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Curing candida on a paleo diet

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
    "Internet gossip", yet we're the only ones who are actually posting solid scientific evidence. You talk of mindset, yet this is yours and Paleobird's: "LOL YOU IDIOTS DON'T KNOW ANYTHING *FINGERS IN EARS* LALALA NOT LISTENING I'M DONE" How old are you people? This is just a disgraceful, childish response.
    What do you have to prove by perpetuating this behavior then, if I may ask?

    Just wondering, but if we're so childish around here all the time, then what do you gain from sticking around and encoraging it? The best way to stop childish arguments is to, you know, not engage in them. But I don't see you making that logical connection.

    And by the way... Speaking of stubborn... Lord knows one of us try to tell you that sugar or caffeine (at least at the levels you consume) might be bad for you. You'll come back with 101 reasons why this isn't so. So, what then? It's not stubborn for you to defend your own viewpoints, but suddenly, when anyone ELSE does it, it's because we don't want to "hear alternate opinions"? Seems we're not the only ones who have strong opinions on a subject or two.

    There's nothing wrong with believing in something, especially if it's been working really well for you. Wanting to seek out evidence that proves this both for yourself and for others is only natural. From what I've seen, you are NO different or any better than the rest of us in this regard.

    Anyway, that's just my own piece on the matter. I'm out. Cheers!
    "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
      What do you have to prove by perpetuating this behavior then, if I may ask?

      Just wondering, but if we're so childish around here all the time, then what do you gain from sticking around and encoraging it? The best way to stop childish arguments is to, you know, not engage in them. But I don't see you making that logical connection.

      And by the way... Speaking of stubborn... Lord knows one of us try to tell you that sugar or caffeine (at least at the levels you consume) might be bad for you. You'll come back with 101 reasons why this isn't so. So, what then? It's not stubborn for you to defend your own viewpoints, but suddenly, when anyone ELSE does it, it's because we don't want to "hear alternate opinions"? Seems we're not the only ones who have strong opinions on a subject or two.

      There's nothing wrong with believing in something, especially if it's been working really well for you. Wanting to seek out evidence that proves this both for yourself and for others is only natural. From what I've seen, you are NO different or any better than the rest of us in this regard.

      Anyway, that's just my own piece on the matter. I'm out. Cheers!
      Said nothing of being stubborn, just close-minded. If they were to post something substantial to debate with rather than just turning away and ignoring it while dismissing it as stupid internet gossip based on their own personal beliefs that would be one thing. But it's obvious they can't refute any of it.

      I could just leave, but why? I'm having fun playing the contrarian.
      Make America Great Again

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
        Said nothing of being stubborn, just close-minded. If they were to post something substantial to debate with rather than just turning away and ignoring it while dismissing it as stupid internet gossip based on their own personal beliefs that would be one thing. But it's obvious they can't refute any of it.

        I could just leave, but why? I'm having fun playing the contrarian.
        Hmmm... Well, just to play the "contrarian" and Devil's advocate myself for a second then...

        I've seen you make the case multiple times that adrenal fatigue is a bogus concept and yet I've never seen you offer ANY evidence to back that claim up.

        Remember, we can't take it seriously if you don't offer evidence to back up every little contention you make.

        [Not trying to argue with you about it, just "playing the contrarian." ]
        "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
          Hmmm... Well, just to play the "contrarian" and Devil's advocate myself for a second then...

          I've seen you make the case multiple times that adrenal fatigue is a bogus concept and yet I've never seen you offer ANY evidence to back that claim up.

          Remember, we can't take it seriously if you don't offer evidence to back up every little contention you make.

          [Not trying to argue with you about it, just "playing the contrarian." ]
          Adrenal fatigue is based on a vague collection of symptoms that can be caused by ANYTHING. It has no scientific evidence itself to suggest these symptoms are being caused by your adrenal glands being drained.

          With a functioning thyroid your adrenals have very little to do with anything at all.
          Make America Great Again

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Derpamix
            Adrenal fatigue is based on a vague collection of symptoms that can be caused by ANYTHING.
            Much like "candida".
            Last edited by Timthetaco; 12-02-2012, 10:47 AM.

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by emmie View Post
              Paleobird-
              Just a note to say that I admire you and believe you are wasting your time with these people.

              Anyone who would question the ketogenic diet for epilepsy obviously lives in a different dimension of reality.

              And as someone with Hashimoto's, I refuse to engage with the nonsense that low-carb eating 'causes' thyroid problems. Like your experience with breast cancer, I've researched my illness extensively through serious medical sources--not Internet gossip--and there is absolutely no causative effect. The lowering of T3 is a perfectly natural function that is not the least pathological.

              Trying to engage in serious discourse as you've been doing is, IMO, futile, given the mindset of these people.
              Thank you emmie. And yes, I agree it is futile. This is like arguing with Durianrider except one who proudly pounds 30 cups of coffee a day plus Coke plus candy and then presumes to give out health advice.

              I really don't care if any one individual wants to be that way. I only care about the potential for confusion it might cause to any newbie around the forum.

              And "being contrarian" doesn't necessarily further the debate or encourage conceptual growth when it is pure nonsense being spouted. If I walked into a gathering of planetary geologists and insisted loudly and vehemently that the earth is flat, it really wouldn't be helping anything at all.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Paleobird View Post

                And "being contrarian" doesn't necessarily further the debate or encourage conceptual growth when it is pure nonsense being spouted. If I walked into a gathering of planetary geologists and insisted loudly and vehemently that the earth is flat, it really wouldn't be helping anything at all.
                What a horrible metaphor.

                Prove why it's nonsense then. I'll gladly eat my own words if you could, but you can't. All you can do is straw man, and the funniest thing is you can't explain why coffee, mexican coke and candy are bad for you. Must be all dat sugah!!11

                Considering my lab results, this is just hilarious.
                Make America Great Again

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Zach View Post
                  Thats all well and good that it has been discussed around here, i had no doubt that it would since almost all online community sufferers of hypothyroid originated from a paleo/primal diet.
                  This is purely anecdotal but everyone that I know in real life that has hypothyroid has never eaten anything remotely paleo/primal or even low carb.
                  Life is death. We all take turns. It's sacred to eat during our turn and be eaten when our turn is over. RichMahogany.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                    Much like "candida".
                    Hey. The original topic for a change. Yay! What a concept.

                    FWIW, I do think that "candida overgrowth" is massively over-diagnosed. Yes, it is a real condition but is really rather rare. For instance having a prolonged stint on heavy duty antibiotics can cause it.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                      Hey. The original topic for a change. Yay! What a concept.

                      FWIW, I do think that "candida overgrowth" is massively over-diagnosed. Yes, it is a real condition but is really rather rare. For instance having a prolonged stint on heavy duty antibiotics can cause it.
                      My mother-in-law actually has a medically diagnosed case of this right now after spending about 2 months in the hospital on antibiotics and almost dying from a ruptured appendix.

                      She is a prescription to kill off the excess fungal infection, on prescription strength probiotics (VSL#3 DS) to re-establish a healthy gut flora/establish a healthy flora in general (the gut is a base of this, candida bloom in the gut candida bloom everywhere) that can maintain itself and keep the candidia to a normal level, and a very strict diet. That diet does NOT include drinking cokes or eating gummies.

                      Originally posted by Urban Forager View Post
                      This is purely anecdotal but everyone that I know in real life that has hypothyroid has never eaten anything remotely paleo/primal or even low carb.
                      In addition to this most people who say "paleo causes/caused thyroid problems" never had any sort of test that even checked or confirmed any low T3 or rT3... like adrenal fatigue they went by a vague list of symptoms and said "OMG I think I'm hypothyroid!" When the reality is that often the same symptoms can be caused by many other factors such as poor sleep, stress, over exertion or working out, eating too little/chronic calorie restriction (yes this happens when people are trying to bust off weight too quickly), etc... and these same things (stress, etc) can also cause low T3/rT3 readings independent of any low carb eating plan. As a matter of fact all of these symptoms are very common on high carb/low fat plans as well... including the oft cited hair loss.
                      As a matter of fact the one and only instance I have personal experience with was a friend who did CW, high carb, low fat... hair fell out, all symptoms commonly cited of "hypothyroid" fatigue, cold, tired, dry skin, her face/eyes were really pale and puffy at the end, she felt weak, depressed, forgetful, missing periods even though she was far from under weight still... the book! She absolutely destroyed herself. She was a physical wreck.
                      She didn't have "hypothyroidism" she was abusing her body by eating too little calorically, working out too much (chronic cardio could have been her middle name), and basically giving herself malnutrition.

                      This can happen to people on any diet who get too focused on weight loss instead of on health.
                      Yes, I have even seen people I thought were that obsessed on these boards. But that doesn't make Primal/Paleo bad. And it doesn't make low carb "evil".
                      Does it work for everyone? No... every person has to find the level of macros that fits with their personal needs. But low-carb in itself is not inherently harmful.
                      Last edited by cori93437; 12-02-2012, 12:58 PM.
                      “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                      ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                      And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Just to add my own two cents on the hyperthyroidism debate...

                        Carb intake may have some SLIGHT impact on thyroid function as related to the conversion of T3, yes, but whether this matters in a low carb state is still not proven.

                        My opinion is that the biggest impact on thyroid function is overall caloric intake. This means that even people eating a low fat, high carb diet can still develop thyroid problems if they severely restrict calories to the point that they aren't consuming enough calories for their body to function.

                        This does not contradict any sort of benefits found from fasting or "caloric restriction" however. This would have to be chronically long term caloric restriction to cause the thyroid issues for which an occasional fast or lower calorie day wouldn't effect.

                        So who's at greatest risk for getting thyroid issues then? Chronic low calorie dieters, people with bulimia or anorexia (long term calorie avoidance), people who fast for extended periods when they're already extremely lean (not enough fat stores to sustain the energy for proper thyroid function).

                        So, basically... Don't be a chronic dieter, shift things around with occasional high calorie days, limit fasts to reasonable lengths (based on your body's composition), and if you think you might be developing an eating disorder then get it treated right away. These will prevent the major causes of thyroid issues.

                        Of course, this is a gross oversimplification that avoids the whole "goitrogen" issue (which has been hotly debated anyway), the issue of flouride intake (from toothpaste, water, ect.) on thyroid function, and other chemical and environmental factors relating to proper thyroid function. I don't doubt those can have an impact, but I think they are not the leading causes of thyroid issues.

                        Now, back to candida...

                        I think candida is a real (and serious) condition to have. However, i agree that it is hard to diagnose because its symptoms are not readily apparent as being caused by the candida. Its symptoms have been linked to any number of other causes as well. The way to determine if what you have is TRUE candida, you have to determine what the most likely cause of the symptoms are. For example, if you think that long term use of an antibiotic might be the cause, then it might be candida. But even then, it's tough to know for sure.

                        Everyone has their own opinions on how best to treat it, but I did have a friend who was believed to have had it (it was never 100% ascertained). After his diagnoses, both his doctor and a nutritionist recommended he go extremely low carb until symptoms of the disease subsided. He went almost zero carb for about a month and by the end was feeling MUCH better. Of course, he was also eating a lot of fermented veggies (as recommended by the nutritionist) to cure gut flora imbalances so this may have played a role as well...

                        And no, a month of eggs, meat, and fermented veggies did NOT leave him with chronically low T3 levels and hyperthyroid symptoms, FWIW.
                        "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Derpamix View Post
                          My problem is you're rude and arrogant. This also isn't a private clubhouse, I have just as much right to be here as anyone else. You should welcome conflicting interest for the sake of bettering health. Inquisitive minds are what drive the world forward. I actually eat plenty of whole foods without modern chemical assistance btw, just because it's known to cause allergens.
                          Agreed. Paleobird is extremely rude and arrogant and throws her ketosticks out of the pram whenever anybody shares positive results about eating more than half a potato in one sitting.

                          She is self-obsessed, and has clearly depressed her basal metabolic rate through chronic low-calorie dieting, which is obviously not primal.

                          If you're doing well on gummy bears and coke from time to time - all power to ya!

                          I've experienced candida overgrowth and had to pay to consult a private doctor to help cure it, as there is no treatment available on our NHS which I pay for via the taxation system. It's no longer a problem - I can even enjoy the odd gummy bear or two ;-)
                          F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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                          • #73
                            something i've been wondering

                            for those that say trying to rid the body of candida causes it to explode/spread/be more problemistic, would you say that eating an excess of antifungal foods or take antifungal meds like above ^ would be good or bad

                            to try and be less confusing, if low carbing is NOT helpful then what would eating a ton of coconut products be
                            beautiful
                            yeah you are

                            Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
                            lol

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by paleo-bunny View Post
                              Agreed. Paleobird is extremely rude and arrogant and throws her ketosticks out of the pram whenever anybody shares positive results about eating more than half a potato in one sitting.
                              She is self-obsessed, and has clearly depressed her basal metabolic rate through chronic low-calorie dieting, which is obviously not primal.
                              If you're doing well on gummy bears and coke from time to time - all power to ya!
                              I've experienced candida overgrowth and had to pay to consult a private doctor to help cure it, as there is no treatment available on our NHS which I pay for via the taxation system. It's no longer a problem - I can even enjoy the odd gummy bear or two ;-)
                              Where do you store all that negativity? Or do you just produce more as needed?

                              I eat on a ketogenic diet for a medical condition. I have often said how wonderful I feel on it but I have never once said that everyone else should follow it too.
                              You know nothing about my basal metabolic rate. But yes, it probably is lower than most people because of my epilepsy medication. I have never done "chronic low calorie dieting". How incredibly presumptuous of you.

                              I really hope you get some help with your issues. You are one extremely sad lady.
                              Last edited by Paleobird; 12-02-2012, 03:34 PM.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Paleobird, don't let the shitstorm get to you.

                                The more you respond to them, the more justified they feel. Just let it go. You know you are doing what works for you and damn be to all of the others that think otherwise. Do you feel good about yourself? Great, then you're already ahead of the game. Don't let the bad moods of others rub off on you.

                                Sometimes it's best to quit while you're still ahead. If some people don't want to see things the way you see them, that's fine, let them be that way. You don't have to see things the way they see them either.
                                Last edited by Drumroll; 12-02-2012, 03:36 PM.
                                "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

                                Comment

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