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Why do starchy carbs like sweet potato, potato, squash make me ill?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
    And WTF our preferred fuel source? Erm OK.
    I tend to side with Stephan Guyenet and Danny Roddy's take on the issue. Two things that you may want to read:

    Whole Health Source: Healthy Skeptic Podcast and Reader Questions
    Whole Health Source: Clarifications About Carbohydrate and Insulin

    Carbohydrate gets a bad rap because of the type of carbohydrate inherent to the typical American diet - grains and refined sugars. Today's carbohydrate is ultra-palatable - flour fried in rancid polyunsaturated fat, topped with salt and sugar. The food reward is too high and it's literally toxic. Try overeating a boiled potato. See how fat you get. Hell, a boiled potato is more nutritious per calorie than the average piece of muscle meat.

    If you had success going low carbohydrate, it's likely because you:

    a.) Removed toxic grains from your diet
    b.) Made your food less palatable so you are eating less. It's a lot harder to overeat steak and potatoes separately than when together.

    Stephen sums it up well here:

    I am not suggesting that low-fat diets are the ultimate path to health, but I do think they can be compatible with health in most people, if carefully composed. In addition, they may have benefits in certain situations, for example if you want to reduce food reward. Reducing carbohydrate is another way to do that, and the effectiveness of each method may depend on individual differences...

    ...Humans are adapted to eating starch. Hunter-gatherers show genetic evidence for selection for starch tolerance relative to other primates, and agricultural populations show even more. The vast majority of people who are reading this descend from agricultural populations that ate high-starch diets for thousands of years. Although there's still some controversy, it appears that modern Europeans descend mostly from agricultural populations that immigrated from the Middle East and replaced European hunter-gatherers, and needless to say European hunter-gatherers didn't contribute much to the genetic makeup of people of more recent African origin, or native Americans...

    ...Since the ancestors of most people reading this have probably been eating more starch than fat for a very long time, at a minimum thousands of years, but probably closer to a million (because African game meat tends to be pretty lean, and most peoples' ancestors never passed through far Northern latitudes where fat calories predominate), I think the "null hypothesis" should be that humans are best adapted to diets where starch predominates over fat. In other words, that should be the default hypothesis that requires evidence to disprove. The fact that there are so may healthy high-starch cultures, far more than there are high-fat cultures, adds to the weight of the evidence.
    What do you think?

    Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
    What ever you say Chaco.
    Remember EVERYONE is different. What works for you, doesn't always work for the next person.
    Everyone is different in the sense that we like different colors, prefer different genres of music and like certain foods more than others. Physiologically, we're all pretty much identical. What works for me will likely work for you. If it isn't, it's probably because of some stubborn belief you're not willing to let go of. We're stubborn creatures by nature.

    Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
    You are wrong about it being our preferred fuel source, but hey I know you will never change your thoughts on that so moving on.
    No. I used to believe what you currently believe - until I dropped my preconceived notions, did actual research outside of paleo blogs and experimented on myself. Shortterm carbohydrate restriction can have benefits. Longterm carbohydrate restriction leads to a myriad of health issues. The Inuit is often used as an example here - which is ironic because they're vastly outnumbered by high carb societies. They are also one of the most haggard traditional societies on record known for aging very quickly.
    Last edited by ChocoTaco369; 01-13-2013, 10:16 PM.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
      Also a possibility - but your issue would be solely related to white potatoes since sweet potatoes are mentioned in the title. If you have issues with sweet potatoes, squash or bananas, it's not a nightshade issue unless you're combining them with white potatoes.

      For your sake, I hope it's not a nightshade issue. If I couldn't have my tomatoes, peppers and white potatoes...oh man. I'd cry for weeks.
      He did say "especially" the white potatoes in the OP. Warmbear? Have you tried sweet potatoes or yams against the white spuds to compare?

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      • #18
        Oh, sorry for trying to actually talk about the OP's concern instead of having round 54,887 of the carb wars.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
          I tend to side with Stephan Guyenet and Danny Roddy's take on the issue. Two things that you may want to read:

          Whole Health Source: Healthy Skeptic Podcast and Reader Questions
          Whole Health Source: Clarifications About Carbohydrate and Insulin

          Carbohydrate gets a bad rap because of the type of carbohydrate inherent to the typical American diet - grains and refined sugars. Today's carbohydrate is ultra-palatable - flour fried in rancid polyunsaturated fat, topped with salt and sugar. The food reward is too high and it's literally toxic. Try overeating a boiled potato. See how fat you get. Hell, a boiled potato is more nutritious per calorie than the average piece of muscle meat.

          If you had success going low carbohydrate, it's likely because you:

          a.) Removed toxic grains from your diet

          What do you think?
          Nope to this, because this I did first, way back over a year ago. When fully primal, but lower fat than now, and slightly more carbs, I still felt good, but often tired. It wasn't until 3 weeks ago that I went to 70% fat I felt like I had woken up from a coma and was just buzzing. I cannot possibly explain exactly how amazing I feel right now. Not to mention the fact that I can go to a party with a table full of chips and crap processed food now, and not touch anything is a huge huge thing for me, who used to binge often for 12 years.

          As for your other point. Yes I guess I probably am eating less calorie wise, but the fat is keeping me satisfied for much longer, so can not possibly eat anymore than I am. I am in no way starving though. Plus my digestion is now perfect, where I have had problems often in the past.

          I don't believe that about being adapted for starch. Again why would it make me so tired and feeling gross if that were the case?

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
            Oh, sorry for trying to actually talk about the OP's concern instead of having round 54,887 of the carb wars.
            Yes PB sorry, you are so right. Im just sick of reading this BS. I just need to stay away from other threads.
            Bowing out.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
              He did say "especially" the white potatoes in the OP. Warmbear? Have you tried sweet potatoes or yams against the white spuds to compare?
              Another issue could also be the skins on the white potatoes. White potato skins are mildly toxic while sweet potato skins aren't. Plus, a lot of people leave their white potato skins on (because they're delicious!) and take off their sweet potato skins (because they taste like a leather catcher's mitt!). It could be the glycoalkaloids in the white potato skin.
              Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
                Yes PB sorry, you are so right. Im just sick of reading this BS. I just need to stay away from other threads.
                Bowing out.
                I think you should take 20 mins to actually read both links before being instantly dismissive. It's important to have a well-rounded viewpoint.
                Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
                  Yes PB sorry, you are so right. Im just sick of reading this BS. I just need to stay away from other threads.
                  Bowing out.
                  That was about both sides of the carb wars, not just you Ayla. FWIW, I agree with everything you said. Choco just does not get that his reality=/=universal reality.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                    I think you should take 20 mins to actually read both links before being instantly dismissive. It's important to have a well-rounded viewpoint.
                    By which you mean she should agree with you instead of going with what works for her.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                      I think you should take 20 mins to actually read both links before being instantly dismissive. It's important to have a well-rounded viewpoint.
                      I do, I have tried your way, and it does NOT work for me. What part of that don't you get? I don't think reading an article is going to tell me what I don't know about my body.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                        That was about both sides of the carb wars, not just you Ayla. FWIW, I agree with everything you said. Choco just does not get that his reality=/=universal reality.
                        OK thanks. No he does not get it.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                          Another issue could also be the skins on the white potatoes. White potato skins are mildly toxic while sweet potato skins aren't. It could be the glycoalkaloids in the white potato skin.
                          A point made in the post by Dr Ede that I linked.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                            That was about both sides of the carb wars, not just you Ayla. FWIW, I agree with everything you said. Choco just does not get that his reality=/=universal reality.
                            Please. This thread is about an illness when eating starch. The first reply is "carbohydrate intolerance." That is a ridiculous statement. Could you imagine if someone around here suggested a "meat intolerance?" Maybe you'll accept an allergy to eggs. Maybe an intolerance to fish or shellfish. But no one around here is going to accept an intolerance to all forms of animal protein - they are going to look for an underlying condition causing it.

                            The same thing holds true for "carbohydrate intolerance." It doesn't exist. If you an issue with all-form starch, there is an underlying condition, most likely a gut flora/intestinal permeability issue caused by something entirely different that must be corrected. You can't have it both ways.
                            Originally posted by Ayla2010 View Post
                            OK thanks. No he does not get it.
                            I get it 100%. You're promoting a line of thinking. You're against simply eating whole foods - you have a paradigm, just like the overwhelming majority of people in the paleosphere with a product to push. I'm not saying you're pushing a product, but you clearly have an agenda. This is about eating whole foods, not adhering to a particular set of macronutrients. Ratios do not exist. They shouldn't exist.

                            If you feel better at 70% fat, it will likely be a temporary feeling. It'll pass once you become deficient in a nutrient(s) from the exclusionary dieting. Maybe it'll take 3 months. Maybe it'll take 3 years. Maybe you'll just age more quickly from the chronic state of gluconeogenesis. Maybe you'll develop food intolerances and be unable to digest any fruit or starch in a few years because your gut flora will begin to die off. Maybe you'll become hypothyroid. Maybe you'll develop aches and pains from a buildup of too much unsaturated fat in your tissues. Your amazing feeling could be because:

                            1.) You're bypassing a broken metabolic pathway and you're feeling better running on "backup."
                            2.) You're actually in a state of chronic stress, which is elevating your adrenaline and serotonin, leading to a "high" feeling.

                            A lot of people feel like this when they first go low carb paleo...and it is temporary. It happened to me. All I'm saying is be careful and do your best to vary your diet. We're made to eat a bit of everything (as we're opportunistic omnivores), so dieting outside of that realm can be problematic unless you're very careful.
                            Last edited by ChocoTaco369; 01-13-2013, 10:43 PM.
                            Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              So everyone who feels best in ketosis has something wrong with them? OK, thanks for letting us know.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                                So everyone who feels best in ketosis has something wrong with them? OK, thanks for letting us know.
                                Yes this.
                                Seriously Chaco? Seriously. Honestly this is BS and right now I am fuming. I shouldn't care what you think, I don't know you from a bar of soap. But PLEASE PLEASE do NOT tell me that what I am doing is not right, as I know it is right for ME!

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