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  • #16
    Im sure you just grabbed the first four sites that popped up but three of those are just opinions and one is a disease. There is no evidence there that any of those synptoms are actually a protein deficiency. Many of those symptoms listed actually are the same as a thyroid disorder, b12 deficiency, magnesium deficiency or something else.

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    • #17
      I think it's very possible, and healthy if you eat eggs and dairy. And Seafood, even better. Isn't Mark's wife a pescetarian?

      I think needing meat for protein is a huge myth and eating a lot of chicken and other meats high in o6 is probably less healthy than just eating eggs and dairy and shellfish. It amazes me how ubiquitous chicken is in the paleosphere!
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      • #18
        Originally posted by Zach View Post
        Im sure you just grabbed the first four sites that popped up
        Yep, no time to read all 4+ million hits.

        Originally posted by Zach View Post
        but three of those are just opinions and one is a disease.
        As are your posts - opinions. I find nothing in your posts that even remotely comes off as anything except pushing CW or SAD. Generally I ignore your posts, but a remark like "There is no such thing as a protein deficiency," should be addressed when someone has posted a genuine question about how to be primal if she isn't all that fond of meat. There is such a thing as protein deficiency.

        In fact, since you're so anti-primal, why don't you do an n=1 experiment and go six months or so with no protein. I'll wait with bated breath for the results.
        "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

        B*tch-lite

        Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Zach View Post
          Im sure you were craving meat for other reasons, most likely you were crash dieting. Yes is someone is eating all their calories from non foods and eating low calories then your protein requirements will go up. Im talking about someone who is eating a relatively healthy diet and hearing the eat 1g per lb mantra. 30-60g a day is plenty for most individuals eating fairly decently and no it all doesnt need to come from animal products. 99% of people will never have a protein deficiency even eating a vegan diet.
          Wait, the body knows the difference between 45 grams of protein on a "crash diet" and 45 grams of protein eaten normally through portion control? Tell me about what I was eating, please. You seem to know more about it than I do.

          30g a day is nowhere near enough even for a sedentary woman, and I was not sedentary. I was very active. It is far below any recommendations I have ever read. Even vegan sites use a higher number than that.

          I may be atypical. But I doubt it. One thing I know for sure is that if my n=1 is reproducible, it is reliable for me. I care about my health. I see no reason to believe from what you say that you do.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by JoanieL View Post
            I'll wait with bated breath for the results.
            I love you. You spelled 'bated' right.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by JoanieL View Post
              Yep, no time to read all 4+ million hits.



              As are your posts - opinions. I find nothing in your posts that even remotely comes off as anything except pushing CW or SAD. Generally I ignore your posts, but a remark like "There is no such thing as a protein deficiency," should be addressed when someone has posted a genuine question about how to be primal if she isn't all that fond of meat. There is such a thing as protein deficiency.

              In fact, since you're so anti-primal, why don't you do an n=1 experiment and go six months or so with no protein. I'll wait with bated breath for the results.
              Haha, i think it was choco who said you can google "moon is a spaceship" and get ten million hits. Google hits means nothing.

              It is not my opinion, it is the opinion of every major health organization in the world. Sometimes conventional wisdom is right.

              Also i do not have to do a N=1, vegans all around the world prove it already. Like i said, a protein deficiency might very well just be a vitamin or mineral deficiency. You cant eat a protein free diet, it is not possible.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                Wait, the body knows the difference between 45 grams of protein on a "crash diet" and 45 grams of protein eaten normally through portion control? Tell me about what I was eating, please. You seem to know more about it than I do.

                30g a day is nowhere near enough even for a sedentary woman, and I was not sedentary. I was very active. It is far below any recommendations I have ever read. Even vegan sites use a higher number than that.

                I may be atypical. But I doubt it. One thing I know for sure is that if my n=1 is reproducible, it is reliable for me. I care about my health. I see no reason to believe from what you say that you do.
                Protein requirements go down as calories and carbs go up. Yes if you are very low carb, you will have a high protei. Requirement because your body needs glucose from somewhere. This is not what protein is meant for. When everything is else is taken care of, protein requirements should be very low because its heing used appropriately.

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                • #23
                  It's definitely possible to be vegetarian and primal while getting enough protein. I g through phases when I just don't feel like eating meat myself. During those times, I go with eggs and Greek yogurt for my protein sources. Btw, if your friend eats fish, they're not vegetarian
                  F 28/5'4/100 lbs

                  "I'm not a psychopath, I'm a high-functioning sociopath; do your research."

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                  • #24
                    I believe Mark did a post recently and his wife is a vegetarian but eats fish (Pescetarian? Not sure). And she looks fantastic.
                    High Weight: 225
                    Weight at start of Primal: 189
                    Current Weight: 174
                    Goal Weight: 130

                    Primal Start Date: 11/26/2012

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by EagleRiverDee View Post
                      I believe Mark did a post recently and his wife is a vegetarian but eats fish (Pescetarian? Not sure). And she looks fantastic.
                      Yup, I think as long as you can add either seafood or eggs it becomes quite doable.

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                      • #26
                        I think you can do perfectly fine as a vegetarian that eats fish/dairy and eggs. My fiance is primal and is a lacto-ovo vegetarian. If she would just include fish or even fermented cod liver oil her diet would almost become bulletproof. I don't think its a requirement to eat meat when you are doing paleo/primal. I personally try to eat as much fish as possible over meat and poultry.
                        "If man made it, don't eat it" - Jack Lallane

                        People say I am on a "crazy" diet. What is so crazy about eating veggies, fruits, seafood and organ meats? Just because I don't eat whole wheat and processed food doesn't make my diet "crazy". Maybe everyone else with a SAD are the "crazy" ones for putting that junk in their system.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Zach View Post
                          Im basically vegetarian and i am worlds healthier then when i ate a meat based diet. My main calories come from frut, dairy and eggs in that order.

                          It can easily be done. You dont have to be a sstrict vegetarian or anything, just eat animal products when you feel the need and keep most of your calories coming from what you like, in your case, carbs.
                          This sounds so good to me. Although I love nut butters, so would love to incorporate those too- now I try to really limit them as I am afraid i'll over-do. Zach- can you share your thoughts on weight loss eating this way? Also, do you find it's easier to keep calories low?

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                          • #28
                            About protein... I'm perfectly well aware this doesn't prove anything, but here are a couple of changes I noticed when I switched to meat-eating Primal from lacto-ovo-whole-grain vegetarian of 20 years:
                            • faster-growing nails
                            • thicker hair - that is, the individual hairs are about twice as thick
                            • no more split ends - really striking, as it used to be hard to find a hair that wasn't split
                            • gradual, slight improvement in hair coverage - I have female pattern baldness, and while shiny scalp is still perfectly visible, it's not as bad.

                            Of course, it's impossible to say which health benefits came from what I cut out, and which came from what I added in, and which of the added nutrients made the greatest difference. But my best guess would be that hair and nail differences are because my body's no longer having to economise on protein.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by aimlow View Post
                              This sounds so good to me. Although I love nut butters, so would love to incorporate those too- now I try to really limit them as I am afraid i'll over-do. Zach- can you share your thoughts on weight loss eating this way? Also, do you find it's easier to keep calories low?
                              PM'd you.

                              In general i think you have to pick only one fuel for fat loss. In my case it would be carbs so fat would have to be semi low, which would eliminate nut butters. Also it depends on your definition of low. I don think calories should ever be restricted to far, usually it causes more problems then fat loss. But yes, i dont think carbs cause you to eat out of control if they are from the right sources and it you are getting enough calories and nutrients.

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                              • #30
                                Yes, there are primal/paleo vegetarians. An ovo-lacto vegetarian could easily do primal, and if the person eats fish, then it's even easier still.

                                I believe that Mark's wife is a pescitarian (eats fish), and i know a couple of others, so no big deal at all.

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