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Requesting Carbohydrate Curve Reference

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  • Requesting Carbohydrate Curve Reference

    The Carb Curve idea is very powerful, but I need some references before I start sharing this info as fact. Does anyone know where Mark got this information? Thanks!

  • #2
    i'm not sure where he got the info but before you start spreading the info, you should know that it's more the percentage of your calories rather than the amount of carbohydrate. A true low carb diet is anything under 15-20% of your calories. So if you burn 2000 a day thats anything under 80-100g.

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    • #3
      I don't have the book with me but are there any references listed for that page? Why don't you email him directly?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by DrDane View Post
        The Carb Curve idea is very powerful, but I need some references before I start sharing this info as fact. Does anyone know where Mark got this information? Thanks!
        It's a load of bunk, I think that's pretty much the consensus here. Seriously, I don't know what mark was thinking with that one. The 160th carbohydrate gram will not start to cause insidious weight gain.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by DrDane View Post
          The Carb Curve idea is very powerful, but I need some references before I start sharing this info as fact. Does anyone know where Mark got this information? Thanks!
          I believe that Mark is the reference. In other words, he based it off other people's ideas, such as Atkins, and on theories regarding the role of insulin in fat storage in the body, but really the carb curve is his own unique contribution.
          Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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          • #6
            Since your a Dr. I'd say the carb curve is evidence based medicine. Its based on equal parts science, experience, and preference to develop and implement it as an intervention. I know some don't like it (I actually love it), but it works like a charm for most the people I know IRL.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Forgotmylastusername View Post
              It's a load of bunk, I think that's pretty much the consensus here. Seriously, I don't know what mark was thinking with that one. The 160th carbohydrate gram will not start to cause insidious weight gain.
              I didn't know you were entitled to speak for the opinions of an entire message board.
              "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Forgotmylastusername View Post
                It's a load of bunk, I think that's pretty much the consensus here. Seriously, I don't know what mark was thinking with that one. The 160th carbohydrate gram will not start to cause insidious weight gain.
                It's a CURVE, not a step function...and certainly not "bunk" either IME.
                6' 2" | Age: 42 | SW: 341 | CW: 198 | GW: 180?

                “Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forwards.”
                ― Søren Kierkegaard

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                • #9
                  "I THINK that's pretty much the consensus here" was my statement. Maybe I think wrong and the majority of people here do believe going over 15o grams will lead people to slow yet insidious weight gain. I think that even includes total carbs which doesn't deduct fiber. If that's the case I could easily exceed 150 on vegetables alone.

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                  • #10
                    I find it to be very true for me. Unless I am working out like crazy, anything over about 100 grams and I gain. I have definitely noticed this. And since I already workout and go for long walks, I'm not looking to have to invest more time to keep the weight off.

                    There may be no PROOF behind Mark's curve, but the circumstantial evidence that I have seen is quite strong.
                    "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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                    • #11
                      It's a guide. Of course the specifics are different for everyone, but I haven't seen too many posts saying the guidelines are bunk. Now there is a population of young men who basically can eat like they have eight assholes and still look fit; they might think it's bunk. And I'm sure the curve is different for people who work out for general fitness and people who lift hard or are athletes.

                      I must have missed the consensus on this. Such a diverse group - I wonder if you could get a consensus on anything.
                      "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                      B*tch-lite

                      Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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                      • #12
                        I wonder if the Ornish/low fat forums have their own Dietary fat Curve.

                        10g - 20g - Accelerated fat burning

                        20 - 30g - Effortless weight loss

                        30g - 40g - weight maintenance

                        40 - 50g - slow insidious fat gaining

                        60g + = DANGER ZONE.

                        Sure, it might be only be a guide and it may even work for people, but it's still kind of ridiculous and just as easily refuted by countless populations.

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                        • #13
                          I think they can both be valid. The potato thread which totally freaked me out at first because I don't see primal as a one note thing, flips the low carb to all carb. They all admit it's not something to do long term. I'm looking forward to seeing the results and follow up.

                          The reason, I think, that just about everything can be refuted is that there isn''t one magic pill. There's a general magic pill for general health: eat wholesomely produced food and move around. But after that, the tweaking has to be done by the individual.

                          And that tweaking changes even for the individual over time. 30 years ago, I went from 156 pounds to 118 pounds in six weeks simply by eating one meal a day. And that meal was more often than not a half of a large pizza packed with toppings. I could never do that now. Well, maybe I could, but I'd have to be a full time student, part time worker who goes dancing twice a week, takes two PE classes in addition to academics... Dang, I think I need a nap just thinking of all that activity.

                          Anyway, you get my drift. A guide is just a guide. But it's a good place to start.
                          "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                          B*tch-lite

                          Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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                          • #14
                            The curve for weight loss, when combined with high fat, was not working for me. Well it was working to a point, but slow. So when I reach maintenance, it may be a better guideline for me.

                            I started losing weight on higher carbs. Well low for SAD standards but well above the curve for losing. I just glanced and saw a 227 gram day (181 net) and I was losing about 10lbs per month. (30-40%fat)

                            I know weight loss slows as you reach goal but I am not close. And you can see exactly when I went primal and cut carbs and increased fat because then I was only losing 4-5lbs. I continued Moar Fat, and weight loss crawled to .8 for ALL of September. Oct. 3 I switched to low fat more carbs, and eventually on the tater train for the experiment, and I have lost over 5lbs in 7 days.

                            So use it as a guide but realize that it is different for everyone. You just have to experiment and find your own numbers, and realize that those could change also and then it will be time to try something else.

                            The difference for me between low carbs and more carbs and subsequently with the low/high fat, I was full for longer in between meals with low carbs/high fat. It enabled me to IF. So I was eating less frequently and losing less weight. With more carbs and less fat, I find I get hungry sooner, and wake up hungrier. Like now, I have been up since 4 am and I am getting hungry, but it is controlled and I can push it off and not worry about chewing my arm off. So I was able to learn how to get my hunger in check but I do find I get hungry more often and back to eating 3 times per day and maybe a snack or two, rather than some days just one big meal. So it is a trade off that I am willing to deal with for now in order to get some more weight off. I know that I can always add more fat back in , I just have to understand that weight loss will slow down, and at about 70-75% I will start to gain and then a 48 hour fast will take it back off, but it is just back and forth, no real progress for weight loss. But I can see it working when I reach maintenance but for now, my main goal is weight loss since I dont think I have any other major health issues.
                            65lbs gone and counting!!

                            Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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                            • #15
                              Oh hey, are we having this argument again?
                              “If I didn't define myself for myself, I would be crunched into other people's fantasies for me and eaten alive.” --Audre Lorde

                              Owly's Journal

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