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  • Originally posted by noodletoy View Post
    i know there is some fuzzy math there, but i sure as hell don't eat that stuff and kind of assumed other people here also do not?
    I certainly don't. But the idea of trying to sneak sugar alcohol in by saying it "doesn't count" in the net carbs is, I think, the reason that counting net carbs has become a joke.

    If you just take counting net carbs to mean excluding the fiber from the count, that makes sense to me. The fiber is not used so it should not be counted. When you count net carbs, people can stop living in fear of vegetables and have a more varied and nutritionally complete diet.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Leida View Post
      Nope, I want big muscle. Well, as big as they can get. What I don't want is thin/willowy. I want the firm body which means maximum muscle, minimum body fat.
      i missed all this bit earlier today. sorry.

      from your pix, you ARE slender and of a slim build. your skeleton will not change, unless damaged by severe dieting and turning to dust.

      Whey is said to promote muscle building because of casein, plus to be honest I like quark, because I do tire of eggs and meat. I eat liver at least once a week, I eat seafood & eggs almost daily, so I doubt I am not getting complete.
      as i said earlier, i don't abide any nutrition info from bodybuilders. am also distrustful of components of food extracted from the whole, like whey or casein protein. honestly? why are you eating any kind of powdered food? are you in space? you're a small woman, playing with limited resources. eat REAL food.

      as for fresh dairy, i have eliminated full-fat yogurt for now. (the other stuff doesn't appeal so much...) a serving supposedly had enough fat and protein, but that was a big fat lie for me. now i have meat/eggs with fat for my first meal and i am set up for a long time.
      I prefer being hungry during the day,
      zomg!! this is why you are hungry at night -- snack, snack, snack is all you can do because you will not allow yourself to at to satiety during the day.


      Plus, there are tidbits about slimmer women eating more dairy and less meats.
      yup, same as the bits claiming women who eat more cereal are slimmer.

      Before low carb I could minimize it by eating cabbage, but now my 'snacks' are all high fat,
      why are you "snacking"? bigger meals, greater satiety.

      1000-1200 cals 5 days a week and keeping to 30-35% fat or so,
      am sorry, but you will not admit your metabolism is broken? you subsisted on less than your bmr for how many years?
      i know you have "tried" all sorts of get thin methods... GAAAH. you are thin.

      let yourself heal.

      i was anorexic for MANY years and have taken a very long time to come to terms with "normal eating". that was coupled with adhering to cw abut food. bad combo.
      As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

      Ernest Hemingway

      Comment


      • I never did understand that business with the protein powders and whatnot. I have very firm muscles, at least in my legs. I know I have a 6-pack. I can almost see it. It just doesn't show because I have some fat on my stomach like a normal woman. I'm really firm on the sides, too. I never do the starch after a workout or smoothies or whey or whatever. I have lunch after a strength workout: salmon, sardines, beef.
        Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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        • But i don't use whey powder. Quark is the real food. Anyway, I froze the grains, and making the full bunch of quark into Syrniks tonight for my folks. Lucky them!

          Noodletoy, I don't want to talk about the rest, I have been through it all, I know it all, tried it, etc, and that's really what works for me. I am 8-10 lbs heavier than I am on the pics right now, and that's all I want to cut back, so no crazy stuff. Ultimate Diet is really good for it, and I think I will use what I have learned here to start and finish the diet properly to get my normal body back.

          Fasted 20 hrs yesterday, and hope to do another fast tomorrow.

          Cheers!
          Last edited by Leida; 09-11-2012, 07:22 AM.
          My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
          When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

          Comment


          • Quark is a condiment.
            Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

            Comment


            • Okay, whatever. Back home it was food. I had it for breakfast with jam all the time growing up. I am not eating it any more. Case closed?

              Anyway, Plaeobird, have you ever calculated the macros for the pate & could you share? I am putting it in as a commercial pork Liver Sausage atm.
              My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
              When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

              Comment


              • I am making Multi-fat soup today. Broccoli base with Kerrygold cheese, onions, misc. spices, chopped bacon, bacon grease, coconut milk, heavy cream, a little tahini, and a little almond butter. I just taste it as I go and add ingredients to taste.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Miss Understood View Post
                  I am making Multi-fat soup today. Broccoli base with Kerrygold cheese, onions, misc. spices, chopped bacon, bacon grease, coconut milk, heavy cream, a little tahini, and a little almond butter. I just taste it as I go and add ingredients to taste.
                  oh YUM

                  Comment


                  • For those who have been doing the keto thing for a while or are at maintenance:

                    How do you handle those meals that are beyond conforming to keto? How did you recover from those....er.....breaks in the keto routine? How soon did you feel comfortable introducing the odd meal (which for my ratios would throw off the whole day!) into your day to day without it throwing stuff off?

                    Right now I am keeping the straight and narrow. However, at times I am going to want to break out and have a more relaxed approach to the odd meal now and then.

                    BTW, the fat bread is outstanding!!!

                    Comment


                    • I did a quick search on this thread, but couldn't find the info I was looking for, even though it is probably somewhere in the 500+ posts. Here's my question:

                      How much protein can you consume per meal and maintain sufficient ketone levels?

                      I'm interested in giving this a try during my deload week from the gym. I want to have as much protein as possible to maintain muscle mass, but I don't want to put myself in the "zone of misery" with too much. Obviosuly, the optimal solution is to get a blood ketone (well, really beta-OH butyrate) meter and test myself, but I am unwilling to shell out the cash for those test strips.

                      My "problem" is that I often eat 1, (sometimes 2) meal(s) per day. I've seen the recommendation of ~1.5g/kg body mass, which would put me ~110g of protein. I know that that much in one meal would almost certainly inhibit ketosis , at least temporarily. Would splitting it to 2 meals help? If so, what is the minimum time between meals that would allow me to keep ketones high (insulin low)?

                      I saw in the comments on Peter Attia's blog (eatingacademy.com) that he has a post in the works based on his personal experience with IF and maintaining ketosis, but I was wondering if you guys had any insight. Thanks in advance.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by yodiewan View Post
                        Obviosuly, the optimal solution is to get a blood ketone (well, really beta-OH butyrate) meter and test myself, but I am unwilling to shell out ...
                        Judging by the graph on Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt's site showing his blood ketones and urine ketones, the ketostix might not be as bad as people have feared.

                        The peaks and troughs do track each other somewhat, although things do go a bit adrift just past 4th September:

                        Experiment: Optimal Ketosis for Weight Loss and Improved Performance | DietDoctor.com

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Lewis View Post
                          Judging by the graph on Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt's site showing his blood ketones and urine ketones, the ketostix might not be as bad as people have feared.

                          The peaks and troughs do track each other somewhat, although things do go a bit adrift just past 4th September:

                          Experiment: Optimal Ketosis for Weight Loss and Improved Performance | DietDoctor.com
                          Good info. Thanks, Lewis.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Leida View Post
                            Anyway, Plaeobird, have you ever calculated the macros for the pate & could you share? I am putting it in as a commercial pork Liver Sausage atm.
                            I will find it and add it momentarily. Got it. This is based on 2lbs liver, 1 stick butter and 1 cup cream.

                            Nutritional Info
                            Servings Per Recipe: 12
                            Amount Per Serving :4oz
                            Calories: 263.2
                            Total Fat: 18.4 g
                            Cholesterol: 25.9 mg
                            Sodium: 1.3 mg
                            Total Carbs: 6.8 g
                            Dietary Fiber: 0.0 g
                            Protein: 23.4 g


                            Originally posted by Miss Understood View Post
                            I am making Multi-fat soup today. Broccoli base with Kerrygold cheese, onions, misc. spices, chopped bacon, bacon grease, coconut milk, heavy cream, a little tahini, and a little almond butter. I just taste it as I go and add ingredients to taste.
                            Can I come over for dinner? I'll bring my own spoon......

                            Originally posted by Unicorn View Post
                            For those who have been doing the keto thing for a while or are at maintenance:

                            How do you handle those meals that are beyond conforming to keto? How did you recover from those....er.....breaks in the keto routine? How soon did you feel comfortable introducing the odd meal (which for my ratios would throw off the whole day!) into your day to day without it throwing stuff off?

                            Right now I am keeping the straight and narrow. However, at times I am going to want to break out and have a more relaxed approach to the odd meal now and then.

                            BTW, the fat bread is outstanding!!!
                            It is awesome. About "odd meals" I'm finding the only time those would even come up is when out with friends, so then I just IF and, if pressed, say "I already ate" or I do actually eat before going.

                            Originally posted by yodiewan View Post
                            How much protein can you consume per meal and maintain sufficient ketone levels?

                            I'm interested in giving this a try during my deload week from the gym. I want to have as much protein as possible to maintain muscle mass, but I don't want to put myself in the "zone of misery" with too much. Obviosuly, the optimal solution is to get a blood ketone (well, really beta-OH butyrate) meter and test myself, but I am unwilling to shell out the cash for those test strips.

                            My "problem" is that I often eat 1, (sometimes 2) meal(s) per day. I've seen the recommendation of ~1.5g/kg body mass, which would put me ~110g of protein. I know that that much in one meal would almost certainly inhibit ketosis , at least temporarily. Would splitting it to 2 meals help? If so, what is the minimum time between meals that would allow me to keep ketones high (insulin low)?

                            I saw in the comments on Peter Attia's blog (eatingacademy.com) that he has a post in the works based on his personal experience with IF and maintaining ketosis, but I was wondering if you guys had any insight. Thanks in advance.
                            I think trying to break it down by meal is getting into the realm of over-thinking things. There are several "magic formulas" out there for protein limitation to stay in ketosis. The 1.5g/kg of LBM is what Phinney and Volek recommend.

                            Originally posted by Lewis View Post
                            Judging by the graph on Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt's site showing his blood ketones and urine ketones, the ketostix might not be as bad as people have feared.

                            The peaks and troughs do track each other somewhat, although things do go a bit adrift just past 4th September:

                            Experiment: Optimal Ketosis for Weight Loss and Improved Performance | DietDoctor.com
                            The ketostix are very accurate as you are going into ketosis. Where their accuracy drifts off however is when you have been there a while and have become very adept at burning the ketones up so very few are being excreted out to measure. Then the blood meter is the only accurate measure.
                            I think this kind of measuring is good to get started but, once you have been there, you know what it feels like and measuring becomes superfluous.
                            Last edited by Paleobird; 09-11-2012, 01:17 PM.

                            Comment


                            • i have a question about things that taste sweet but dont have any carbs in and how they effect ketosis. specifically toothpaste and also i sometimes boil up liquorice root and ginger root for tea. the tea tastes intensely sweet to me but not in a sickly sugary unnatural way. i have always wondered how these two substances effect insulin levels?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by seaweed View Post
                                i have a question about things that taste sweet but dont have any carbs in and how they effect ketosis. specifically toothpaste and also i sometimes boil up liquorice root and ginger root for tea. the tea tastes intensely sweet to me but not in a sickly sugary unnatural way. i have always wondered how these two substances effect insulin levels?
                                Seaweed: Good question. I read somewhere (sorry, cannot reference it now), that even chewing gum is enough to affect ketosis. Since reading that, I have avoided gum. I brush my teeth a lot, and use the 'mint-flavoured' floss about 4 x per day, but not about to give that up. I look forward to hearing from others on this.
                                ----------------------------------------
                                F, 48, 5'10"
                                Start Date: 25-06-12 @ 161lbs
                                Goal Reached: 30-09-12 @ 143lb. Now bouncing between 145lb - 149lb. I'd like less bounce and more consistency :-)

                                Started Cross Fit 20.12.12 ---- Can't wait to submit my success story on the 1st anniversary of starting primal.

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