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The Potato Diet....criticisms and metabolic theory

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  • The Potato Diet....criticisms and metabolic theory

    So, I see a tator thread with the stipulation that its for people who have taken the challenge....and a tator thread that introduced and it seems both are a bit "chilly" to those who would postulate on the mechanisms through which the diet works. So post em here. Vent your questions, concerns, and metabolic theory here without fear of being labeled some sort of diet zealot/tator hater! Why do some not see any loss of weight even when eating at a very obvious deficit? How can you lose 1lb a day (3500 calories)? Does that mean there is a thermogenic effect to all that starch? Is it water weight?......Hey there is lots to explore. Have at it without fear!

  • #2
    It reminds me of the cabbage soup diet, which I did once and felt like absolute shit doing.

    PS I did ask that question in one thread about using cabbage, but no one clued in that I was actually challenging the idea. I don't see how it can be good for you. I mean if the idea is that Grok ate tubers because there was nothing else, then weren't the Groks eating them to simply survive - as in keep from imminent death - cause there is no meat around. Sure I'm not going to die if I eat potatoes for 10 days, but that doesn't mean it's good for my health or optimal. And if they're supposed to be eaten with no fat... aargh that would be awful...
    Last edited by jojohaligo; 11-11-2012, 07:10 PM.
    Female, age 51, 5' 9"
    SW - 183 (Jan 22, 2012), CW - 159, GW - healthy.

    Met my 2012 goals by losing 24 pounds.
    2013 goals are to get fit and strong!

    Comment


    • #3
      Ok, how about this?

      And there are documented cases of people losing significant amounts of weight and improving metabolic parameters by eating nothing but potatoes. For example, Chris Voigt lost 21 pounds over the course of two months by eating only potatoes and not deliberately restricting calories. Furthermore, his fasting glucose decreased by 10 mg/dL (104 to 94 mg/dL), his serum triglycerides dropped by nearly 50%, his HDL cholesterol increased slightly, and his calculated LDL cholesterol dropped by a stunning 41% (142 to 84 mg/dL).
      That was from Chris Kressler http://chriskresser.com/is-starch-a-...ent-or-a-toxin

      OH wait, that's a pro. Sorry.

      Ok, how about this from our one and only Mark?

      Fall Foods: Why Seasonal Eating Primes the Body for Fat Burning | Mark's Daily Apple

      OH wait, that's a pro also.

      Ok, how about this also from Mark?

      Carb Refeeding and Weight Loss | Mark's Daily Apple

      Oh wait, that's a pro also. I guess pros are all I got so I won't post those here.
      65lbs gone and counting!!

      Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm gonna go ahead and debate myself just in case nobody with positive tator stories show up. I actually hope they do. I'm not looking to just bash the deal, but I would like to have a place where people don't think we are just being hateful or something. I have questioned the low protein portion of the diet. Pklopp made an interesting metabolic observation here into how weight loss may actually occur through a mechanism of lean mass break down. If I find it I might repost it. I think that is actually the scariest proposition.....that all this very fast weight loss is through muscle, bone, and organ....rather than fat. I'm not saying it actually is, but the speed of loss .5-1lb/day is nothing short of miraculous. Its either water weight, increased metabolic rate, or a lot of lean mass IMO. Most current studies indicate protein as the key to retaining lean mass. Although potatoes contain "complete" proteins (10%) you are still eating only 10% or calories at a SEVERE deficit.....this is still a huge deficiency in protein.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by gopintos View Post
          Ok, how about this?



          That was from Chris Kressler Is starch a beneficial nutrient or a toxin? You be the judge.

          OH wait, that's a pro. Sorry.

          Ok, how about this from our one and only Mark?

          Fall Foods: Why Seasonal Eating Primes the Body for Fat Burning | Mark's Daily Apple

          OH wait, that's a pro also.

          Ok, how about this also from Mark?

          Carb Refeeding and Weight Loss | Mark's Daily Apple

          Oh wait, that's a pro also. I guess pros are all I got so I won't post those here.
          Nah, you can post here! I'm just trying to make it OK to theorize and even question without being told that your just being hateful. I would love of for the fella who started this (forgot the name Otzi posted) or anyone with a word on metabolizm to join!

          I missed the one by Chris, but the two from Mark are in the context of a primal diet and surely do not exclude all other foods for just tators for two weeks. This isn't about potatoes as a PART of your diet....its about potatoes exclusively. I don't even think its gonna hurt you to do it for two weeks.....heck I've fasted for near that time. I'm just opening up the line of opinion and theory without hurting anyones feelings (hopefully).

          Oh, and I heard that Voigt fella had to discontinue his experiment due to "accelerated" weight loss....something that would fit with Pklopps statement on lean mass.
          Last edited by Neckhammer; 11-11-2012, 08:00 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
            Its either water weight, increased metabolic rate, or a lot of lean mass IMO. Most current studies indicate protein as the key to retaining lean mass. Although potatoes contain "complete" proteins (10%) you are still eating only 10% or calories at a SEVERE deficit.....this is still a huge deficiency in protein.
            Ok, I know this is going to come as a shock from my posts, but I am not a scientist nor do I know all the technical this's and that's and big words that most of you use ... I know shocker.

            So in basic terms that I understand, I really do not see a difference in eating tators for a few days to a few weeks, and straight up fasting - either absolute or with things like CO, kraut - all of which do not have any protein, right? Is it not true that in the absence of protein that your body will do a little housekeeping first before it goes after your muscle? I can't remember the number of days now, but seems like there was a rough guess as to the number of days that it was safe to fast before you saw any detriments to your muscles.

            Would this not be the same? I just dont see how eating a only one food is so much worse than eating NO food when fasting. Or only eating bone broth when fasting. Or only eating CO or kraut when fasting.

            Not trying to be hateful. And maybe I am just overly simple minded.
            65lbs gone and counting!!

            Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

            Comment


            • #7
              I am curious how people can lose so much weight on just potatoes. It seems like they are losing more than a simple calorie deficit could account for.

              At the same time, however, not a single person has posted a before and after picture. At least tell us if your measurements have changed or something. I don't find scale weight by itself to tell you very much.
              Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

              Comment


              • #8
                I don't like diets. Eat clean, move slowly, sprint and lift heavy things.
                I appreciate the some people have screwed up their body after years of CW and need to tweek things but live the lifestyle and all will be well.
                Eating primal is not a diet, it is a way of life.
                PS
                Don't forget to play!

                Comment


                • #9
                  @ sbhikes...and tell us how your tastebuds are fairing....lol
                  Eating primal is not a diet, it is a way of life.
                  PS
                  Don't forget to play!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by gopintos View Post
                    Ok, I know this is going to come as a shock from my posts, but I am not a scientist nor do I know all the technical this's and that's and big words that most of you use ... I know shocker.

                    So in basic terms that I understand, I really do not see a difference in eating tators for a few days to a few weeks, and straight up fasting - either absolute or with things like CO, kraut - all of which do not have any protein, right? Is it not true that in the absence of protein that your body will do a little housekeeping first before it goes after your muscle? I can't remember the number of days now, but seems like there was a rough guess as to the number of days that it was safe to fast before you saw any detriments to your muscles.

                    Would this not be the same? I just dont see how eating a only one food is so much worse than eating NO food when fasting. Or only eating bone broth when fasting. Or only eating CO or kraut when fasting.

                    Not trying to be hateful. And maybe I am just overly simple minded.
                    Perfectly good point! Maybe a periodic potato fast isn't so bad in the sense of what they call "autophagy". This is when your body does the cleaning you speak of gopoints. To be quite honest I don't know. I know that with fasting autophagy occurs and does the cleanup....a big plus for the IF crowd. Does this event happen with a steady supply of starch though? Does it only require a reduced amount of protein? Or would the consistent supply of glucose and insulin from the potatoes nullify that effect. A lot of study on longevity seems to indicate that lower insulin levels (carbs AND protein) along with low blood glucose levels to be best.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                      At least tell us if your measurements have changed or something. I don't find scale weight by itself to tell you very much.
                      I did post my measurement decreases for last month. I lost 10 inches in the places that I measure. Now... I did not do days on end of tators. I came off my LC/HF and I was transitioning into starches via PHD recommendation. Then the tator thread hit so it was perfect timing. So I did a couple days of tators. Since then I have just included more tators - most daily, or start out eating tators but end up with steak for dinner.

                      My weight loss was like 7 lbs, which was more than the previous 3 months or more, of High Fat, Low Carb, Moderate Protein. Since the 23rd, I have lost about 7 lbs also. And the thing is, now I feel like exercising. So I am doing some form of ST daily, and I am doing Tabata 2 or 3 times. I did not feel like doing any of that before. I know I should have but the higher the fat, the lower my desire to do anything physical (and at the highest fat, I was gaining and then having to fast to get it back off) I sort of blamed it on the heat of the summer, but I did not even want to go jump in the pond with the kids.

                      I am in a new jean size also. I bought some boots that I tried on before but I didnt buy them because I couldnt zip them up my calves, but the other day I could. So I bought 2 new pairs And when I look down my belly, I can see ummm parts I havent seen for awhile.
                      65lbs gone and counting!!

                      Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by gopintos View Post
                        I did post my measurement decreases for last month. I lost 10 inches in the places that I measure. Now... I did not do days on end of tators. I came off my LC/HF and I was transitioning into starches via PHD recommendation. Then the tator thread hit so it was perfect timing. So I did a couple days of tators. Since then I have just included more tators - most daily, or start out eating tators but end up with steak for dinner.

                        My weight loss was like 7 lbs, which was more than the previous 3 months or more, of High Fat, Low Carb, Moderate Protein. Since the 23rd, I have lost about 7 lbs also. And the thing is, now I feel like exercising. So I am doing some form of ST daily, and I am doing Tabata 2 or 3 times. I did not feel like doing any of that before. I know I should have but the higher the fat, the lower my desire to do anything physical (and at the highest fat, I was gaining and then having to fast to get it back off) I sort of blamed it on the heat of the summer, but I did not even want to go jump in the pond with the kids.

                        I am in a new jean size also. I bought some boots that I tried on before but I didnt buy them because I couldnt zip them up my calves, but the other day I could. So I bought 2 new pairs And when I look down my belly, I can see ummm parts I havent seen for awhile.
                        So you have added tators to your diet and stopped worrying about fat...and it is what you do for your lifestyle. Totally glad its working for you and I own a copy of the PHD too. Not really what I'm talking about though . I'm talking about those that eat ONLY tators for 14 days and lose 7-14lbs in that time. I'm talking about the mechanism of weight loss in these individuals. Fat, lean mass, or water. I think it is an important differentiation that nobody has bothered to make. We all know that glycogen depletion and water weight loss is an inherent portion of the 14lbs you may lose in the first 14 days of a VLC diet....why would you question this any less? Could it be all fat? Just wondering.

                        I'm an X-wrestler....honest to God I could lose 10lbs in under 6 hours if I had to. That doesn't mean its healthy OR fat that I'm loosing.
                        Last edited by Neckhammer; 11-11-2012, 08:30 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Good thread. I have been trying to 'deconstruct' the rapid weight-loss also. I went to the Perfect Health Diet website and tried to get Paul Jaminet to come here and engage. I doubt he will, but this is what he said:

                          The Safe Starches Panel from AHS 2012 | Perfect Health Diet

                          Tatertot November 10, 2012 at 12:41 am

                          A whole bunch of folks on Mark’s Daily Apple are eating potatoes for 7-14 days, nothing else allowed, and losing fat at amazing levels. Would love to get one of you guys on our thread to see what you think of our fat-busting trick. Please click link above!
                          Reply

                          John Ashcroft November 10, 2012 at 1:27 am

                          That’s an interesting undertaking, and it must be manageable seeing as potatoes are surprisingly satiating.

                          In the past I managed to lose weight very quickly by eating loads of pasta and some beans with only mild calorie restriction, so I can believe potatoes would work too, if not better.

                          But I don’t think I’ll attempt again. Not out of concern of high carb but rather concern for too low fat. There’s no way very low fat can be good for digestion and nutrient absorption, barring some specific disorder. And then the hearsay about possible relations between low-fat and gallstones…

                          I think I’ll stick to the occasional day of high-carb (potato) feeding; that seems to stimulate the metabolism enough. I don’t really need to lose the remaining weight any faster. But good luck with that! I don’t really have any doubt that it can work for weight loss. Plus it must be damn cheap.
                          Reply


                          Paul Jaminet November 10, 2012 at 7:39 am

                          Hi Tater,

                          It’s certainly an effective weight loss tactic. The all-potato diet does produce lipid deficiencies however, so I personally would recommend eating egg yolks and some liver with it (at a minimum). You’ll still lose weight, a little slower perhaps, but it will be healthier.

                          As you know, I recommend going a little slower, but being very well nourished from the beginning – eating basically your diet for life, slightly calorie restricted. See our weight loss version: Perfect Health Diet: Weight Loss Version | Perfect Health Diet.
                          Last edited by tatertot; 11-11-2012, 08:35 PM.
                          Find me on Facebook!

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                          • #14
                            Seems he places it soley on satiety. Good point in the case of taters. I'd be interested in his response to the .5-1lb a day portion. Would the insufficient fat and nutrient uptake he seems to allude to have anything to do with it?

                            Could you really be forced to use body fat! and stored nutrients to compensate......or would your metabolism work at an excessive rate simply in respect to these deficits....or it could not matter at all

                            Please those who have google scholar...use it...i'm just shootin from the hip.
                            Last edited by Neckhammer; 11-11-2012, 08:44 PM.

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                            • #15
                              I like to think this diet hack works best for guys like me. I am about 18% body fat, my exercise is more geared toward bodyweight and play as opposed to going to the gym and lifting weights or crossfitting.

                              I lost 10 pounds in 14 days and didn't regain any after a month of regular eating now. I think I was eating at a big deficit and tapped directly into my fat reserves for energy. I have a few friends experimenting with this also and am seeing similar results with them.

                              I see NO drawbacks to doing this for 7-14 days a couple times a year to help with weight maintenance if needed.
                              Find me on Facebook!

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