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Should Women FAST?

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  • #91
    THe main reason women have so much trouble in childbirth is because of obstetrics. But that's another topic. LOL

    I discovered that my calories just go that way. Right now, I'm 1500/day menses to ovulation, and 1700/day ovulation to menses.

    if i have grains, sugar, etc in that second half, then I get massive PMS (bloating, crankies, cramps, headaches, etc). If I stick to clean primal (with perhaps a bit of dark chocolate a few times -- say 25g/time about 4-6 times in the two weeks), then i'm good to go.

    I also find that I need more iron heading into/during menses -- so going with the liver, steak, etc is a good plan for me. Happiness.

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    • #92
      Originally posted by zoebird View Post
      THe main reason women have so much trouble in childbirth is because of obstetrics. But that's another topic. LOL

      I discovered that my calories just go that way. Right now, I'm 1500/day menses to ovulation, and 1700/day ovulation to menses.

      if i have grains, sugar, etc in that second half, then I get massive PMS (bloating, crankies, cramps, headaches, etc). If I stick to clean primal (with perhaps a bit of dark chocolate a few times -- say 25g/time about 4-6 times in the two weeks), then i'm good to go.

      I also find that I need more iron heading into/during menses -- so going with the liver, steak, etc is a good plan for me. Happiness.
      Thanks for feedback, interesting to get someone elses experience,
      I'll have a look at the carb sugar thing re post ovulation.
      My theory on the Iron & Protein was highest demand is pre & during ovulation to build up the lining, but post ovulation the uterus shuts off the blood flow and seperates the lining, so the actual blood residue that appears at mensus was actually taken from the body 2-3 weeks before and hence supplementing with iron during mensus is probably irrelevant.
      I still dispute this with the Naturopath, but your experience seems to support later supplementation and also your natural calorie intake being higher leans this way as well.
      Interesting, hmmmm
      "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

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      • #93
        Here's something on anovulation in fasted (72 hs) lean women vs normal weight women.
        Effects of fasting on neuroendocrine... [J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1998] - PubMed - NCBI

        I think the sample is too small to be conclusive.

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        • #94
          I seem to benefit most from fasting for about 15 hours just once or twice a week (usually at weekends). I IF'd chronically for about a week during a staycation a few months ago and I'm sure that lowered my BMR. It wasn't deliberate - I fell into my typical eating pattern at weekends. I'm a female of child-bearing age.

          I enjoy having the ability to fast even though it's only for about 15 hours. Black coffee is my friend.
          F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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          • #95
            Originally posted by Health Divas View Post
            Here's something on anovulation in fasted (72 hs) lean women vs normal weight women.
            Effects of fasting on neuroendocrine... [J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1998] - PubMed - NCBI

            I think the sample is too small to be conclusive.
            Had a read of it,
            I think a significant part of the overall metabolic issues lie in communication between body and brain, particularly the leptin story and even Women who have a healthy body weight or are overweight may still respond in starvation mode with the slightest calorie restriction.
            I do believe that IF may well be a litmus test to overall metabolic health, there is no reason why anyone male or female should go into starvation mode, suffer lethargy or become irrational on a 24 hour fast, there just isn't any evolutionary advantage to that type of debilitating response to fasting, so if the response is so negative, then in my mind it is probably indicating other underlying metabolic/nutritional issues need to be adressed.
            I just stumbled across the BP Exec's post on this issue and he also link's Stefani Ruper's post on this along with lots of other good link's:
            A Bad Combination for Women: Intermittent Fasting and Paleo The Bulletproof Executive
            There is also some good info in the comments.
            "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

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            • #96
              Can someone please explain autophagy in layman's terms to me. It's one of those things I have read about enough to believe will help me in my quest for better health, but do not completely understand. Fasting for me means being able to be sated daily when I do eat, letting my body rest from digestion, repairing while not digesting, and reaping the supposed anti-inflammatory benefits. If it is a bit obsessive at this point for me, I consider it a much healthier obsession than the other things in my life I do/have done to excess in my life!

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              • #97
                I don't know why it works that way, Omni.

                I just notice what it is. And that's what it's been for a long time now.

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                • #98
                  Originally posted by windypasswheeler View Post
                  Can someone please explain autophagy in layman's terms to me. It's one of those things I have read about enough to believe will help me in my quest for better health, but do not completely understand. Fasting for me means being able to be sated daily when I do eat, letting my body rest from digestion, repairing while not digesting, and reaping the supposed anti-inflammatory benefits. If it is a bit obsessive at this point for me, I consider it a much healthier obsession than the other things in my life I do/have done to excess in my life!
                  Autophagy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
                  Autophagy literally means "self eating". It is the body's normal process of house keeping and repair on a cellular level. All the cells that get damaged or degraded need to be broken back down and recycled or gotten rid of. If you are constantly eating, the body doesn't get much of a chance to do this house keeping. It is only when you stop eating (fast) that this mechanism kicks in.

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                  • #99
                    Thanks Paleobird. You put it as succinctly as possible! I read a bit more on wikipedia and didn't get much more out of it than what you wrote. I am also hoping that autophagy can help with getting rid of those old fat cells have that have been deflated but are still hanging around.

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                    • So what I have been doing the past few weeks is I have some buttered or creamy coffee and possibly a mug of bone broth (which is clear broth, fat skimmed away, no bits of meat) at the normal morning breakfast time. Then I ride my bike 50 minutes to work. It's not exactly a fast, more of a modified fast.

                      Then I have a big ass salad for "break-fast". Some days I am not hungry for this breakfast as late as 1 or 2pm, but that is rare. Some days I'm hungry by 9am. Most days it's around 10am.

                      I run slowly for an hour at lunch and ride my bike home slowly another 50 minutes. I don't eat anything during the day between my big ass salad and dinner. I usually have dinner around 6pm.

                      Nowhere in there do I ever have along amount of time of a fast and it's not really a fast at all because of the coffee and bone broth. Even so, I am finding that I feel the mental clarity and freedom from food of a real fast. I feel energized on my ride into work. I feel alert, focused and uplifted in spirit during the morning. I'm really hungry for breakfast and boy does that food taste good. I feel great during my lunchtime exercise and during my ride home. By the ride home I'm feeling pretty hungry but once again I get that energy and clarity and well-being and don't feel that I'm suffering during the ride. Dinner, of course, tastes as great as breakfast because of the spice of hunger.

                      It's 10:41 but I've only had my morning coffee and I'm thinking even with some weak hunger pangs I might go for a run and have my "break-fast" later.

                      All this is to say I think I found my own personal version of fasting that works for me, which is really modified fasting or reduced calorie non-fasting, and I think the very slow exercise is key to it all as well. By slow I mean my heart rate never exceeds 133 beats per minute. My bike commute is done only breathing through my nose the entire way, including any hills. I'm betting I could do it without the coffee but I'm an addict and I admit it.
                      Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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                      • Hey so I did go for a run this morning. I was semi-fasted. I had only coffee with half and half for breakfast and a cup of bone broth. I set off at about 11am and ran for almost 3 hours. My stomach was growling at first and then it stopped. I never felt tired. I could have gone all day. I think I will make a fasted (or semi-fasted like this) run a weekly experience if possible. I broke my fast with a big fruit salad: avocado, tomato and figs with olive oil and vinegar and pesto.
                        Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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                        • WTG!

                          I have been discovering similar experiences. Seems like I do best at about 16 hours, unless I am going for a 24. That is LeanGains protocol, right? But seems like lately, 10 or 11am is when I start to get hungry, if my day starts at 4am. I try to hold off until 12 or 1, more of a Fast 5.

                          I dont do near the activity as you though, not really. I might "do stuff" for hours, but I dont know how effective.

                          But today, I had coffee w/cream first thing, then when out and caught my horse and got ready for a ride. Ride was 4 hours. Probably an hour+ of catching, tacking, feeding, haul saddles back, etc. Anyways, usually when I go for a trail ride, I pack like I might be gone for a week! Today, I took a couple bottles of water and that was it! So proud of myself! So it was after 2, maybe even 3 before I ate a little something.

                          But in looking back over the summer, I had many 24 hour days. Mostly Fast 5 days, and my weight loss crawled. I never binged. Calories always in check. The 24 hour days were more like 1000 calorie days. So I dont know. I need more n=1 but I do think that I still need to incorporate some 24s now and then, and a 48 every week or two for the health benefits. I keep thinking I should do a longer one, a modified one with kraut and broth.
                          65lbs gone and counting!!

                          Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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                          • Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                            Hey so I did go for a run this morning. I was semi-fasted. I had only coffee with half and half for breakfast and a cup of bone broth. I set off at about 11am and ran for almost 3 hours. My stomach was growling at first and then it stopped. I never felt tired. I could have gone all day. I think I will make a fasted (or semi-fasted like this) run a weekly experience if possible. I broke my fast with a big fruit salad: avocado, tomato and figs with olive oil and vinegar and pesto.
                            Overtraining? unless you remain sedentary for the rest of the week. Just a thought on your lack of fat loss in the past few weeks.
                            My chocolatey Primal journey

                            Unusual food recipes (plus chocolate) blog

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                            • I am going into a dental surgery with sedation on Wednesday, so my dentist and they want an 8 hour fast with no water before the surgery. Technically, I can put something into myself at 4 am when I get up, but I figure why risk being sick after or during surgery. So, I will have supper at like 8 pm, and that's it till I get home after surgery or can eat again, whichever comes first (so a minimum of about 20 hours). For funzies, I should stay away from water too. Full tilt, a throwback to my sweet sixteen.

                              Now, what are the chances that I can experience the psycho-enlightening shit? I hope it happens post-surgery. If I glow in the reception or get an epiphany, I will let y'all know.
                              My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
                              When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

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                              • I have had no fat loss for about 9 months doing all high-impact and high heart-rate exercises such as core fitness, power walking, strenuous hiking and sprinting. Since I've started doing low heart-rate exercise, such as my slow 3 hour jog this weekend, I have lost about 4lbs. Not only that, but my sense of energy and well-being has increased times 10. I am doing about 1 to 3 hours of low heart-rate jogging and/or cycling a day with at least 1 rest day. This is the best thing I've done for myself in a long time. I bought a size 2 pair of pants yesterday at the thrift store. I'm about to break through the 130lbs barrier if I haven't already. As soon as there is a real visual difference, I plan to take a new progress picture.
                                Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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