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  • #61
    Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
    So believing that the likelihood of there being a God is so infinitesimally small as to render it negligible falls into which category for you?
    It depends how militant you are about that belief. That would determine how negligible it really was.

    Agnostics can sway more one way than the other, but generally they're open to new ideas. Atheists have made up their minds and have total conviction it's the truth.
    Last edited by YogaBare; 03-29-2013, 01:24 PM.
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

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    • #62
      Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
      It depends how militant you are about that belief. That would determine how negligible it really was.

      Agnostics can sway more one way than the other, but generally they're open to new ideas. Atheists have made up their minds and have total conviction it's the truth.
      It depends on how militant I am about the manner in which probability is assessed? If you started with a decimal point, and let me type 0's for the rest of my life, and a "1" on my death bed, it would be many orders of magnitude larger than the probability of all-powerful God/s having created the universe. If I'm not an atheist, nobody is. And in REAL life, most educated people are. It's just social (or political) suicide to say so.
      The Champagne of Beards

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      • #63
        Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
        It depends on how militant I am about the manner in which probability is assessed? If you started with a decimal point, and let me type 0's for the rest of my life, and a "1" on my death bed, it would be many orders of magnitude larger than the probability of all-powerful God/s having created the universe. If I'm not an atheist, nobody is. And in REAL life, most educated people are. It's just social (or political) suicide to say so.
        Well, "God" means a lot of different things, so I'm not going to argue with you about the existence of whatever God you don't believe in Ha, I'm kidding.

        Btw, it's only in America that it's social suicide to say you're atheist. I was shocked when I heard that actually, because over here it's totally accepted as a belief system and people even have atheist funerals. I come from Ireland - regarded as a massively religious country, but probably 1% of my friends believe in a catholic god. The rest of them are atheist or spiritual in their own way.

        I've told my parents already that I don't want the Catholic burial etc. They finally accepted it... and it only took 15 years!
        "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

        In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

        - Ray Peat

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
          So believing that the likelihood of there being a God is so infinitesimally small as to render it negligible falls into which category for you? Because that's how I feel and I am an atheist zealot, unlike the billions of silent atheists in the world who Derpamix has never met.
          See how atheists contradict themselves every turn? The very act of being an atheist is being anti-theist, which is the militant opposition of belief in deities, ergo zealotry. I don't have believe in anything I can't prove either, but I don't assign an abstract definition to myself because I'd rather not belong to any particular group in order to define myself as a person.
          Make America Great Again

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          • #65
            Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
            Btw, it's only in America that it's social suicide to say you're atheist. I was shocked when I heard that actually, because over here it's totally accepted as a belief system and people even have atheist funerals. I come from Ireland - regarded as a massively religious country, but probably 1% of my friends believe in a catholic god. The rest of them are atheist or spiritual in their own way.

            I've told my parents already that I don't want the Catholic burial etc. They finally accepted it... and it only took 15 years!
            Yeah, it's odd that people are bugged out by and choose not to identify with the idea of atheism despite not believing in any God they've ever been presented with. We don't feel uncomfortable not believing in the Easter Bunny or Tarot Cards/Crystal Balls, but to admit that Omnipotent Sky Gods are ridiculous postulations made by people far less technologically and scientifically advanced than we are is somehow akin to saying you practice bestiality.
            The Champagne of Beards

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            • #66
              Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
              See how atheists contradict themselves every turn? The very act of being an atheist is being anti-theist, which is the militant opposition of belief in deities, ergo zealotry. I don't have believe in anything I can't prove either, but I don't assign an abstract definition to myself because I'd rather not belong to any particular group in order to define myself as a person.
              Not believing in something =/= militantly opposing it. Your logic doesn't follow at all. I, for one, am sick of the term "atheist" being imbued with a negative connotation. It honestly shouldn't even have a word. I'm also an a-Santa Claus-ist and an a-Tooth Fairy-ist and an a-horoscope-ist.

              Then again, if people were trying to make policy or convince me to change my diet based on a horoscope or the gospel word of the Tooth Fairy, I'd probably be pretty militantly opposed to those things as well.
              The Champagne of Beards

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              • #67
                Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
                Not believing in something =/= militantly opposing it. Your logic doesn't follow at all. I, for one, am sick of the term "atheist" being imbued with a negative connotation. It honestly shouldn't even have a word. I'm also an a-Santa Claus-ist and an a-Tooth Fairy-ist and an a-horoscope-ist.

                Then again, if people were trying to make policy or convince me to change my diet based on a horoscope or the gospel word of the Tooth Fairy, I'd probably be pretty militantly opposed to those things as well.
                When you brand yourself "atheist", or anything at all, you instantly inherit all connotations associated with it because in order to label yourself a particular thing you have to actively believe(lel) in it. That's how it works.

                I agree with the second part.
                Make America Great Again

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                  When you brand yourself "atheist", or anything at all, you instantly inherit all connotations associated with it because in order to label yourself a particular thing you have to actively believe(lel) in it. That's how it works.

                  I agree with the second part.
                  Except that the thing I'm labeling myself as represents an absence of a characteristic. But yeah, we're pretty much arguing for the sake of it at this point. I would love for prominent thinkers and politicians to be able to "come out" as atheists without fear of retribution, but we're not so enlightened as we like to believe.
                  The Champagne of Beards

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                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                    When you brand yourself "atheist", or anything at all, you instantly inherit all connotations associated with it because in order to label yourself a particular thing you have to actively believe(lel) in it. That's how it works.
                    This is how I feel about organised religion and the abuse scandals, but I am told it is only a few bad apples, which I find unacceptable.
                    Life. Be in it.

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
                      Except that the thing I'm labeling myself as represents an absence of a characteristic. But yeah, we're pretty much arguing for the sake of it at this point. I would love for prominent thinkers and politicians to be able to "come out" as atheists without fear of retribution, but we're not so enlightened as we like to believe.
                      That won't happen because politics is still run by religion, and in essence is a form of organized religion. In order to be a politician you have to sell your freedom of thought(if there was any in the first place, after all they got there by following along in the first place) and become artificially perverted.

                      "Intelligent persons, provided they have not been artificially perverted, have certain ways of thinking and reacting, while unintelligent persons have other ways. Existentialism has achieved the tour de force or the monstrous contortion of representing the commonest stupidity as intelligence and disguising it as philosophy, and of holding intelligence up to ridicule, that of all intelligent men of all times."
                      Make America Great Again

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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Belforte View Post
                        This is how I feel about organised religion and the abuse scandals, but I am told it is only a few bad apples, which I find unacceptable.
                        You'd be appalled to find the extent of covering up that goes on in all things.
                        Make America Great Again

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                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                          You'd be appalled to find the extent of covering up that goes on in all things.
                          I know that post wasn't addressed to me, but I've lived too long to be appalled. Just sad. Disappointed in my species.

                          As to atheism, I've been atheist for about 30 years. I won't share the epiphany I had, but I remember it clearly. Since (depending on the source) about 90% of the population of the earth believe in a sentient creator, I rarely take an active part in discussing whether or not he/she/it exists.

                          But screw with my belief in Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny, and I'll claw your eyes out, Mister.
                          "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                          B*tch-lite

                          Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                            It depends how militant you are about that belief. That would determine how negligible it really was.

                            Agnostics can sway more one way than the other, but generally they're open to new ideas. Atheists have made up their minds and have total conviction it's the truth.
                            I'm an atheist and as soon as proof of some "God" is put forth by those claiming there is one my mind will be all kinds of open. Until then I will continue to not believe in the existence of any imaginary being including the Easter bunny, Santa Claus, Vishnu, or the Judeo Christian version of God.

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                            • #74
                              Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                              That won't happen because politics is still run by religion, and in essence is a form of organized religion.
                              Yes, especially in places like Iran, Saudi Arabia and in the USA! But less in Nothern Europe, Canada and South-America...
                              "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                              - Schopenhauer

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                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                                The very act of being an atheist is being anti-theist, which is the militant opposition of belief in deities, ergo zealotry.
                                Gotta call you on the terminology there, Derp. When the "a" prefix is in front of a word, it just means "without", e.g. asymptomatic or acellular. Someone who is asymptomatic is not militantly and vehemently opposed to symptoms, they just don't have any.

                                Atheism is just living your life *without* theism i.e. without a belief in god/gods. It does not imply opposition to anything, just the absence of it.
                                Last edited by Paleobird; 03-29-2013, 04:07 PM.

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