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Is there a conspiracy behind the vegan agenda? Just a thought

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  • #16
    I used to be a super militant vegan. I still have a tattoo that says "Vegan Revolution" on the back of my neck. Yeah, it was pretty bad. I wouldn't say there is a conspiracy though. I have a number of vegan friends who will not eat anything other than raw organic and would never in a billion years support a crappy company like Monsanto or Cargill or any of those larger named companies. Their ideology is just like any other. Unfortunately, when you don't generally ascribe to that way of thinking, having to hear about it over and over again can drive you nuts. Like I said, I have a number of friends who are super militant or at least feel very strongly about their views and won't hesitate to tell someone they are a murderer because they eat animals (equating humans and animals as equal - hence the term murder). They will also post horrible looking propagandistic photos of animals who are being used for food - in an industry - even as a meat eater on a Paleo/Primal diet - one typically would try not to support. Anyway, there are my two cents.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Forgotmylastusername View Post
      That's even more ridiculous than saying that paleo is just a conspiracy by the meat industry
      Yeah seriously, why do you REALLY eat meat?

      Pythagoras was the first person to popularise a meat-free diet, which he advocated for a myriad of spiritual reasons. It was called the Pythagorean diet, and became known as "vegetarianism" in the 19th century.

      You'll find that many veggies and vegans have a spiritual leaning which promotes this way of eating. In a nutshell, eating meat is reputed to bind you to the earth. Abstaining from it is supposed to elevate you to a more etheral way of being. That's how I became a vegan anyway (note: it didn't work )
      "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

      In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

      - Ray Peat

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      • #18
        I definatly think that most vegans do it for the 'do no harm' thing and there are a lot of environmentalists that are vegan or veggie.

        TBH if the facts stacked up then I would be vegan or veggie for environmental reasons, probabaly vegan except for my own eggs. But IMHO the facts don't stack up.

        I have heard that slave labour is used when soy is grown, and what about all the pesticides from growing conventianl food, how many feild mice die in each wheet harvest etc etc.

        You can't have a sustainable farming system without using animals to close loops, grass grows really well without any input other than grazing to manage it, esspeically in the UK, permanant pasutre and hay meadows are very good environmentally and I can't eat grass, yummy yummy cows and sheep can though.

        Most vegans I know eat a lot of imported food, including soy and other protien sources and lots of fruit from far away, which equals big air miles. 90% of my diet comes from the UK, meat is UK, most veg are UK, so really just some fruit (mainly for the kids and we get what is in season when available) coffee, chocolate and tea (all stable, low volume products that could easily come by sea, blown by the wind post running out of oil)

        So that's where I stand - ideally I'd eat a diet of sustainably farmed organic local produce, as it is I get as close as I can afford, make sure the kids get plenty of fruit and have some luxary foods such as tea, coffee and chocolate.
        You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

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        • #19
          I grew up in a "meat is murder" town. I honestly question the sanity of some of these people. I mean really? They honestly care what a chicken thinks in its last moment of life? A CHICKEN! Obviously did NOT grow up around chickens. They have some weird notions of how "all" meat is raised and butchered to. I once told a vegan that I only eat happy cows because - as often as possible - I eat grass fed free range beef from a local ranch on Hawaii - to which she immediately replied "OH, I am sure they are sooooo happy when some *expletive* rancher strings them up to a tree and slits their throats till they bleed out." This is probably true. Regaurdless, farm animals are on earth to feed people! A cow is not in any other animals food chain. Its bizarre to me that a lot of vegans and vegetarians claim their diet to be all natural but they eat soy - a wretched form of fermented bean curd with the consistency of watery chalk - which I don't think is exactly natural. My other favorite argument I read in a book once claimed that humans are not supposed to eat meat and its soooo obvious because our jaw and our bodies are not designed to run down living prey and drag it to its death. This author has apparently never seen a sea otter use tools to eat shellfish but I suppose the sea otter shouldnt be eating that either.

          In my opinon, if you want to be a vegan or vegetarian or whatever, hey, its a free country do what makes you happy. All I ask is that some of these people, especially where I grew up, not stand around across the street from my favorite burger joint and try to tell me that the beef I am eating is tainted by Satan and I am a murderer because I consume cow flesh and organs.

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          • #20
            I think they just care about animals?! Not sure there's some "agenda"... some people just don't believe animals should be killed for food or exploited by people.

            (Yes, I'm an ex-vegetarian/vegan... and yes, I did it because I didn't want animals to die for me and I believed that humans should eat vegetarian... now I believe otherwise but I still don't LIKE that animals have to die for me to eat!)

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            • #21
              Originally posted by idreamofsilence View Post
              I still have a tattoo that says "Vegan Revolution" on the back of my neck.
              I bet a really talented tattoo artist could make it say "Bacon Revolution," depending on the font. Just a (great) idea.
              The Champagne of Beards

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              • #22
                Originally posted by MprDoc View Post
                My other favorite argument I read in a book once claimed that humans are not supposed to eat meat and its soooo obvious because our jaw and our bodies are not designed to run down living prey and drag it to its death. This author has apparently never seen a sea otter use tools to eat shellfish but I suppose the sea otter shouldnt be eating that either.
                Yeah, I think that one was from Skinny Bitch. I don't remember, I've read a lot of those books...so clearly, the only reason I'm interested in Primal is meat eating convention and ignorance about the benefits/logic of vegetarianism! ;-)

                I don't begrudge anyone who wants to be a vegetarian or vegan. I just don't like the tactics of certain vegan political organizations (PETA - lets exploit women in our quest to end the explotation of animals), or some of the lies you see in vegetarian propoganda (humans can't digest meat, it rots in your gut - guess my liver and pancreas didn't get the memo).
                Wanna be vegetarian? Great!
                Wanna try to convince others to be? Fine, that's your right, just please do so based on facts.

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                • #23
                  No.
                  My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
                  When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

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                  • #24
                    I am an ex-vegan and I became vegan for "health reasons", to "not get heart disease", "to avoid cancer", "lower chlosterol",etc. all the usual suspects. I didn't give a rat's behind about "saving the animals." What I discovered was I was screaming hungry and tired all the time. Had been listening to the likes of The China Study, John McDougall, Neal Barnard, T. Colin Campbell, etc.
                    Do I think there is an agenda? I sure do. Look at PCRM and see who's the president and top advisors.

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                    • #25
                      Vegans are people who've never been really hungry.

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                      • #26
                        If people want to be vegan, let them be vegan. If they want to be paleo/primal, let them be so. It's great that we are able to choose such lifestyles, granted we don't try to enforce our opinions on others. I think there are plenty of vegans out there who truly believe that we should respect and not kill animals. I personally believe that we should certainly treat them humanely, but I also understand that we are omnivores by nature and thus benefit from meat. Not everything is a conspiracy, and not everyone has an agenda. Just my two cents though.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by elfman5150 View Post
                          Not everything is a conspiracy, and not everyone has an agenda. Just my two cents though.
                          That sounds like and agenda to me
                          You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

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                          • #28
                            I was a vegan for a couple of years. It was The McDougall Program and the only agenda was health. I lost a lot of weight on it the strictest version (Maximum Weight Loss), but I have to admit it is like white knuckling it to only eat beans, rice, potaoes and a few green vegetables all the time. So I decided to do the less-strict version which allowed bread, tortillas and all sorts of grains. My weight stalled and then I regained most of what I had lost. So much for the health part. I read somewhere that Mark Sisson's in-laws are vegetarians and have done The McDougall Program. He said he want on a trip to Costa Rica where Dr. McDougall has his sessions and there was a lot of bread and rolls on the table. After beginning the McDougall Program I was diagnosed with Celiac Disease, which meant if I stayed on the program I would be right back to eating just rice and potatoes agains, so I started eating meat again and have not only started to lose weight, but feel great. You can read my story in the Meet and Greet section of this forum.

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                            • #29
                              In regards to people it's not a conspiracy. Those people just think it's the right way to eat and I really could care less.

                              Where I do think it crosses over into conspiracy land is the fact that the government, RD's, pretend health associations like the AHA all seem to be pushing anti meat agenda in their dietary plans. Basically I think the message has two purposes.

                              1) Animal fat is really not that profitable. Profit margins on butter, bacon, milk, red meat have to be much lower then processed junc garbage made in a biotechnology lab.

                              2) I generally believe that if you want to create an unhealthy population that taking animal fat out of humans diet will accomplish that. Most of our bodies are saturated fat. Where are you getting fat soluble vitamins A, D, K when you cut animal fat?

                              So I think it's a conspiracy to make money. The more low fat junk people eat the richer the food, drug and biotechnology companies become on the front side through sales of garbage and on the back side selling statins and chemo.

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                              • #30
                                You know what, I just remembered the story of how one of my raw food vegan friends became vegan.

                                He attended a personal development weekends with Tony Robbins (vegan). If you haven't been on one of those retreats, then imagine: people breaking down, crying, opening up, healing, blahblahblah. A lot of deep, soul searching stuff.

                                At the end of this weekend of healing and reclaiming your inner power, what did Tony do? He showed them a three hour video. Of cows, chickens, pigs and all our other farmhouse friends, being raised in battery farms, and slaughtered mercilessly. After which he launched into a vegan diatribe. My friend became vegan after that weekend. It was 10 years ago.

                                Funnily, it never occurred to him that showing a video like that to people who were raw and vulnerable after a weekend of psychotherapy might be manipulative.

                                Don't know if Tony Robbins is a conspirator, but I certainly think he's a dick.
                                "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                                In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                                - Ray Peat

                                Comment

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