch into a mighty breakfast and eat all day and not worry. But the next day I might panic and try to restrict. I am definitely making efforts to listen to cravings, which is where my smoothie obsession is coming from. Other days I deny all hunger signals and only allow myself meals. Other days I get so hungry a biscuit feeding frenzy occurs, then the restricting cycle starts all over again. I've increased carbs recently too, some rice and potato and sweet potato, but then I panic with this too and think I'm going to fail and die as a sugar-burner.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by sopnishwhite
          Breakfast is highly important for your daily lifestyle. First of all it curbs your hunger and keeps you healthy and fit.
          No, it really, really does not. That is why I opened the thread.

          Comment


          • #20
            Well, that adds a bit more detail to the picture.
            Agreed IF is out of the picture at the moment, it might be something you drift into down the track, but with your current condition it isn't likely to be beneficial.

            Sounds very much like you just need to eat more nutritious food, try to stick to good healthy primal foods, don't restrict, even if you need to snack, as YogaBear said, you may gain a little in the process, but likely this is what your body needs.

            Your body needs to feel that it is not in a starvation situation and the only way to do that is give it food when it wants food, the cravings and snacking will subside and you will be able to settle into a comfortable 3 meal routine with just the occassional snack.
            You need to trust your body and your body will trust you.
            Personally I would stay away from smoothies, they go down too easy and don't fill you up physically, better to do the real thing and chew food and chew it well, spend time savouring the flavours.

            There is another factor likely at play too and that is when people generally switch to Primal, you drop quite a bit of "quick fix sugar" from processed foods, so there is likely a blood sugar/insulin adjustment that takes place in the first month or two, most people find there is a greater urge for craving at this time, for that I found nuts & seeds are good, they provide some slow release carbs which help minimise insulin spiking while your body adjusts.

            So IMO for a good month you just need to let go and trust, eat as you need to, don't fight it, even the idea of enforcing a three meal regimen at this point will be counter productive, and as the ladies said on the "Women who eat a ton" thread, so what if you gain a bit of weight, if you don't feel better you can always go back to the Yo-yo dieting you know so well, but I dare say that won't be the case, more likely you'll realise that there is only a few lb's/kg's difference between constant craving and comfortable satiety, but you do have to take a leap of faith and trust your body.
            Last edited by Omni; 05-18-2013, 01:11 AM.
            "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by VacillateWildly View Post
              I'm craving dairy, hence all the smoothies, I'd had one to two a day for the last 10 days. I've started eating fruit too, I only buy seasonal stuff, so there are always at the moment pears and persimmons and frozen berries. I find fruit quite unappealing in winter but these ones I do like. When I binge I either pick at primal food in the fridge and then overeat my evening meal (at which point I'm not hungry, but eat anyway as an act of self-sabotage. Or I hit the Fuck It switch and eat whole packets of highly processed choc chip cookies and oat bars. I eat liver at least once a week, but I'm not sure I could eat pate like cake, my ED head would be screaming at me.
              I'm not an expert, but if you're binging on chocolate chip cookies then my guess is that you've got a nutritional need which isn't being met. As soon as I went into active recovery and started eating as much as I wanted of nutritious food, the desire to binge on junk vanished. But I did overeat quite a bit during my recovery, and I know you want to avoid that.

              I do have a few suggestions:

              - A different kind of breakfast. Eggs don't do anything for me if I eat them everyday. If I have them I usually eat a banana (or two) at the same time and it helps to balance the macros. Another poster suggested having leftovers - this worked quite well for me. And I still think it's worth having liver for breakfast.

              - Have you tried Primmeal? It's warm and comforting - just like porridge! http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread81549.html

              - I also recommend the banana and egg pancakes: they taste great and you feel like you're treating yourself. Plus they can be really filling. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread78722.html

              - About Dairy. I know there is endless debate about dairy, and after my experiences I'm a bit iffy about it. I think it can have a weirdly addictive quality for some people - it did for me, and I read about other people who had this. Apparently dairy targets the opiate receptors in the brain (so do nuts). So maybe you're craving it for that kick. Could you have coconut milk instead? I ate a ton of coconut milk to get me off the greek yogurt, and I feel better for it. THe dairy wasn't satiating me.

              - I think Omni makes some great points in his above post. I gradually cycled into eating six meals a day for that period, and it was definitely the turning point for me. It was less of a stressor on my system, and it helped with a lot of my neurosis around eating.

              - I also agree about the smoothies: could you try fruit with coconut milk instead? You could add nutmeg or cinnamon for flavour. One one thing I enjoy, is coconut milk, banana and salt! WEird but good.

              - Finally, I wonder if eating such a big breakfast is psychologically setting you up for a fall? I know some people here eat 6+ eggs, but personally I think more than four is quite a lot. I usually eat 2-3, and as you know I don't restrict at all. More than that makes me feel funny and bloated. I wonder about the hormonal impact of eating eggs as well....
              Anyway, you said you're eating it cos you're trying to recover: maybe the conscious effort is resulting in you ignoring your body's signals, and eating more than you want? That could be stressing your body (and hence your mind) which interprets the unwanted food as a binge? Just a theory...

              Try the Primmeal - it would be a more reasonable portion size and that might help you. You also wouldn't have to cook it, which would help reduce stress a bit
              Last edited by YogaBare; 05-18-2013, 02:22 AM.
              "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

              In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

              - Ray Peat

              Comment


              • #22
                i think you need to read more about what mark says about cravings. This has helped me the most out of all I've learned. I've listed those blog posts that really helped me understand the problems my body was having. I really would emphasise reading stuff on the blog. Using marks advice i rarely listen to a carb craving unless its for a veg, im very careful with a a sugar craving including fruit( i check my blood sugar for visual reinforcement even though i know signs of a hypo arent craving sugars!) and if its a junk food craving i just eat a primal similar. I eat my fruit and never juice it; Mark is right about the difference in sugar spikes-juice is extreme and disturbs my blood sugar for hours
                8 Reasons Why You Make Bad Food Choices | Mark's Daily Apple
                When Listening to Your Body Doesn't Work | Mark's Daily Apple
                Common Stumbling Blocks on New Diet | Mark's Daily Apple
                How to Dog Whisper Your Food Cravings | Mark's Daily Apple
                Dear Mark: Sugar Cravings | Mark's Daily Apple
                The Low Down on Hunger: Health, Hankerings and Habits | Mark's Daily Apple
                What Does it Mean to Be Fat-Adapted? | Mark's Daily Apple
                5 Tips to Avoid Temptation | Mark's Daily Apple
                use the search facility on the blog, There is something useful about every issue. search for you weak spots (and your strengths so you can maximise them.
                I keep in mind now if the tummy inst rumbling i'm not actually hungry i just want to eat. Then I ask myself is there a good reason I should eat and sometimes there are and sometimes there aren't.....
                When I'd had enough of the grain and starched based 'diabetic eating for health' diet (eating for health, my ass!) my weight was 242.5 lbs. On starting primal- 18th April 2013 weight : 238.1.
                27th July 2013. weight after 100 days 136.9 weight lost 101.2lb ; that's 105.6lbs since I stopped the 'diabetic eating for health'
                new journal http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...ml#post1264082

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Omni View Post
                  Personally I would stay away from smoothies, they go down too easy and don't fill you up physically, better to do the real thing and chew food and chew it well, spend time savouring the flavours.

                  There is another factor likely at play too and that is when people generally switch to Primal, you drop quite a bit of "quick fix sugar" from processed foods, so there is likely a blood sugar/insulin adjustment that takes place in the first month or two, most people find there is a greater urge for craving at this time, for that I found nuts & seeds are good, they provide some slow release carbs which help minimise insulin spiking while your body adjusts.

                  So IMO for a good month you just need to let go and trust, eat as you need to, don't fight it, even the idea of enforcing a three meal regimen at this point will be counter productive, and as the ladies said on the "Women who eat a ton" thread, so what if you gain a bit of weight, if you don't feel better you can always go back to the Yo-yo dieting you know so well, but I dare say that won't be the case, more likely you'll realise that there is only a few lb's/kg's difference between constant craving and comfortable satiety, but you do have to take a leap of faith and trust your body.
                  Thanks for your thoughts Omni. The thing with the smoothies is that I'm trying to listen to my body, and this is what it says I need. I actually like the drinking of the food rather than eating it, it feels safer and more nourishing and nurturing than snacking on seeds and nuts. Nuts are actually a binge food trigger so I try to avoid them. Also, I've never been a yo-yo dieter but have always struggled with giving my body the things it needs and have maintained a low body weight now for well over 2 years. I have had episodes of being underweight before, but never this sustained. I've been primal for 18 months, so my body is fat adapted that is for certain. I only have processed food on a crazed binge, perhaps every 2 or 3 weeks, sometimes much less often.

                  I know in my heart that you and YB are right. I am not going to explode into a blimp from giving myself the calories I need. I am not a fat person, I never have been a fat person, nobody in my family is a fat person. But I do need to trust, and it feels like a terrifying leap of faith.

                  Originally posted by YogaBare View Post

                  I do have a few suggestions:

                  - A different kind of breakfast. Eggs don't do anything for me if I eat them everyday. If I have them I usually eat a banana (or two) at the same time and it helps to balance the macros. Another poster suggested having leftovers - this worked quite well for me. And I still think it's worth having liver for breakfast.

                  - Have you tried Primmeal? It's warm and comforting - just like porridge! http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread81549.html

                  - I also recommend the banana and egg pancakes: they taste great and you feel like you're treating yourself. Plus they can be really filling. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread78722.html

                  - About Dairy. I know there is endless debate about dairy, and after my experiences I'm a bit iffy about it. I think it can have a weirdly addictive quality for some people - it did for me, and I read about other people who had this. Apparently dairy targets the opiate receptors in the brain (so do nuts). So maybe you're craving it for that kick. Could you have coconut milk instead? I ate a ton of coconut milk to get me off the greek yogurt, and I feel better for it. THe dairy wasn't satiating me.

                  - I also agree about the smoothies: could you try fruit with coconut milk instead? You could add nutmeg or cinnamon for flavour. One one thing I enjoy, is coconut milk, banana and salt! WEird but good.

                  - Finally, I wonder if eating such a big breakfast is psychologically setting you up for a fall? I know some people here eat 6+ eggs, but personally I think more than four is quite a lot. I usually eat 2-3, and as you know I don't restrict at all. More than that makes me feel funny and bloated. I wonder about the hormonal impact of eating eggs as well....
                  Anyway, you said you're eating it cos you're trying to recover: maybe the conscious effort is resulting in you ignoring your body's signals, and eating more than you want? That could be stressing your body (and hence your mind) which interprets the unwanted food as a binge? Just a theory...
                  Thanks YB. The primeal is scheduled in for tomorrow

                  The smoothies are a surprise to me, I hate milk, but this is what my body wants. They are causing digestive problems though and as I hardly consume any dairy except a splash of milk in my tea, this is a bit of a shock to my body! Coconut milk doesn't have the same appeal. For now, I'm going to continue with the smoothies, it's the best listening I can do for now. I think it's the sugar I'm after, and the fat from the milk and yoghurt. I like the cold, the texture, they are heavenly and I'm enjoying them and this is a good thing.

                  I think your theory about mind/body and fullness of spot on. This is what makes it so difficult, this is really muddy waters to negotiate as it involves so much more than simply nutrition, as you know.

                  Today it is 11.40am and I have had 3 breakfasts. Large breakfasts. (I have been up since 4.15am if that makes any difference) Now my head is racing at the thought of restricting the rest of the day. Mind body struggle, I feel like a push-me pull-me.

                  Eggs are my favourite food in the whole world. I crave them and eat them every day at some point. What makes you say that about hormones? We have farm pasture fed eggs from the farmer, all different sized with poo and feathers on the shells, love them. I tried just 2 eggs - starving. 3 eggs - starving. 4 eggs - fucking starving. 5 -eggs still starving. I increased the breakfast size to try and cancel out the ensuing hunger. I'm still not sure how much I would need to be full. 2 or 3 eggs seems like a waste of time, I'd rather go without. (Do you spot an addictive all or nothing mentality going on here?)

                  Originally posted by CarbDodger View Post
                  i think you need to read more about what mark says about cravings. This has helped me the most out of all I've learned. I've listed those blog posts that really helped me understand the problems my body was having. I really would emphasise reading stuff on the blog. Using marks advice i rarely listen to a carb craving unless its for a veg, im very careful with a a sugar craving including fruit( i check my blood sugar for visual reinforcement even though i know signs of a hypo arent craving sugars!) and if its a junk food craving i just eat a primal similar. I eat my fruit and never juice it; Mark is right about the difference in sugar spikes-juice is extreme and disturbs my blood sugar for hours
                  8 Reasons Why You Make Bad Food Choices | Mark's Daily Apple
                  When Listening to Your Body Doesn't Work | Mark's Daily Apple
                  Common Stumbling Blocks on New Diet | Mark's Daily Apple
                  How to Dog Whisper Your Food Cravings | Mark's Daily Apple
                  Dear Mark: Sugar Cravings | Mark's Daily Apple
                  The Low Down on Hunger: Health, Hankerings and Habits | Mark's Daily Apple
                  What Does it Mean to Be Fat-Adapted? | Mark's Daily Apple
                  5 Tips to Avoid Temptation | Mark's Daily Apple
                  use the search facility on the blog, There is something useful about every issue. search for you weak spots (and your strengths so you can maximise them.
                  I keep in mind now if the tummy inst rumbling i'm not actually hungry i just want to eat. Then I ask myself is there a good reason I should eat and sometimes there are and sometimes there aren't.....
                  Thank you Carbdodger for finding those links. The thing is with restricting though that there is more danger in fighting the cravings as it keeps me in the mindset. I often don't know if I'm hungry or not. My signals with my body are so wrecked that I don't even know if I'm ill or not sometimes and have to wait till the symptoms are all pervasive before I even recognize that I'm unwell. I don't crave junk food, but biscuits are a weakness, I like the crunch. When I'm feeling stable and ok with food I would never have them, they seem to be a self-sabotage food, I don't even know if there's a craving involved with them, more just a though and a way to hurt myself.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by RichardCook
                    What about your weight is it drastically increasing due this food fobia or no problem with weight at all?If there is no issue with weight then no need to bother about your heavy diet habbit.Do Yoga or regular excersice for maintaining the weight.
                    Ummm....I have no food phobias at all. I have a restrictive eating disorder called anorexia, it's a mental illness based around food. I'm not scared of food, but I do have an unhealthy relationship with it. I would love to not bother with my heavy diet habit, thanks for the advice. And although you didn't ask, I already do plenty of regular exercise.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by VacillateWildly View Post
                      I know in my heart that you and YB are right. I am not going to explode into a blimp from giving myself the calories I need. I am not a fat person, I never have been a fat person, nobody in my family is a fat person. But I do need to trust, and it feels like a terrifying leap of faith.

                      Thanks YB. The primeal is scheduled in for tomorrow

                      The smoothies are a surprise to me, I hate milk, but this is what my body wants. They are causing digestive problems though and as I hardly consume any dairy except a splash of milk in my tea, this is a bit of a shock to my body! Coconut milk doesn't have the same appeal. For now, I'm going to continue with the smoothies, it's the best listening I can do for now. I think it's the sugar I'm after, and the fat from the milk and yoghurt. I like the cold, the texture, they are heavenly and I'm enjoying them and this is a good thing.

                      I think your theory about mind/body and fullness of spot on. This is what makes it so difficult, this is really muddy waters to negotiate as it involves so much more than simply nutrition, as you know.

                      Today it is 11.40am and I have had 3 breakfasts. Large breakfasts. (I have been up since 4.15am if that makes any difference) Now my head is racing at the thought of restricting the rest of the day. Mind body struggle, I feel like a push-me pull-me.

                      Eggs are my favourite food in the whole world. I crave them and eat them every day at some point. What makes you say that about hormones? We have farm pasture fed eggs from the farmer, all different sized with poo and feathers on the shells, love them. I tried just 2 eggs - starving. 3 eggs - starving. 4 eggs - fucking starving. 5 -eggs still starving. I increased the breakfast size to try and cancel out the ensuing hunger. I'm still not sure how much I would need to be full. 2 or 3 eggs seems like a waste of time, I'd rather go without. (Do you spot an addictive all or nothing mentality going on here?)
                      I'm glad the theory resonates Looking forward to seeing how you like the Primmeal!

                      Maybe I wasn't clear about the eggs. I love eggs, but I don't find them filling. They hit a spot, but they never give me a "full" feeling: unless I have cheese, or veggies with them. If you really want to eat eggs, maybe try an omelette? So no, I don't think this is an all-or-nothing mentality: it's normal to want to be satiated and filled by the food you eat! Forget what I said about hormones: it's a theory I'm working on

                      It's good that you're listening to your body, and if you love the smoothies then go with it. I do think it's worth trying the coconut milk one day, whenever you're ready. I didn't think it would, but it hit the exact same spot for me as dairy. But overall, just eat what you like.

                      Re. crunch: one food that helped me a lot was raw carrots! If I got impatient for dinner while I was cooking I'd start chowing down on them. They take a while to eat and have bite, so they are fulfilling to eat. I used to go for apples, but carrots did a much better job and quelling that anxiety that made me search for the crunch.
                      "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                      In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                      - Ray Peat

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