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  • Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
    Gopintos, if you are still losing weight just continue to do what you are doing...
    Unfortunately I am not. I have just been spinning my wheels. Scratching my head. I have lost 20lbs in 11 months of primal. But the reality is, I weigh the same today as I did 5 months ago. Funny thing is, if you asked me 5 months ago, I was certain that I knew exactly what I was doing wrong and I knew exactly what I needed to change. The really funny thing is (okay, incredibly sad thing is...) never once did I think about increasing calories up anywhere close to BMR. I am consistently anywhere from 500 - 900 under BMR. Every single day. For a year. The 2 months prior to that, I was only a few hundred calories under BMR. Weight loss was about 10lbs per month then. Then it dropped to 5lbs after primal. Then eventually to no pounds. I blamed it on high fat. The higher the fat, the lower the calories. I did that for probably 5 or 6 months so it was close to 700 - 900 under BMR during that time period.
    65lbs gone and counting!!

    Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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    • Unfortunately there are too many answers to go through, so I will just reply to the original post.

      If you reduce carbs and increase fat intake, like Mark suggests, your body will learn to burn fats. Additionally, fats are extremely important not only in terms of calories, but it terms of nutrient itself. Reducing the carbs will prevent insulin spikes: insulin is the hormone that carries fats to be stored. In short: no insulin spikes -> fats will stay around to be burnt evenly -> no carvings for food -> higher energy level (because the calories are used, not stored!!!) -> you'll actually find you eat less without forcing yourself to

      If you reduce carbs AND fat and regularly live of lean proteins, you are training your body to burn proteins for energy. Not good. You can do it once per week, and only when your body has already learned to burn fat as the primary source of energy. That day of lean proteins (or if you want, total fasting, I personally prefer the second) you will enter that legendary state called ketosis that everybody here speaks about but very few actually understood.

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      • Btw, I received this article today. Coincidence?

        http://healthybabycode.com/why-eatin...-is-a-bad-idea

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        • Gopintos-
          I admit to having not read thru the entire thread and I've been hoping someone more familiar with your BMR concerns would respond. But here are my thoughts based on my experience: When I lost my 70 pounds, I did so eating around my BMR ( some days higher, some lower - not planned, just turned out that way). I ate low carb (20-30 grams daily, with fat around 60%. I also found that if I took fat higher (and therefore the calories), it did seem to stop my progress. I'm wondering if you got you calories up closer to your BMR but continued to keep your fat around 60% (or more if that works for your metabolism) if the weight wouldn't start dropping again? You might see a gain initially but it may be worth the risk. Like you, I love Jaminet's PHD, but I fear I wouldn't have lost the pounds on it as well as I did keeping carbs as low as I did. Back then some extra asparagus could screw up my week. However, now that I'm maintaining a normal weight, I've found I can incorporate small amounts of white rice or potatoes with no harm. Good luck with working this out. It is my belief that our metabolisms vary greatly and we have to test & sometimes stumble b/f we find the sweet spot for our body and even that isn't carved in stone.
          Starting Weight: 197.5
          Current Weight: 123
          Far healthier!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by janie View Post
            Gopintos-
            I admit to having not read thru the entire thread and I've been hoping someone more familiar with your BMR concerns would respond. But here are my thoughts based on my experience:
            Thank you for taking the time to write.
            I don't mean to hijack this thread, so feel free to ignore me. I don't journal, so just going to spew here.

            Ok, I started to spew & deleted. I think I will start a journal. I will have to figure out how....

            OIC, it's just a thread in the journey section?
            65lbs gone and counting!!

            Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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            • Originally posted by gopintos View Post

              just when i think i have this figured out, i realize i dont have a clue.
              amen!

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              • Originally posted by primal_alex View Post
                If you reduce carbs and increase fat intake, like Mark suggests, your body will learn to burn fats. Additionally, fats are extremely important not only in terms of calories, but it terms of nutrient itself. you'll actually find you eat less without forcing yourself to

                If you reduce carbs AND fat and regularly live of lean proteins, you are training your body to burn proteins for energy. Not good.

                http://healthybabycode.com/why-eatin...-is-a-bad-idea
                This^^^^

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                • Originally posted by primal_alex View Post
                  If you reduce carbs and increase fat intake, like Mark suggests, your body will learn to burn fats. Additionally, fats are extremely important not only in terms of calories, but it terms of nutrient itself. Reducing the carbs will prevent insulin spikes: insulin is the hormone that carries fats to be stored. In short: no insulin spikes -> fats will stay around to be burnt evenly -> no carvings for food -> higher energy level (because the calories are used, not stored!!!)
                  Sounds good, except that you are wrong about almost everything in your post! The body never forgot to burn fat, everybody do it all the time, so you are plain wrong...
                  "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

                  - Schopenhauer

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                  • Originally posted by Gorbag View Post
                    Sounds good, except that you are wrong about almost everything in your post! The body never forgot to burn fat, everybody do it all the time, so you are plain wrong...
                    If the body is fed too much carbs too frequently over a long period of time (aka the SAD), it does indeed "forget" how to burn fat. This is why people go through the carb flu.

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                    • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                      If the body is fed too much carbs too frequently over a long period of time (aka the SAD), it does indeed "forget" how to burn fat. This is why people go through the carb flu.
                      Possibly slightly better terminology may be that the hormonal imbalances created by a carb heavy diet block the bodys ability to utilize fat metabolism effectively, it doesn't quite forget, just gotta clean out the line and reset for fat burning, but yes end result is the same no matter how you describe it.
                      "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

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                      • Wow OK I can't believe this thread is still going.
                        The only thing I changed was stopped the BP coffee, and had a small meal instead. I am now eating 3 small meals a day, and still feel 100%, and in that week I lost 2.5 kg.
                        I have not reduced my fat intake. I am having some leaner proteins, like chicken breast but with added fat. More so for variety more than anything. I am having small amounts of sweet potato, which is fine. But I did have a couple of sushi rolls the other day, but I did not feel great after, so probably will stay away from rice for now like I was.
                        Just will be taking one day at a time for now.

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                        • Originally posted by Omni View Post
                          Possibly slightly better terminology may be that the hormonal imbalances created by a carb heavy diet block the bodys ability to utilize fat metabolism effectively, it doesn't quite forget, just gotta clean out the line and reset for fat burning, but yes end result is the same no matter how you describe it.
                          Exactly right but I didn't want to lay the "science-y" stuff on too heavily as I was talking to Gorbag.

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                          • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                            Exactly right but I didn't want to lay the "science-y" stuff on too heavily as I was talking to Gorbag.
                            Ziiiiing! And correctly so.
                            Starting Weight: 197.5
                            Current Weight: 123
                            Far healthier!

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                              Exactly right but I didn't want to lay the "science-y" stuff on too heavily as I was talking to Gorbag.
                              Fair call, will keep that in mind.
                              "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

                              Comment


                              • I'm new to forums but saw this post. In my reading I am struck that we all have different genetic baggage, and there is not a one size fits all diet for everyone. Some self experimentation is needed. In the pure low carb literature (Volek and Phinney, Westman) it is pretty clear that some people are extremely carb sensitive and won't lose weight unless they cut to 20-30 gm/day of carbs. Others (like me) are lucky and can do 50 gm/day and still lose. The Atkins approach, which many people don't read far enough in the book to understand, has you start with 20 gm/day for two weeks to adapt, but then start slowly adding back berries, nuts, other things with more and more carbs to figure out your own metabolism. I did 20 gm/day for a month and had few problems. If you feel weak, supplement salt with a couple of cups of boullion a day.

                                The major difference is probably the composition of the meals in that Mark stresses stopping grains for health reasons. But note that adding grains is the very last kind of plant food on the Atkins ladder (above berries, nuts, root vegies, then finally grains.) Functionally there isn't a nickel's worth of difference between the approaches!

                                Doc Jim
                                10/2/12: 169 lbs, 37"waist
                                Now: low 150's, 33" waist
                                Blog: http://paleopathologist.com/

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