Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Re-Feed (Carb Loading) Before or After IF?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Re-Feed (Carb Loading) Before or After IF?

    I have been doing a 38 hour IF 1x each week and have tried the carb loading as well 1x per week. I have read a few different opinions on the forums regarding when to carb load in relation to the IF. Would it be best to carb load the day before or after the IF? Also is it correct to not workout on carb loading days? I just want to ensure I do this properly and get the most out of the IF and carb load.

  • #2
    Well if you do a 38 hour fast, ghrelin is going to be up (reacts with the same areas of brain as leptin), so that will bring leptin down. And on top of that, cortisol will be a little higher, making you a little more leptin resistant. It wouldn't be wise to do the fast after a re-feed, it'd be better to do it before, then re-feed.

    I actually think fasting proceeding the re-feed will negate the hormonal benefits of the re-feed.
    sigpic
    In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Carb load on your biggest muscle days, i.e. legs, chest, back. Standard carb loading recommendations are 3-5 grams/lb body weight. Because the purpose of carb cycling is to manipulate hormones like leptin, ghrelin, and PYY this is the one day that you want to keep your fat intake low. Keep your protein high on your carb load day as well. So keep your protein high, drop your fat, and increase your carbs.

      Get most of your carbs from fruits, veggies, and yams. You can mix in some rice or pasta, but I'm not a big advocate of grains (obviously). BUT don't eat a lot of sugar -- it shouldn't be free reign on sugar.

      Choosing to fast either before or after is a personal preference, but if you keep your protein high and you've eaten a significant amount of calories on your carb day (which is likely), I'd choose to fast AFTER. That's what I prefer as well.

      Also, expect a rise in body weight of 2-5 lbs (10 lbs in rare cases). But don't fret, this will drop back to normal within a day or two OR you may have not increase in body weight (it's just water weight). Carb cycling draws water more water into the muscle so enjoy that full look. You'll likely pee a lot the day after a carb load as well.

      Hope this helps.
      http://sterlingadvice.blogspot.com
      http://teambeachbody.com/coachster
      sterlingpurdy@gmail.com

      Comment


      • #4
        ^^^ In regards to working out, don't workout during a re-feed. You either workout before or after, working out will kind of screw this process up by manipulating insulin sensitivity/resistance and thus leptin sensitivity/resistance.

        Pay attention to to that post, there will be a water gain! It'll go away.
        sigpic
        In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Now I see why I am confused...! I guess everyone has their own methods and ways of achieving their goals.

          EGYnutrition:
          It wouldn't be wise to do the fast after a re-feed, it'd be better to do it before, then re-feed....In regards to working out, don't workout during a re-feed
          -VS-
          Sterling
          if you keep your protein high and you've eaten a significant amount of calories on your carb day (which is likely), I'd choose to fast AFTER....Carb load on your biggest muscle days, i.e. legs, chest, back
          Last edited by kansascitysteve; 04-15-2010, 08:50 AM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Well Sterling didn't say workout during, he just said to do it on your biggest muscle day, so if you worked out, then did the re-feed, we would still be giving the same advice.

            As far as fasting after, you don't want leptin to drop that quickly after a re-feed, as the whole point is to raise leptin and up-regulate hormones such as TSH and Testosterone.
            sigpic
            In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

            Comment


            • #7
              Agreed on the 1st point.

              On the 2nd point, leptin doesn't drop that fast.

              Here's a small, but interesting study showing leptin levels over a 24-hour period of being a) underfed then overfed and b) overfed then underfed. They then crossed them over.

              https://acrobat.com/#d=ZPY44DT*jfUocEEneZFVtw

              I think that you are fine either way. If anything, fast before a refeed. Next time, refeed before a fast. Either way, you are going to be in a calorie deficit on either side of the refeed thereby representing the need for a refeed in the first place.

              Hope this helps.
              http://sterlingadvice.blogspot.com
              http://teambeachbody.com/coachster
              sterlingpurdy@gmail.com

              Comment


              • #8
                Can't seem to see it...

                I do know that leptin can drop rather quickly overnight due to lack of sleep.. I can actually feel that one the next day, but dietary tactics are by different mechanisms

                As far as dropping due to the fast, that's just an opinion based on my understanding. But as Sterling suggested, try both for yourself and do what works and feels best.
                sigpic
                In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Actually just came up, but correct me if Im wrong Sterling, but the underfed portion was only at 70 percent... We're talking 0 percent here right? Well after the last meal is digested at-least, so 8 hours into the fast we're talking 0 percent intake which might result in totally different leptin levels...

                  I still agree on the point above, try both and see how you feel, which one is easier, ect...
                  sigpic
                  In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Leptin levels in the study were still high in the overfed then underfed group at 24 hours. Even in drastic calorie deficits, leptin decreases only by 50% over a week's time.
                    http://sterlingadvice.blogspot.com
                    http://teambeachbody.com/coachster
                    sterlingpurdy@gmail.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Sterling View Post
                      Leptin levels in the study were still high in the overfed then underfed group at 24 hours. Even in drastic calorie deficits, leptin decreases only by 50% over a week's time.
                      and what about at 0 calories?
                      I didn't like the rules you gave me, so I made some of my own.

                      Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general. - Mark Rippetoe

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        On carb loading days, does it matter the quality of the carb (ie pasta vs fruit/veggie carbs)?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          By the way Sterling was right... takes close to 7 days for leptin to drop... unless we're talking sleep. You lose sleep, you'll feel the decreased leptin the enxt day.

                          On carb loading days it would be wise to avoid gluten and lactose depending on your sensitivity. Some people like to re-feed on only primal foods, others do it on all foods... your choice... experiment and see if there are adverse affects either way
                          sigpic
                          In Pursuit of Healthiness, Only to Achieve Happiness!: www.livingnotsurviving.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by federkeil View Post
                            and what about at 0 calories?
                            It would depend on how long you've had 0 calories.
                            http://sterlingadvice.blogspot.com
                            http://teambeachbody.com/coachster
                            sterlingpurdy@gmail.com

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by kansascitysteve View Post
                              On carb loading days, does it matter the quality of the carb (ie pasta vs fruit/veggie carbs)?
                              I like to stick with yams, fruits & veggies, and maybe one white potato. You could throw in a 1/4 cup of rice or a serving (56 grams dry) of pasta. You're probably limiting your refined sugar intake (eating primally) and I'd limit that (if any at all) on a carb refeed as well. HOWEVER, if you do choose to carb up on some 'crap' food then do it right after an intense workout of your largest muscles (legs/chest/back) AND keep fat intake below 50 grams. This will take advantage of the anabolic state that you are trying to capitalize on while raising leptin, decreasing ghrelin, etc.
                              http://sterlingadvice.blogspot.com
                              http://teambeachbody.com/coachster
                              sterlingpurdy@gmail.com

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X