Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Americans Getting Shorter

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
    Please see: Electronic Benefit Transfer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    "State agencies work with contractors to procure their own EBT systems for delivery of SNAP and other state-administered benefit programs." EBT level of benefits are determined by each state. SNAP is Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program. Note the word "Supplemental". States choose the benefit level they want to supplement and this is determined for each receipent. Supplemental means to supplement, not to completely replace.
    Some states provide 50% of estimated food cost. Some provide a lot less. You're right that in either case, even when a person legitimately has no other income-maybe they are 100% disabled and can't work-they are expected to somehow come up with the money themselves to pay for the remainder of the cost of a crappy diet. Or starve.

    EBT benefits include both food and cash. See EXCLUSIVE: Welfare recipients using EBT cards to get cash at strip clubs, X-rated video stores and bars - NYPOST.com. The cash received by a recipient can be used for any purpose including but not limited to food. If the cash is being used for the referenced purposes (also for cruises and hotels) the recipients are clearly making the choice not to spend it on food.
    EBT benefits do NOT include both food and cash. Don't you understand the difference between EBT and TANF and how they are administered? This looks like a problem in NY. Probably you should talk to your legislators about that.

    Comment


    • #17
      My wife works at a NJ supermarket. There is a very steady stream of the "underprivileged" who use the various forms of public assistance programs. Believe me, they know every trick in the book to circumvent any roadblocks these systems have. Want cash? No problem - "buy" a cart load of food and then immediately wheel it around to the courtesy counter for a cash "refund". From there it's booze, cigarettes etc. And yes, our so-called legislators are well aware of it, they just don't give a crap. My wife says she watches in disbelief as many of these "underprivileged" drive away in high-end cars like BMW's. She gets to see this week after week, year after year, for many many years now.

      Comment


      • #18
        I grew up on food stamps; I was pretty sure you could only refund it to the card (similar to any other debit).

        Flew the coop, never wanted to apply for them ever. Now I don't have to, because I'm actually starting a career that'll allow me to afford actual food. I have also restructured how I wish to spend money.

        M.

        Comment


        • #19
          If you show up to a customer service desk without a receipt, many times you are refunded in "cash" in the form of a gift card that only works at that store.

          In many cases, stores that sell groceries also sell booze and cigarettes.

          People will go through lengths to save a few dollars. Once a gentleman came into the store and saw that a barbecue he had purchased earlier in the year was on sale. He was past the 30 day price guarentee, but still within the 90 day return policy. What he did was purchase a new barbecue at the sale price, wheel it over to the return desk, and return it with the reciept he had for the same barbecue he purchased at full price a couple months earlier. Clever? Yes. Worth saving 10 bucks? Not for me.

          (I spent 5 1/2 years working in the grocery industry--I've seen it all)
          Stumbled into Primal due to food allergies, and subsequent elimination of non-primal foods.

          Start Gluten-Free/Soy-Free: December 2012; start weight 158lbs, Ladies size 6
          Start Primal: March 2013, start weight 150lbs, Ladies size 6
          Current: 132lbs, Ladies size 2
          F/23/5'9"

          26lbs lost since cutting the crap.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by JWBooth View Post
            It is possible, but your story doesn't really shed any light on the issue. My guess is that the height of white Americans is consistent with that of Europeans. "Americans" are getting shorter on average only because of the waves of diminutive mestizo immigrants from Mexico and the rest of Latin America. Mestizos and Latin American Indians are just short people. Add them to Denmark in the numbers we have here and the average height of "Danes" would go down too. Unless you find a study saying whites of Northern European descent are getting shorter, there is really nothing to support what you are saying.
            I'm not saying, claiming or selling anything...just asking interesting questions.

            It wouldn't surprise me if Americans started getting shorter...specifically from their diet (not immigration). But then again it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't lose height but instead gained width and lost strength.

            It could be that while their diet is crap, it contains enough protein/fat vitamins/minerals so as not to trigger vertical shrinkage, but surplus sugar/carbs to trigger horizontal expansion. Guess we have to give it a few hundred years and check back.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by kathleen View Post
              People will go through lengths to save a few dollars. Once a gentleman came into the store and saw that a barbecue he had purchased earlier in the year was on sale. He was past the 30 day price guarentee, but still within the 90 day return policy. What he did was purchase a new barbecue at the sale price, wheel it over to the return desk, and return it with the reciept he had for the same barbecue he purchased at full price a couple months earlier. Clever? Yes. Worth saving 10 bucks? Not for me.
              I wonder if this isn't a big part of the health problem in the states. People are obsessed with getting "deals" (the largest quantity for the least bucks), and they apply this to food! Hmm I can get a huge bag of chips, or a tiny organic bell pepper, well of course the chips is the clever smart shopper deal! Supply follows demand and the corporations keep trying to get the price down for the consumer while lowering the quality of the food.

              But wait dammit, we are shrinking, was it worth it?

              Comment


              • #22
                They don't seem to factor in race though. Asians and Hispanics tend to be shorter on average and their populations in the U.S are increasing every year. I think they need to make sure they're accounting for that when calculating these statistics.

                Comment


                • #23
                  I agree with Jorjor but on the other hand I would say that white Americans are definitely shorter than northern Europeans on average anyway just based upon personal observation.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
                    Doesn't he know all our poorer have more than sufficient EBT cards.
                    $200/month for a single person doesn't buy a lot of grass fed beef or pastured eggs. Could you really do primal without CAFO meats and farmed fish on $50/week?
                    "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                    B*tch-lite

                    Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Geeknik View Post
                      I agree with Jorjor but on the other hand I would say that white Americans are definitely shorter than northern Europeans on average anyway just based upon personal observation.
                      According to Wikipedia, the average height for US Whites is 5 feet 10 and a half inches, for blacks it is 5 feet 10 inches, and for Mexicans it is 5 feet 7. The Northern European countries all fall in between 5 feet 10 and 6 feet even. So not much difference at all, and when you consider that "white" in the American context includes Southern and Eastern Europe as well the difference probably disappears altogether.

                      Comparing the heights of people in Maine now vs fifty or a hundred years ago (if the data stretches back that far) would probably be a good proxy for the true direction of American height.

                      Originally posted by JoanieL View Post
                      $200/month for a single person doesn't buy a lot of grass fed beef or pastured eggs. Could you really do primal without CAFO meats and farmed fish on $50/week?
                      4 Grass Fed Calf Livers at Whole Foods: $10
                      4 cans of Sardines $10
                      1lb Grass Fed Beef $7
                      12 Pastured Eggs from Whole Foods $6

                      And you still have $17 left over for Frozen Veggies, Garlic, Onions, butter, white rice or potatoes, and maybe a piece of fruit or something. Wouldn't live like a King, but doable. And supplementing that with just $10 of your own money each week (it is after all supposed to be "supplemental" food assistance) would give you breathing room to be a bit more creative.
                      Last edited by JWBooth; 04-25-2013, 10:56 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by JWBooth View Post
                        According to Wikipedia, the average height for US Whites is 5 feet 10 and a half inches, for blacks it is 5 feet 10 inches, and for Mexicans it is 5 feet 7. The Northern European countries all fall in between 5 feet 10 and 6 feet even. So not much difference at all, and when you consider that "white" in the American context includes Southern and Eastern Europe as well the difference probably disappears altogether.
                        A two inch difference in height is actually pretty significant. Even more so since most Americans are carrying around more weight on that shorter frame than their northern European counterparts.
                        Last edited by Geeknik; 04-26-2013, 07:24 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Height has to be taken in context of nutritional status of that nation though. There are factors that both increase height and reduce health.

                          Mark did a post where he states that "Staffan Lindeberg thinks that excessive serum levels of IGF-1 from diet-induced hyperinsulinemia are causing unhealthy amounts of growth, which manifest as higher rates of cancer and, yes, height, in Western populations. Simply put, Lindeberg agrees that a population’s height is an indicator of health, but only to a point, after which it indicates excessive and potentially problematic levels of IGF-1."

                          Now I don't believe that our reduced stature would be from actually rectifying what Lindeberg theorized on IGF-1... far from it, but its worth taking all factors into account.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by JWBooth View Post
                            According to Wikipedia, the average height for US Whites is 5 feet 10 and a half inches, for blacks it is 5 feet 10 inches, and for Mexicans it is 5 feet 7. The Northern European countries all fall in between 5 feet 10 and 6 feet even. So not much difference at all, and when you consider that "white" in the American context includes Southern and Eastern Europe as well the difference probably disappears altogether.

                            Comparing the heights of people in Maine now vs fifty or a hundred years ago (if the data stretches back that far) would probably be a good proxy for the true direction of American height.



                            4 Grass Fed Calf Livers at Whole Foods: $10
                            4 cans of Sardines $10
                            1lb Grass Fed Beef $7
                            12 Pastured Eggs from Whole Foods $6

                            And you still have $17 left over for Frozen Veggies, Garlic, Onions, butter, white rice or potatoes, and maybe a piece of fruit or something. Wouldn't live like a King, but doable. And supplementing that with just $10 of your own money each week (it is after all supposed to be "supplemental" food assistance) would give you breathing room to be a bit more creative.
                            That's good. Thank you!

                            If the macros were good, all you'd have to do is add rice or potatoes for filler. How many pounds does the calf liver weigh?

                            As a note, protein powder is considered food now and can be purchased with EBT. I think some brands are cheap enough that grams of protein/dollar are relatively inexpensive compared to meat/eggs.

                            However, in general, I agree with the idea that we're creating a two class health culture. It's always existed of course. The affluent have always had access to better healthcare and nutrition. It just seems so much more blatant now with 15% of the country on food stamps, and many people working with no accesss to affordable health insurance.

                            In addition, we're trained to budget shop. I'm guessing if one goes to Whole Foods and buys those foods paying with EBT, eyebrows are raised by others because said shopper isn't eating Walmart junk. It's no excuse, just a cultural thing.
                            "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                            B*tch-lite

                            Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            X