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The Potato Diet....criticisms and metabolic theory

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  • high intracranial pressure... i have to be very careful about keeping it under control.

    All of the exercise i do has to be broken into smaller workable sections or modified to prevent problems with dizziness and me causing flare-ups/increasing my issues... but I have found ways to work around it as much as possible.
    Last edited by cori93437; 11-22-2012, 12:26 AM.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by cori93437 View Post
      Evidently you are clueless. My own struggles with serious neurological illness over the past year plus are all over these forums.
      While I'm not capable of 'great feats of strength' as if I'm some sort of body builder wannabe I have managed to move slowly with frequency, and I do Yoga and body weight exercises, plus some exercises with hand and bar weights, in my home.
      I have not lost muscle at all... I'm not bulging and rippling like Arnold, but I do not want to be either.

      I was pointing out that you showed up/piped in only to have a go at someone.
      Crudely at best.
      Then offered no evidence of your own on the topic.
      And your own numbers don't really make for impressive evidence of such great professed knowledge.

      I'm actually not competitive at all.
      I believe we should all be happy at the rate we lose... not force our bodies to be what they are not.
      And that losing slowly is much preferred to this stupid crash potato business.
      My point in bringing up my own slow loss was to point out that your numbers don't infer that you have any greater knowledge of metabolism function than others posting here.

      The only way to know how much muscle I have gained would be if I had had an appropriate measure taken when I started such as a dunk in a hydrostatic tank or DEXA scan. I did not... so anything I said would be pure speculation(as would anyone's guess). I've lost fat which makes muscle more visible... and I've gained muscle through more movement (walking) and increasing difficulty of body weight exercise and weights.
      Admittedly I do not yet sprint yet as I still have neurological issues which prevents such activity.

      Also, you seem excessively negative.
      Have a nice day. I mean that. You should try.
      You're the ignorant neghead. You should try working full time and curing chronic illnesses. I've achieved that through determined application and hard work.

      My point was rhetorical ... you clearly lack the empathy to appreciate why anyone would be doing this differently than you. It's not all about you!

      As for your pathetic stabs at my scientific understanding ... those are clearly very hypocritical as you show no genuine interest in discussing the science whatsoever. Whereas I do and have the scientific credentials.

      Grow up.
      F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

      Comment


      • I eat potatoes every other day and for some reason feel really good on them. You do have to cook the heck out of them though to get the starch broken down.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by paleo-bunny View Post
          You're the ignorant neghead. You should try working full time and curing chronic illnesses. I've achieved that through determined application and hard work.

          My point was rhetorical ... you clearly lack the empathy to appreciate why anyone would be doing this differently than you. It's not all about you!

          As for your pathetic stabs at my scientific understanding ... those are clearly very hypocritical as you show no genuine interest in discussing the science whatsoever. Whereas I do and have the scientific credentials.

          Grow up.


          As I have stated many times on this forum I believe that every person has to find their own version of Primal/Paleo that works for them... carb level, protein level, fat level... foods eaten... all of it.
          However I have also stated that I'm against crash diets for obvious reasons, being what they are.
          But still, I believe that people make their own choices and respect that. I've never called anyone names or had a go at the "potato diet' itself other than a short and polite discussion with Otzi at the very beginning.

          I have not taken any stabs at your scientific understanding at all. I have simply stated that you were taking stabs at other people (calling names and such) without providing any explanation yourself to further the conversation, which is in fact where I joined this conversation... and the only reason I joined it.


          I'm obviously not going to go on the potato diet for good reason... I have a neurological issue which would not respond well to that situation.
          But other readers of the thread my have been helped greatly by a straight answer from you in the beginning instead of the snarking. I have no doubt that you have good things to contribute, I have seen evidence of such in other threads, but they often get lost among your negative attacks.

          I thought that this forum was about helping. *shrug*

          If you think I lack empathy... once again... you're clueless.
          I've lived with chronic illness for 15 years.
          Just over a year ago I was a low as anyone can get. I had a near death emergency experience where I was sternum rubbed multiple times and pissed myself. I had to use a wheelchair for months. I suffered loss of speech ability. I was having partial seizure like episodes daily... couldn't drive for over a year.
          We all do what we need to in order to regain our health.
          There are many paths, and they are all as individual as we are.

          I'm not sure why you think that you have achieved your cure of chronic illness through "determined application and hard work" and yet somehow I have not?

          Once again I don't understand the negativity.
          “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
          ~Friedrich Nietzsche
          And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

          Comment


          • I asked this in one of the other potato threads, but I figured I'd crosspost it here since this one is more science oriented.....

            Does anyone know if the super high potassium intake has the same effects as a high sodium intake with regards to dehydration/water balance? Maybe I'm not using enough salt to level out the potassium, because I generally feel very parched and the edges of my lips have even started to crack a bit. Very strange, considering I'm taking in almost 10,000mg of potassium and drinking plenty of water.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by cori93437 View Post
              As I have stated many times on this forum I believe that every person has to find their own version of Primal/Paleo that works for them... carb level, protein level, fat level... foods eaten... all of it.
              However I have also stated that I'm against crash diets for obvious reasons, being what they are.
              But still, I believe that people make their own choices and respect that. I've never called anyone names or had a go at the "potato diet' itself other than a short and polite discussion with Otzi at the very beginning.

              I have not taken any stabs at your scientific understanding at all. I have simply stated that you were taking stabs at other people (calling names and such) without providing any explanation yourself to further the conversation, which is in fact where I joined this conversation... and the only reason I joined it.


              I'm obviously not going to go on the potato diet for good reason... I have a neurological issue which would not respond well to that situation.
              But other readers of the thread my have been helped greatly by a straight answer from you in the beginning instead of the snarking. I have no doubt that you have good things to contribute, I have seen evidence of such in other threads, but they often get lost among your negative attacks.

              I thought that this forum was about helping. *shrug*

              If you think I lack empathy... once again... you're clueless.
              I've lived with chronic illness for 15 years.
              Just over a year ago I was a low as anyone can get. I had a near death emergency experience where I was sternum rubbed multiple times and pissed myself. I had to use a wheelchair for months. I suffered loss of speech ability. I was having partial seizure like episodes daily... couldn't drive for over a year.
              We all do what we need to in order to regain our health.
              There are many paths, and they are all as individual as we are.

              I'm not sure why you think that you have achieved your cure of chronic illness through "determined application and hard work" and yet somehow I have not?

              Once again I don't understand the negativity.
              You sound so much like a politician on the back-footer, it's hilarious.

              I've put a lot of effort into helping others and received thanks for that and for my scientific insight. I've not seen you go out of your way to help others. You seem more bent on posting off-topic self-obsessed tabloidy trivia.
              F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

              Comment


              • Except when you're sniping and refusing to answer questions I suppose...

                All I did above was be honest.

                I still don't understand why you are so bent on being negative.
                All the name calling and such...
                And you calling me self obsessed? My post about personal facts was a response to you posting your own personal tangent. I could have added much more. You got the basics without all the drama of exclamation points.
                What I was trying to get across is that we are in the same boat, chronic illness being what it is. Neither is superior to the other.
                It's not backpedaling by any means, just perhaps a recognition you are taking your own personal issues out on others in an inappropriate fashion.
                You seem to harbor a great deal of bitterness.

                I really do wish you the best, and hope you find a way to complete your recovery.
                Chronic illness often affects us in ways we don't understand and sometimes don't even realize.
                “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by cori93437 View Post
                  Except when you're sniping and refusing to answer questions I suppose...

                  All I did above was be honest.

                  I still don't understand why you are so bent on being negative.
                  All the name calling and such...
                  And you calling me self obsessed? My post about personal facts was a response to you posting your own personal tangent. I could have added much more. You got the basics without all the drama of exclamation points.
                  What I was trying to get across is that we are in the same boat, chronic illness being what it is. Neither is superior to the other.
                  It's not backpedaling by any means, just perhaps a recognition you are taking your own personal issues out on others in an inappropriate fashion.
                  You seem to harbor a great deal of bitterness.

                  I really do wish you the best, and hope you find a way to complete your recovery.
                  Chronic illness often affects us in ways we don't understand and sometimes don't even realize.
                  I forgive your bitchiness on your illness - it must be difficult to see others regain health and enjoy it.
                  F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by paleo-bunny View Post
                    I forgive your bitchiness on your illness - it must be difficult to see others regain health and enjoy it.

                    I don't even know what that means.
                    I've told you that I'm recovering (about 90% recovered from one autoimmune disease and 75% from the neurological illness, which is under maintenance)...
                    I find joy in all who find recovery as well, and have helped several people decide to transition to this WOE/WOL who had never heard of it because of my own success. Some of those people are local and having success with diminishing their symptoms as well, and we celebrate!

                    But I don't wish to argue with you anymore...
                    It's pointless, and I just kind of feel bad for you.
                    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                    And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                    Comment


                    • Feel bad for you too and your denial.
                      F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

                      Comment


                      • Surely what seems to have been missed on these discussions...and excuse me if I have not read it as I have been speed reading most...is that Ray Cronise - who originally purported the 'eat potatoes for two weeks' was actually discussing it on a post regarding gut flora. The subsequent weight loss seems to be a by product of what is a search for optimising your gut bacteria, which arguably is very low in many people......

                        just sayin'
                        Perseverance is not a long race; it is many short races one after the other.
                        Walter Elliot

                        I am a horse for a single harness, not cut out for tandem or teamwork; for well I know that in order to attain any definite goal, it is imperative that one person do the thinking and the commanding. Albert Einstein

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by badbunny View Post
                          Surely what seems to have been missed on these discussions...and excuse me if I have not read it as I have been speed reading most...is that Ray Cronise - who originally purported the 'eat potatoes for two weeks' was actually discussing it on a post regarding gut flora. The subsequent weight loss seems to be a by product of what is a search for optimising your gut bacteria, which arguably is very low in many people......

                          just sayin'
                          You may or may not have seen Otzi's thread on resistant starch with this sorta concept. I don't think that we know enough about how to optimize gut flora to be honest. Of what I do know it seems to me that there is not going to be a cookie cutter approach. There are going to be different types of gut dysbiosis with different optimal protocols.

                          For instance look at the SCD and GAPS program. Arguably, these are the most prominent and successfully used in restoring normal gut biome and activity. Starch is absolutely avoided in the first several levels (maybe the entire program actually). And this is all in the name of not feeding the microbes that feed on starch. These are said to be the most virulent of the gut. So instead you stick to monosacharrides that are easily absorbed and used rather than hanging out in the gut as fuel for the little buggers. At the same time your eating copious amounts of 24 hour yogurt and drinking plenty of bone broth to restore normal gut permiability and improve the biome.

                          I'm not sure where starch will actually fall in. I have not seen many studies that A. Show a change and gut biome in response to diet (though there were a couple in mice) B. Show how those changes would benefit health rather than just being an acclimation to your current energy source. Be interesting for sure.

                          One thing I do know is that up to 60% of fecal matter is gut bacteria. This is why a lot of low carbers "think" they are constipated. They don't feed the little buggers a ton, they don't reproduce a ton, and you don't poo a ton!
                          Last edited by Neckhammer; 01-22-2013, 08:21 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
                            You may or may not have seen Otzi's thread on resistant starch with this sorta concept. I don't think that we know enough about how to optimize gut flora to be honest. Of what I do know it seems to me that there is not going to be a cookie cutter approach. There are going to be different types of gut dysbiosis with different optimal protocols.

                            For instance look at the SCD and GAPS program. Arguably, these are the most prominent and successfully used in restoring normal gut biome and activity. Starch is absolutely avoided in the first several levels (maybe the entire program actually). And this is all in the name of not feeding the microbes that feed on starch. These are said to be the most virulent of the gut. So instead you stick to monosacharrides that are easily absorbed and used rather than hanging out in the gut as fuel for the little buggers. At the same time your eating copious amounts of 24 hour yogurt and drinking plenty of bone broth to restore normal gut permiability and improve the biome.

                            I'm not sure where starch will actually fall in. I have not seen many studies that A. Show a change and gut biome in response to diet (though there were a couple in mice) B. Show how those changes would benefit health rather than just being an acclimation to your current energy source. Be interesting for sure.

                            One thing I do know is that up to 60% of fecal matter is gut bacteria. This is why a lot of low carbers "think" they are constipated. They don't feed the little buggers a ton, they don't reproduce a ton, and you don't poo a ton!
                            These are important points Neckhammer. Your insides need the bacteria to break down starch IF you are going to continue to eat starch. But are they really needed otherwise? Yes, Otzi has showed that butyrate is produced by the RS feeding flora. But he has yet to show that the richest source of butyrate in the world, butter, would not give the same benefit.

                            On a mostly meat centered diet, I feel very well digestively speaking and somewhat "lighter" for lack of a better word in the abdominal area. Maybe it's not carrying around all those billions of bacteria.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                              But he has yet to show that the richest source of butyrate in the world, butter, would not give the same benefit.
                              I did. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...ml#post1066250

                              Butyrate from butter does not reach the colon.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                                I did. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...ml#post1066250

                                Butyrate from butter does not reach the colon.
                                No, all that says is that SCFAs are absorbed by the colon. The colon is also supplied with blood vessels which could bring the butyrate from the digested butter.

                                You had linked a blog post that was speculation city. "One wonders...." is not the same thing as the butyrate doesn't get there.

                                The rambling blog postings you linked included this "Cells lining the colon use butyrate as a major substrate for energy production in metabolic pathways that are not fully understood". That does not say that the butyrate couldn't have gotten there though the blood stream either, only that those cells use butyrate.

                                Umm. Still waiting for a reason not to just eat the butter and hold the potato.

                                Comment

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