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How to be primal when you are allergic to everything??

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  • How to be primal when you are allergic to everything??

    Hello all!

    I have been lurking around here and reading for awhile but I finally jumped in to post because I need some help for my sister.

    Little blurb about me so you know who you are talking to! I am 26, live in the San Diego area, Marine Corps wife and Ballerina. Have horse (I know some of you do too I see you posting about going trail riding!!) Very active naturally hubby and I love to hike, and the hour a day of barn chores involving shoveling you know what and hauling the wheelbarrow around makes for some good slow movement. 2 dance classes a week, an hour to an hour and a half, and ussually we are at the beach swimming or out hiking or something like that on the weekends. Despite this about 7 months ago I noticed my waist measurement creeping up, from 24-25 (depending on how much food I had in my tummy) to between 27 and 28, and I felt bloated and just yucky all the time. I went on a reading spree, first Fast Food Nation and Fat Land, that led me to Pollan led me to Taubes, led me to Cordain and Price and then eventually here. I threw out everything grain in the house and I lost the three inches and gained my abs back in about 3 weeks of fairly strict primal (I do include dairy). Since then I have tinkered here and there with ketosis, If, and carb levels, just kind of dialing things in and re learning to cook. We bought the "Make it Paleo" cookbook and I am never going back to all that pasta! (We are going to try making our first loaf of "fat bread" from free the animal this weekend.

    Last month I was visiting my sisters and we were out for a day at the disney parks. My youngest sister has always had problems with getting the shakes if she doesn't eat, seemed to not be all that blood sugar stable. She was getting like that and we went to get some food. She got one chicken strip into the meal (yeah the wheat breaded fried in god knows what kind) and she was feeling ill. That launched her into a cascade about how she has been feeling like total crap the last couple months, even by CW standards hasn't been eating well. She lost weight (she has none to spare, I think that 8 lbs put her under 100, her hip bones were way to prominent) She has been having major female issues and the doctor suspects endometriosis (fun right?). She talked about everytime she eats she feels like she just has this huge brick in her stomach, bloated, a touch sick, etc. So I asked her if she was willing to give this a try, I grabbed some of the success stories from MDA to show her (particularly the ones with ladies that have reversed similar hormonal conditions) and on oct 1st she embarked on a whole 30 type trial. We precooked her a ton of food, homemade chicken soup and beef stew, all with bone broth, ready to go stir fry just needing reheating, turkey ready to be added to salads. A couple weeks in I realized she was going waaaaaay to heavy on the fruit and not heavy enough on the fats and meats etc. She was having some bloating and digestion issues and I think she may be a tad foodmap sensative plus she had way to much fiber going on. (She was doing a fruit smoothie for breakfast, sometimes with eggs on the side, then a salad with turkey for lunch, then an apple and grapes for a snack, then some nuts, then stew for dinner, and no butter or fat or salt on anything. I plugged her into my fitday tracker and she was getting like 26 grams of fiber, most of my days are in the teens or lower maybe. I told her to butter and salt everything she could stand because she was craving the salt (happens when producing ketones right?) and cut back to one fruit or nut item/serving a day and make the rest up with meat and eggs) Overall she has been feeling loads better but here is the problem. She is allergic to like, everything. She is allergic to coconut (like anaphalactic shock allergic, not mildly allergic), allergic to avocado, allergic to bannana, papaya, mango, most tropical fruits, walnuts, some other nuts but I can't remember which at the moment, ok with roasted almonds, but raw not so much. Lets see what else... cucumbers, raw spinach (steamed or cooked ok, finding salad mix was fun) and raw brocholi, again cooked ok.

    So besides butter, how do I get her fat intake up? She can't have coconut (in fact she almost bit into a coconut flour rasberry muffin at my house because hubby forgot about the allergy and offered her one when she saw them in the fridge). She can't have avocado, and I don't want to introduce dairy right now because of the hormonal issues. She is using olive oil to cook most stuff in and on her salads. Like I said, overall she is better, I just want to see if anyone has other suggestions, tweaks, ideas, etc.

    She tends to undereat and be very low calorie sometimes, I worry occassionally about somewhat disordered eating. She has always been preoccupied with weight, always seems to think she has some to lose, although she has never weighed more then 110. so, I guess any advice on that front would be welcome as well.

    sorry for the novel! I hope you guys have some ideas for me!

  • #2
    I am guessing with that weight and your measurement, you are both very petite. I'm 5'6" and my narrowest waist measurement is 29" and I'm pretty slim at 120 lbs.

    Fatty cuts of meat are one obvious way to keep fat counts up. This is preferable if the meat is good quality, but if conventional meats don't bother her, then you could still use those (if price is an issue). And fish!

    If you visit Whole Foods or another health food store, you can probably find a nice selection of various cooking oils to work with so it's not all butter and olive oil. I don't really know what else is out there, but I know people like red palm oil (I think that's what it's called?). You may want to test that with her in case of allergy, however.
    Depression Lies

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    • #3
      Eggs (just eat the yolk), fatty fish like salmon if you can afford wild caught, and richer cuts of meats. Chicken with skin on (or just the chicken skin, fried, as a snack).
      F 28/5'4/100 lbs

      "I'm not a psychopath, I'm a high-functioning sociopath; do your research."

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      • #4
        It sounds like an eating disorder complicates things, too. Whether it is because of the anxiety over all of the allergies or due to real issues with body image I question if she is limiting food for reasons other than health. And, sometimes, when you get that thin you DO feel ill when you eat. Or it could be an excuse so she doesn't have to eat. I'm not implying she isn't allergic to some foods; I say this because I've been there with an eating disorder.

        Is coconut the only anaphylactic to and/or are these all IgE allergies? Has she ever been tested for celiac disease?

        I'd say eat fattier meats. Use ghee or butter. Grass fed meats to avoid more hormones. Eggs. Uncured bacon. Salmon! Pork sausage fried up. Add some leafy green that she can tolerate (baby kale?) and let it wilt. Put that into a ramekin or other small baking dish and have her crack an egg on top of it. Bake at 400 for 10 minutes. Yum.

        So sorry she is ill. You are a good sister for looking after her. Perhaps you can address the psychological issues if she is willing to go there. Maybe her MD already has?
        sigpic
        Age 48
        Start date: 7-5-12
        5'3"
        121lbs
        GOAL: to live to be a healthy and active 100


        "In health there is freedom. Health is the first of all liberties."
        Henri Frederic Amiel

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        • #5
          She may be allergic to the mycotoxins in the food. Like stated earlier, avocados, eggs, and fatty fish are great! You must make sure they are processed minimally. Rather than coconut, try MCT oil. I know that Dave Asprey has a great blog where he combines Coffee, MCT, and Grass-Fed Butter and it is very popular (and quite delicious .

          Allergies occur from food often occur from mycotoxins, which began building up when America began processing its food in the 70s. They suppress the immune system and bring about other harmful effects to the body. Minimize the processing and check out Dave's blog to minimize her allergic reactions to food.

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          • #6
            Pemmican is a good way to get a good amount of fat. U S Wellness is a good source if making it isn't an option, and you can't find any locally.

            Have you tried anything besides dietary changes to deal with the digestive issues? Probiotics? Enzymes? Robb Wolf talks a lot about it in his book. Some people even have to supplement with betaine hcl for a while.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by namelesswonder View Post
              I am guessing with that weight and your measurement, you are both very petite. I'm 5'6" and my narrowest waist measurement is 29" and I'm pretty slim at 120 lbs.

              Fatty cuts of meat are one obvious way to keep fat counts up. This is preferable if the meat is good quality, but if conventional meats don't bother her, then you could still use those (if price is an issue). And fish!

              If you visit Whole Foods or another health food store, you can probably find a nice selection of various cooking oils to work with so it's not all butter and olive oil. I don't really know what else is out there, but I know people like red palm oil (I think that's what it's called?). You may want to test that with her in case of allergy, however.

              Excuse the meat ignorant former vegatarian (ethical reasons can't stand cafo, now that I can get it if we eat plenty of local grass fed organic and pasture raised but I honestly refuse to support factory farming I stll eat veg when we go out) but could you give a list of what you mean by fatty cuts? I honestly don't know cuts for beans my husband usually handles that lol.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by PHaselow View Post
                It sounds like an eating disorder complicates things, too. Whether it is because of the anxiety over all of the allergies or due to real issues with body image I question if she is limiting food for reasons other than health. And, sometimes, when you get that thin you DO feel ill when you eat. Or it could be an excuse so she doesn't have to eat. I'm not implying she isn't allergic to some foods; I say this because I've been there with an eating disorder.

                Is coconut the only anaphylactic to and/or are these all IgE allergies? Has she ever been tested for celiac disease?

                I'd say eat fattier meats. Use ghee or butter. Grass fed meats to avoid more hormones. Eggs. Uncured bacon. Salmon! Pork sausage fried up. Add some leafy green that she can tolerate (baby kale?) and let it wilt. Put that into a ramekin or other small baking dish and have her crack an egg on top of it. Bake at 400 for 10 minutes. Yum.

                So sorry she is ill. You are a good sister for looking after her. Perhaps you can address the psychological issues if she is willing to go there. Maybe her MD already has?
                With the allergies I believe that coconut avocado and the tropical fruit like mangos are the really bad ones the nuts and some veggies and greens are itchy throat swollen tongue and mouth. She has not been tested for ciliac but I would not doubt it. We made a very primal dinner that night after the park and she ate a ton and was full but felt great so yeah I think o6 oils are probably a trigger too.

                I don't think it is an eating disorder per say but it is most definately body image issues. However to be clear as one person put it yes we are very petite girls and what you would call hard gainers. I settle in at 105 at 5ft4 and that is with a min of 1800 calories per day usually more like 2000. I had gained to 113 when I was adding inches to my waist and losing some muscle tone. skinny fat for sure. But it melted off back to my normal 105 or so and my normal definition came back just by ditching grains and going primal. I have to fight hard to put on more mucle then the 105. And I will lose it with a weakend of relaxing lol. Kelly is the same really 105 or so is a perfectly fine weight for her. But when she said she was just under 100 I was worried. She admits that it was not a good loss. She is not happy about being there. So that is good. I try and tackle the bad body image and ithink we hit a tipping point in her willing to try this.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Allbeef Patty View Post
                  Pemmican is a good way to get a good amount of fat. U S Wellness is a good source if making it isn't an option, and you can't find any locally.

                  Have you tried anything besides dietary changes to deal with the digestive issues? Probiotics? Enzymes? Robb Wolf talks a lot about it in his book. Some people even have to supplement with betaine hcl for a while.
                  I have considered ordering the pemican I want to try it myself! Sometimes I crave more fat if I don't get enough and that would be great to snack on. I did suggest a probiotic for her but she has not had a chance to get one.

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                  • #10
                    I often use lard and uncured bacon fat to cook with, from pasture raised pigs. Also, what about beef fat (I'm not sure if it's tallow or suet), from pasture raised beef. Butter, ghee. Also, I eat raw cheese from pasture cows. Use 18 or 35% organic cream for coffee. Fatty cuts of meat (my favourite is pork belly from pasture raised pigs). As for the veggies, there are so many choices out there that she could try. Beets, carrots, cauliflower, peppers, sweet potato, turnips, radishes, brussel sprouts, tomatoes (technically a fruit I think). Cook them in preferred method and mix with a bit of fat prior to eating. Tough when there are a lot of allergies involved. I totally get you on the CAFO standpoint. Try looking for local biodynamic farmers. Best of luck.

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                    • #11
                      eggs, fatty meats and fish, tallow, lard, marrow, butter, ghee... hollandaise sauce.

                      tropical fruits are super high in sugar and for somebody who may potentially need to heal her gut, probably best avoided anyway. lots of folks have issues with nuts. i prefer broccoli and spinach cooked as well. easier to digest, and i can eat
                      "more" since the water volume is so greatly reduced. a giant mountain of raw spinach leaves cooks down to a pretty manageable serving.

                      as an aside, she should try to have bone broth everyday. for healing and for minerals. i have it most days with some butter melted in and some seaweed. a great way to get in fats and cals, without feeling like i have eaten a lot.

                      As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                      Ernest Hemingway

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                      • #12
                        Order a small amount of pemican at first. It's not that it's a bad flavor, but it's a little bland, and I have I slight textural issue with it. That being said, when I'm hiking (working up a hunger) it tastes like manna from heaven.

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                        • #13
                          She is allergic to like, everything. She is allergic to coconut (like anaphalactic shock allergic, not mildly allergic), allergic to avocado, allergic to bannana, papaya, mango, most tropical fruits, walnuts, some other nuts but I can't remember which at the moment, ok with roasted almonds, but raw not so much. Lets see what else... cucumbers, raw spinach (steamed or cooked ok, finding salad mix was fun) and raw brocholi, again cooked ok.

                          So besides butter, how do I get her fat intake up?
                          ....
                          could you give a list of what you mean by fatty cuts?
                          You can totally do this diet without eating nuts and coconut and tropical (or any sweet) fruit. You don't have to eat cucumbers, spinach or raw broccoli, either. Go to a farmer's market or other market with a REAL selection and see what an amazing array of veggies there are beyond the basics.

                          There's nothing wrong with butter and olive oil being the main added oils for cooking and salads. That's pretty much 99% of what I use and I'm still alive.

                          Some good fatty cuts include:
                          - pork butt roast
                          - pork belly
                          - beef rib eye
                          - beef NY strip
                          - any beef steak with a good rind of fat on it
                          - fatty fish like salmon, herring, sardines, mackerel
                          - some say liver is fatty but I'm not sure if that's a FATTY cut of meat
                          - duck, whoo boy is that stuff fatty!
                          Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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                          • #14
                            Palm oil is a great oil to cook with - it can withstand high temps without degrading like olive oil, so it's great for cooking.

                            It sounds like your sister has some complicated stuff going on, like many of us here

                            I've had years of IBS that involved bloating, abdominal pain, and constipation. It took me years to figure out what was triggering it, which turned out to be too many vegetables (especially big salads), eating too much at once (I do better with smaller meals), and overall too much fiber. Also stress, which I realized could really eff me up no matter how great my diet is.

                            What's going on with your sister may be totally different from my situation, so my advice might not work, but what helped me was to:

                            1. lower my fiber (cut back veggies, peel and deseed everything, also not to eat any raw veggies, those are harder on the system)
                            2. take L-glutamine, an amino acid that the body produces naturally (but in times of stress, illness, or trauma often doesn't produce enough of) which over time will help the body to make needed repairs.
                            3. bone broth, probiotics, fermented/cultured foods to help promote good gut flora.
                            4. Work on reducing stress and improving sleep quality.


                            I can't emphasize how important destressing and good sleep is...if you're interesting in reading about how critical sleep and stress are to health, I highly recommend reading:

                            Journal of medicine and life | The effect of stress on the defense systems

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by BestBetter View Post
                              Palm oil is a great oil to cook with - it can withstand high temps without degrading like olive oil, so it's great for cooking.

                              It sounds like your sister has some complicated stuff going on, like many of us here

                              *snip*

                              4. Work on reducing stress and improving sleep quality.


                              I can't emphasize how important destressing and good sleep is...if you're interesting in reading about how critical sleep and stress are to health, I highly recommend reading:

                              Journal of medicine and life | The effect of stress on the defense systems
                              Umm... thats funny because she has pretty darn bad insomnia problems. Her energy has been up since starting this she does not feel as tired and lethargic but she is not sleeping any better, maybe even worse she says. She sleeps WITH THE TV ON!!!!! and I can't seem to convince her the blue light is what is effing her up. She says the dark freaks her out. But then she will sleep until like 2 in the afternoon some days. I guess when it catches up with her and she can't take it anymore. I have never really dealt with sleep problems so besides trying to get her to turn off the tv or drink chamomile etc before bed I am at a loss.

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