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  • #91
    I think you are really doing a courageous thing. It makes so much sense. Please keep it up and let us know how it goes for you.

    It seems that we regularly have two giant things working against us:

    #1: Fear! Eating to satiety on nourishing wholesome foods and seeing weight increase is scary. Whenever I do this, it makes me want to restrict, defeating the purpose. Good for you for having the courage to resist this.

    #2: Unrealistic ideas of what a woman should look like. I stopped menstruating at 17%BF. That's not freaky low. But obviously it was too low for me. I still wasn't happy with how I looked and wanted to be leaner. Eff that.

    Thank you for sharing your experiences with us. Really, thank you!

    Comment


    • #92
      Leida,

      Which nutrients do you think are lacking in primal/paleo that other foods might provide?

      Kefir is certainly a special food that I think is beneficial to many, especially when homemade from raw milk. Raw dairy in general is my big exception to paleo foods. I have limited it in the *past* for myself due to calories but I think it provides a ton of nutrition and I make viili and kefir for my kids. I feel very lucky to have a 3 Jersey cow farm nearby that provides grass-fed raw milk.

      Black Currents- those are primal. If you can't find them in stores up there how about growing them? I'm in far north Idaho, if they grow here you might have a chance as well.

      I think that when moving away from a food source it might take awhile but the body will soon learn which new foods will provide the missing nutrients or compensate with more cravings for foods that may have been lower in that nutrient but still providing some.
      PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
      http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by qqemokitty View Post
        *biggest hugs*

        You are SO not alone with this. I've been so obsessed with food my whole life, I have no idea what it's like to NOT be planning my entire schedule around eating, not eating, will this involve food, won't it, etc etc.

        I am baffled and envious of people who are not constantly obsessing over food and eating. I cannot even imagine what it must be like, or what I might think about instead.
        All of this, me too! I am 62 and I've been obsessed since I got chubby when I was 7. I would have so much more mind space to enjoy life without this obsession.

        Comment


        • #94
          So today I was just going along my day and I thought about this thread and how I identified as someone who eats a ton. But then I realized that breakfast and lunch combined were a large skinless chicken breast and a sweet potato. That's not really a ton. I was on my way out to have some vegan dessert from the food co-op. Okay, now I eat a ton, right? Dinner was a chicken livers (3 livers) and one big giant goose egg (man those are great). A couple squares of chocolate and some wine. Is that a ton? Maybe not.
          Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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          • #95
            Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
            So today I was just going along my day and I thought about this thread and how I identified as someone who eats a ton. But then I realized that breakfast and lunch combined were a large skinless chicken breast and a sweet potato. That's not really a ton. I was on my way out to have some vegan dessert from the food co-op. Okay, now I eat a ton, right? Dinner was a chicken livers (3 livers) and one big giant goose egg (man those are great). A couple squares of chocolate and some wine. Is that a ton? Maybe not.
            Yeah, that's not even close to a ton
            PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
            http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

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            • #96
              Originally posted by calee View Post
              All of this, me too! I am 62 and I've been obsessed since I got chubby when I was 7. I would have so much more mind space to enjoy life without this obsession.
              Thank you both. It is always nice to not feel like the only one going through something. Hope we can all find our peace.
              PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                So today I was just going along my day and I thought about this thread and how I identified as someone who eats a ton. But then I realized that breakfast and lunch combined were a large skinless chicken breast and a sweet potato. That's not really a ton. I was on my way out to have some vegan dessert from the food co-op. Okay, now I eat a ton, right? Dinner was a chicken livers (3 livers) and one big giant goose egg (man those are great). A couple squares of chocolate and some wine. Is that a ton? Maybe not.
                I feel like I will be eating a ton... the not gaining a ton is yet to be determined.

                I started increasing my calories, because I just thought I was too low. Weight loss has completely stopped. Then I read about eating your BMR and I have been hundreds and sometimes a 1000 calories under BMR for about a year. So now suddenly I feel like I am starving... like I haven't eaten for a year!

                Today was a calorie up day, I started zig zagging also. I just could not get full. I also did not eat nearly as many veggies as normal, and no BAS, so I will chalk it up to my choices.

                I started to journal about it also, cuz I am so frustrated and confused. Mostly pissed. No real progress in about 5 months. And only about 20lbs lost since going Primal about a year ago.

                http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread78870.html
                65lbs gone and counting!!

                Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                  Thank you all for the support. This thread has been very nourishing for me.

                  The point of this is definitely to saturate myself with nutrients. One thing that moved me towards thinking this way was to look at the nutrient levels on chronometer when logging in my foods. It is just impossible to maintain a caloric deficit and meet all the RDA's. Even more frustrating is knowing those are low and I should be getting even more than that. The idea here is to eat more nutrients than I need to maintain so there is extra for repair of damage from chronically being low. When that healing is complete, my metabolism should go up, body temperature will come up. My body will have healed what it needed to, enough time will have passed to send the message that the surplus of nutrition is going to continue and then the fat is free to come off, as it will be seen as unneeded.

                  I believe the reason I have gained in the past while still eating low is that after going super low calories it lowers the metabolism and anything extra is quickly used to store fat for the constant famine that comes and goes. Leida commented about trying 1800-2000 calories and gaining. My thought at this time is that that was still not enough. The body needs extra and it needs it consistently to start sending a different message. I also think the fat gain won't stop until the body has healed and been sent a new message - this is not a temporary surplus, rather, this is the new norm. Then the fat should come back off.

                  Obviously this is still theory/hope. I'll keep posting progress as time goes on. This morning I had a temperature increase for the first time. 97.6 went up to 97.8. I decided not to weigh myself this morning but did notice a 1 cm. increase in the waist.
                  Great to see this thread getting a bit of mileage,
                  The micronutrient issue has always been a concern in my eyes when I see individuals pushing down calories for weight loss goals.
                  I also think the menstral cycle (for those still in it) is a great indicator of overall health, there is a key nutrient demand during the folicular stage when the uterus is preparing the lining, particularly right at the end of this stage as the lining is bulked out, this is the time when many women get the exaggerated mood behaviour's and I think this is most likely due to key nutrient deficiencies, primarily iron rich protein in my view (bit of a theory I have) and then at the end of the cycle when calcium and magnesium deficiencies appear evident in cramping and craving events. Excessive PMS symptoms, I think are an indicator of micronutrient deficiencies, the sypmtoms should only be uncomfortable enough to make you aware, but not debilitating, it does not make evolutionary sense in the design process.

                  Wit regard to monitoring my partner has been recording body temp and heart rate morning and night as part of her healing process (autoimmune hyperthyroid) and it has been interesting to see the fluctuations in her cycle and temp variations as she has progressed on her journey and her PMS has also improved markedly. When I first looked at this stuff, most of my searches landed on fertility sites, then the obvious hit me, healthy body, healthy cycle and boom there's a "bun in the oven", so these sites have already determined before anything else for pregnancy to occur there must be a healthy menstral cycle which by default is an indicator of a healthy body most of the time.
                  Recording and charting temps & resting heart rate along with symptoms diary, will provide useful data to reflect back on when tracking progress and in addition there is another major benefit in that you stop everything and actually focus on and devote time to yourself, this will assist in the process of learning to listen to your body and feel the subtle shifts. It does take a while, but the daily routine, over time, will bring you in tune with your body.

                  Our process was to deal with an autoimmune condition and we pulled out all stops to give it our best shot, but the more I read into some individual experiences with weightloss problems, both physiological and psychological, I would rate them as serious as an autoimmune or other chronic condition and hence warrant the same degree of attention.

                  Anyway, think I'm starting to ramble on a bit.
                  Great to see this topic shaken up a bit.
                  "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                    So today I was just going along my day and I thought about this thread and how I identified as someone who eats a ton. But then I realized that breakfast and lunch combined were a large skinless chicken breast and a sweet potato. That's not really a ton. I was on my way out to have some vegan dessert from the food co-op. Okay, now I eat a ton, right? Dinner was a chicken livers (3 livers) and one big giant goose egg (man those are great). A couple squares of chocolate and some wine. Is that a ton? Maybe not.
                    That would barely qualify to be called "a ton" if you doubled it and added a gallon of milk.
                    The Champagne of Beards

                    Comment


                    • I have to stress that the chicken was some sort of mutant. The breast was about a pound, so half a pound at each meal. And the potato was quite large, too. The desserts I ate were: chia seed lemon pudding (main ingredients are chia seeds, cashews and coconut milk) and a vegan brownie (main ingredients walnuts, pecans and dates). I'm sure those two items were quite a few calories.

                      It all just seems like so much more than I ate before, probably because there are large amounts of meat at every meal. I'm really trying to eat the recommended piece of meat the size of your palm at every meal thing.

                      I guess making a large piece of meat the center of every meal makes it feel like a lot of food since it's not just "tiding me over" until dinner, which is how I guess I've mostly normally operated in the past. Perhaps calories aren't so much what is needed to be eaten in "tons", but meat.

                      Here's a picture of dinner the other night. I went back for another whole quail.
                      Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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                      • Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                        It all just seems like so much more than I ate before
                        Since I increased calories, I just can't believe how I was EVAH full on less! Most days now I am trying to keep it to around 1650 but yesterday was to be a 1950 day, and I was still hungry last night! So I had a little snack. Haven't even tracked it yet, but probably another 250.

                        I am not hungry so much now though. I am still trying to IF-16.

                        Anyways, I am exercising more again, and yesterday was a Tabata day also. That just makes me more hungry. When I first started my journey (sorry if I repeat) well after a few months, well about the time I found primal actually, anyways I hated cardio and it just made me more hungry, so I was figuring out that I would rather watch my calories than to do cardio.
                        65lbs gone and counting!!

                        Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

                        Comment


                        • gopintos, I can't quite tell... are you giving this a go as well? or just upping calories a bit, or are those number in your normal caloric cycling?

                          With all the fertility talk I looked up the temperature cycle. I was all excited to see 98.0 this morning (another .2 increase) but now I see that I started tracking right at ovulation and this is exactly when I should be going up anyway. I suppose my temperatures won't mean too much until I have a month of notes to look back on.
                          PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                          http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                            gopintos, I can't quite tell... are you giving this a go as well? or just upping calories a bit, or are those number in your normal caloric cycling?
                            Yal I started upping them a little at the first of the year, somewhat, and in the last few weeks, I have been trying to follow the calories suggested by the zig zag calculator. Before that I was following the pattern, but my calories were still usually around 1300, and my high days were 1600. Now my low days are around 1600.

                            Then the other day on the forums, I was reading about dont eat under your BMR, so that is when I started my journal here on this very subject of increasing calories, rather than hijacking other peoples threads ha That was about a week ago.

                            So yes, I am trying. I think I was chronically too low for a year. Weight loss has stopped, except for the few pound fluctuations. I did experience a gain, this after I was at a new low about 2 weeks before Christmas. Then after Christmas, I went up 9lbs but 2 came back off. Now I teeder, on off, on off. However I think I am finally starting to head downward now. I think I am going to end the month with about a 3lb loss. My 9lbs peaked at the first of February.

                            But I had just decided to go with it. To eat the foods that I wanted (I don't mean processed crap - I dont want that) but I mean just to eat the good foods I liked w/o much regard to the macros. What I found was that I am still at about a 3-way split when I eat that way, and I was able to get calories up to 1600 a day. Days like yesterday, I just couldnt get full, but I didnt eat many veggies either. I have been snowed in all week and fresh produce running low.

                            So anyways, I just went with it, to see what would happen. And it was hard, mentally. I have been at this for over a year, and the last year not much progress -20lbs, and the last 5 months virtually no progress.

                            So anyways, I would tweak whatever I needed to, I just wasnt sure what that is, but I did think regardless, I wasn't eating enough and that sabotaged any and all other efforts. Now I am wondering if I messed something up and if I should go have some tests done at the doctor, but I don't know what that might be.

                            I will say, I feel better. I have more energy. I think the things I am reading, are sinking in more now. I see how to apply things now whereas before, I missed it. I did spot check some measurements a few minutes ago, and those 2 places have gone down so I think I am finally gaining some ground now.

                            So I know, or think I know, the pound increase on the scale, is not so much fat gain but hopefully mostly water. I went from about 50 carbs to about 100 carbs, some days 125-150. I am also doing ST and Tabata and when the weather is nice, I walk.
                            65lbs gone and counting!!

                            Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

                            Comment


                            • Okay, here is breakfast. Rare steak and potato.
                              Pre-assembly:

                              Here's how it barely fits in my bowl:

                              My chicken breakfasts and lunches are similar, maybe not as big of potatoes.
                              Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

                              Comment


                              • NOM NOM NOM. Steak & potato is my all time favorite.

                                I would post a picture of my breakfast, but I just narfed it all down. 3 eggs fried in a tad of CO on top of a bed of 1/4c. salmon and half an avocado all smushed up.

                                My first half of the day looks pretty high fat. Then it evens out over the course of the day.
                                65lbs gone and counting!!

                                Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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