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  • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
    Sanas, have you tried it with just keeping butter (or possibly ghee) in the mix minus the other dairy stuff? You might be able to get away with this given that there are very little milk solids involved. Butter makes getting to keto levels of fat much easier.
    I've cut way back on cheese and yogurt -- basically none. Butter I've learned to love in hot drinks, and I think it's ok. (I've been meaning to make or get some ghee, because I think I'll love that too.) Heavy cream in coffee, though . . . really don't want to give it up. (I have to watch it with the coconut milk, because I'm mildly allergic to nuts. The oil is ok, though, and I eat that by the spoonful.)

    I'm hoping there's kind of a threshold, where you can have a little bit with no consequences. I'm not achy lately, so maybe I'm on the right side of it.

    I haven't tried bacon grease in coffee yet . . .

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Knifegill View Post
      I've given up on keto-stix because even when I'm dropping body fat fast, have stinky-tones and no appetite, I pee negative to trace at best.
      That's interesting, Knifegill. Why is that, do you suppose? Maybe you're really good at burning the ketones? Long time ago, I did the Atkins diet for about 3 weeks, IIRC, long enough to get to where you can eat a bit of cabbage along with your bacon. I couldn't turn the keto stick either. Thanks for the encouragement.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by noodletoy View Post
        had organic cream with berries after-dinner last night and had no cravings, so i'm thinking it's something about the grain-fed cheese. dunno, lol.
        I wonder? I bought two kinds of blue cheese. One of them gives me cravings, the other takes them away. The no-cravings cheese was a lovely Stilton from England, and the other was "Danish Blue Cheese" from Denmark.

        Comment


        • If I'm drinking probably 16 oz water in the evenings and still waking up in the night dry-mouthed and twitchy in the body, drinking another full glass of water and then sleeping well, does this mean I'm dehydrated? What's happening with my electrolytes?

          I added lots of salt to everything until it all seemed too salty and then I stopped. I guess I should start again?

          Comment


          • I can never remember which morph is which. But I'm not the good one. Here are honest photos of me where I didn't catch the angle or light just right:
            http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8444/7...95d70a87b2.jpg
            http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8322/7...a74c0ea425.jpg

            What bothers me is that my belly and upper arms continue to be fat. It would be nice to have more slender knees and ankles. It would be nice to resemble the athlete that I truly am. I seriously kick ass compared to most people I meet. I'm not the fastest, I'm not the strongest, but I will dog you until you collapse in a heap just like a persistence hunter catches an antelope.
            Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Sanas View Post
              That's interesting, Knifegill. Why is that, do you suppose? Maybe you're really good at burning the ketones? Long time ago, I did the Atkins diet for about 3 weeks, IIRC, long enough to get to where you can eat a bit of cabbage along with your bacon. I couldn't turn the keto stick either. Thanks for the encouragement.
              Sanas: This is interesting as I'm having similar results. I'm thirsty all the time, despite the fact that I'm drinking at least a gallon a day. I add salt to everything, and even when my keto stick say 'negative', I know that I am producing keytones because my carbs are <20grams per day and I have a metal taste in my mouth. I made some bone broth last night, and will begin consuming two cups per day to see if that helps. Back to the water fountain
              ----------------------------------------
              F, 48, 5'10"
              Start Date: 25-06-12 @ 161lbs
              Goal Reached: 30-09-12 @ 143lb. Now bouncing between 145lb - 149lb. I'd like less bounce and more consistency :-)

              Started Cross Fit 20.12.12 ---- Can't wait to submit my success story on the 1st anniversary of starting primal.

              Comment


              • I'm still lurking in the shadows, reading. Y'all are convincing me to try this VLC for at least 5-6 days a week, I'll probably throw in a refeed once a week after a heavy day.
                Do any of you have any good links or tips about ketosis? I'm fine with fasting, training fasted, and going low(er) carb than now, but I'm still trying to figure out exactly how to do it. My butt/thighs have gotten softer in the past 12 months (only have been eating Primal/SCD/GAPS for about 4 months) and I think it's due to not running as many miles. I'm pretty pissed about it. Maybe I'll go whine in my own thread :P

                Anyway keep up the great comments, a lot of us out here are munching on proverbial popcorn and listening and learning

                Comment


                • Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                  I bought some triple cream goat brie. Just thought I would inject a little sense into this talk about cheese. Coconut cheese? Nut cheese? Not cheese. Abominations. But I agree that maybe there is too much cheese lately. That's why I'm very grateful for liver pate and pesto.

                  P.S. I remember when women were not allowed to have a credit card in their own name.
                  I have a big wheel of brie in my fridge most of the time. It's my "company food", as well as my nosh filler. And I'm so old I can remember when it was almost a sin to contemplate using any credit at all! ;-)

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by ennaejay View Post
                    I'm still lurking in the shadows, reading. Y'all are convincing me to try this VLC for at least 5-6 days a week, I'll probably throw in a refeed once a week after a heavy day.
                    Do any of you have any good links or tips about ketosis? I'm fine with fasting, training fasted, and going low(er) carb than now, but I'm still trying to figure out exactly how to do it. My butt/thighs have gotten softer in the past 12 months (only have been eating Primal/SCD/GAPS for about 4 months) and I think it's due to not running as many miles. I'm pretty pissed about it. Maybe I'll go whine in my own thread :P

                    Anyway keep up the great comments, a lot of us out here are munching on proverbial popcorn and listening and learning
                    I've never really gone full-on, although I don't currently eat much in the way of carbs, so I tend to drift in and out. Maybe I'll go full-bore as the winter closes in -- which would kind of make sense in the northern hemisphere.

                    How to do it? Less than 50 grams of carbohydrate a day, possibly less for some people. Too much protein will knock you out. Phinney and Volek have plenty of experience with using this with both patients and athletes and they suggest 1.5 to 2 grams of protein per kilogram of lean bodymass of protein. That's still plenty. If it's too much effort to work out your lean bodymass just use something like 1.4 times ideal bodymass. That's all there is to it, really. Controlled carbs, and adequate but moderated protein.

                    If you want some links, maybe have a look at Jimmy Moore's recent experiments on himself:

                    Jimmy Moore

                    Jimmy Moore

                    Jimmy Moore

                    Jimmy has had to go really very low on both carbs and protein, but that may be a personal legacy from his metabolism-busting mega-carb days.


                    Peter Attia has a lot of stuff written from the point of view of ketosis as an aid to athletic performance in endurance events:

                    The Eating Academy | Peter Attia, M.D. The Eating Academy | Peter Attia, M.D.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Sanas View Post
                      If I'm drinking probably 16 oz water in the evenings and still waking up in the night dry-mouthed and twitchy in the body, drinking another full glass of water and then sleeping well, does this mean I'm dehydrated? What's happening with my electrolytes?

                      I added lots of salt to everything until it all seemed too salty and then I stopped. I guess I should start again?
                      ketosis is a natural diuretic and until you get more adapted can whack out your electrolytes. have bone broth with some salt added, avocado or plain electrolyte water -- that can be found at trader joe's and i think the smartwater people make one too. drink more water than you think you need right now.

                      adding a magnesium supp will also help with the jitters.
                      As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                      Ernest Hemingway

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Sanas View Post
                        I wonder? I bought two kinds of blue cheese. One of them gives me cravings, the other takes them away. The no-cravings cheese was a lovely Stilton from England, and the other was "Danish Blue Cheese" from Denmark.
                        "danish bleu" does sound pretty generic and i know stilton is produced under pretty strict controls.

                        ah, ok! a bit of google-fu shows it's from cows that are primarily grass-fed.
                        As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                        Ernest Hemingway

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Lewis View Post
                          I've never really gone full-on, although I don't currently eat much in the way of carbs, so I tend to drift in and out. Maybe I'll go full-bore as the winter closes in -- which would kind of make sense in the northern hemisphere.

                          How to do it? Less than 50 grams of carbohydrate a day, possibly less for some people. Too much protein will knock you out. Phinney and Volek have plenty of experience with using this with both patients and athletes and they suggest 1.5 to 2 grams of protein per kilogram of lean bodymass of protein. That's still plenty. If it's too much effort to work out your lean bodymass just use something like 1.4 times ideal bodymass. That's all there is to it, really. Controlled carbs, and adequate but moderated protein.

                          If you want some links, maybe have a look at Jimmy Moore's recent experiments on himself:

                          Jimmy Moore

                          Jimmy Moore

                          Jimmy Moore

                          Jimmy has had to go really very low on both carbs and protein, but that may be a personal legacy from his metabolism-busting mega-carb days.


                          Peter Attia has a lot of stuff written from the point of view of ketosis as an aid to athletic performance in endurance events:

                          The Eating Academy | Peter Attia, M.D. The Eating Academy | Peter Attia, M.D.
                          Much obliged! Thanks. I have no clue what my LBM is. A few months ago I found some kind of mathematical equation hocus-pocus that I used, taking measurements and figuring a percentage. No gym, basic scale, so I'm on my own, just going off of how I feel, how my guts are digesting things, energy, the mirror, and strength. I'll guess at my LBM around 100lbs. I think i can keep carbs around 50g for several days/weeks in a row. I Love Veggies and eat a ton of them, so I guess I'll head back over to fatsecret and start tracking again to be on the safe side.

                          I think my 2 cups of yogurt with pineapple was a poor choice today; now I won't be able to snarf down the curry I'm making for dinner with zucchini noodles. Bah! I will have to "suffer" with a salmon fillet on a bed of cabbage.
                          Appreciate the links!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Louisa655 View Post
                            I'm having similar results. I'm thirsty all the time, despite the fact that I'm drinking at least a gallon a day. I add salt to everything, and even when my keto stick say 'negative', I know that I am producing ketones because my carbs are <20grams per day and I have a metal taste in my mouth.
                            Louisa, on the "Restless Sleep" thread, someone mentioned "Hypoglycemic Amnesia." It has symptoms of restless sleep and needing ferociously to eat or drink in the middle of the night. I wonder if it's this? I'm probably eating too low on the carbs, like you <20 g per day, in a attempt to feel the ketosis magic.

                            When you've been a carb hound for decades, maybe it takes a couple of years to really be able to generate an abundance of ketones. It's taken at least two years for my thyroid and adrenal glands to recover. So, who knows what two years of VLC will bring?

                            When I think about having to undergo one of those tests where you chug a big bunch of glucose and see what happens, I turn pale and feel faint. I think that would just about kill me. But I'm better than I used to be, blood sugar wise. I didn't used to be able to go on a three hour car trip without a big bag of tortilla chips to eat, and now I can not eat for a whole day.

                            Are you possibly hypoglycemic?

                            Here's the restless sleep thread. Post number 7 refers to hypoglycemic insomnia. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread65633.html
                            Last edited by Sanas; 09-10-2012, 11:43 AM.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Sanas View Post
                              That's interesting, Knifegill. Why is that, do you suppose? Maybe you're really good at burning the ketones? Long time ago, I did the Atkins diet for about 3 weeks, IIRC, long enough to get to where you can eat a bit of cabbage along with your bacon. I couldn't turn the keto stick either. Thanks for the encouragement.
                              i started this whole journey 3 years ago with atkins and they no longer recommend the keto stix because they are simply not accurate. they only measure spilled ketones in the urine, which is more often a factor of hydration. i've met atkins-peeps on-line who have lost 100+ pounds and ever shown any trace on the stix.
                              As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                              Ernest Hemingway

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by noodletoy View Post
                                "danish bleu" does sound pretty generic and i know stilton is produced under pretty strict controls.

                                ah, ok! a bit of google-fu shows it's from cows that are primarily grass-fed.
                                Thanks, Noodletoy. I must, must find some good milk somewhere. We've just been using generic grocery store.

                                Gotta wonder just what is the difference. Maybe generic has a lot of antibiotics? Why would antibiotics promote cravings?

                                Comment

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