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EAT MOAR FAT! I'm finally GETTING it.

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  • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
    It's an internet meme that kind of puts emphasis on the word. Some people say it is a combo of "more" and "roar"

    When I first started out it was like a chant to a drum circle beat around here "Eat more fat!, Eat more fat!" and then the safe starch thing happened and things kind of went to the opposite extreme for a while. It's interesting to watch trends like that over time.

    Haha, thanks for that, I knew I was missing something. By the way looking at your calculations is just about what I figured I needed to aim for after my first post at the beginning of this tread a few days ago. We must be about the same height. I figured my LBM to be about 116 (this is with a 21% body fat, which I find acceptable for females). My ideal weight is around 145. This would include being muscularly fit. I am not big boned.
    However, I have been eating (after trying to reduce protein for the last few days) over 80 gms of protein. To get my fat up I resorted to eating teaspoons of butter after my dinner and even then only reached 81 gms yesterday (and totaled 48gms of carb). So I definitely need to eat fattier meals.

    I'll check in again in another week.
    Female, age 51, 5' 9"
    SW - 183 (Jan 22, 2012), CW - 159, GW - healthy.

    Met my 2012 goals by losing 24 pounds.
    2013 goals are to get fit and strong!

    Comment


    • Hey y'all, no offense was taken here by me. I was out of line. No problemo.

      To sort of change the subject a tad, I bought a heart rate monitor today. I've been reading Phil Maffetone. He's got very interesting ideas about maximum aerobic fitness and the heart rate you should do your aerobic training at. According to him, if I exceed my maximum heart rate (133), I turn off the fat-burning pathways and turn on the anaerobic, sugar-burning pathways. By exercising above my maximum heart rate, I actually sabotage both my fat-adaptation and the burning of body fat for energy. Not to mention my ability to improve my fitness. So now I get the whole thing about too much exercise can slow your weight loss.

      I just put on the monitor and went for a little hike to a nearby hilly park. I can't get up to my max just walking, unless the hill is pretty steep. I have to run flats and downhills to keep my heart rate within my range.

      It's all kind of exciting to me because after I hiked the PCT I kinda thought maybe I would do well in other endurance activities, like running. But I couldn't do any running after the PCT because of a) all the inflammation from too much hiking and too much crappy vegetable oil, sugar and flour and b) because I was too hungry. I gained all the weight back and more and then I couldn't do any running because I was too fat and even when I finally tried, I couldn't lose any weight because I had hosed my insulin sensitivity.

      So now I feel like with the combination of the metabolic healing that very low carb gives me plus this whole MAF fitness/metabolic pathway stuff, maybe I really can become a runner after all. It's all kind of making sense to me and falling into place. There is a local 50 mile ultramarathon I've always fantasized about doing. Maybe I'll be able to do it next year. Maybe also this is that final piece of the puzzle for me in attaining that HSIS body along with my maximum fitness potential.
      Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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      • Interesting, SB. Two questions. How do you determine your optimal training heart rate and where did you buy your monitor?

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        • I got the monitor at Big 5. It was on sale. Nothing special about it. It's the kind that straps around your chest with a little wrist watch.

          To figure your max heart rate, 180-age. Then you have to answer some questions. Like if you just had major surgery or take medications, subtract 10. If you are out of shape, you have asthma or allergies, you have been getting worse in your training instead of better, you get sick often, you never exercise ever, subtract 5. If you've been exercising for a few years do it about 4x a week, not injured, subtract 0. If you are a competitive athlete and none of the other stuff applies, add 5. Then subtract 10 for your lower end. Try to exercise within that range. I guess the range is a little different if you are a teenager or over 65.

          Aside from these details, his theories are really very interesting about the anaerobic and aerobic fitness. It's okay to do anaerobic exercise like weight lifting, but you have to make sure the aerobic exercise you do is truly aerobic and that you aren't going too hard and pushing yourself into the anaerobic side. Otherwise you are working against yourself.
          Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

          Comment


          • Hmmm. I shall have to put Maffetone on the reading list.

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            • So, I've decided I've just been eating too damn much. I focused more on fat today, and ate less food over all.

              I feel great.

              I'm dreading my cold shower, though.

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              • Originally posted by RaeVynn View Post
                So, I've decided I've just been eating too damn much. I focused more on fat today, and ate less food over all.
                I feel great.
                I'm dreading my cold shower, though.
                Yep, the quality of the calories (as in GCBC) is important as well as the quantity. Good quality makes keeping quantity in check easy through ketosis. And all the puzzle pieces go "click".

                Nobody's forcing you to have a cold shower you know. Just sayin'.....

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                • Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                  I got the monitor at Big 5. It was on sale. Nothing special about it. It's the kind that straps around your chest with a little wrist watch.

                  To figure your max heart rate, 180-age. Then you have to answer some questions. Like if you just had major surgery or take medications, subtract 10. If you are out of shape, you have asthma or allergies, you have been getting worse in your training instead of better, you get sick often, you never exercise ever, subtract 5. If you've been exercising for a few years do it about 4x a week, not injured, subtract 0. If you are a competitive athlete and none of the other stuff applies, add 5. Then subtract 10 for your lower end. Try to exercise within that range. I guess the range is a little different if you are a teenager or over 65.

                  Aside from these details, his theories are really very interesting about the anaerobic and aerobic fitness. It's okay to do anaerobic exercise like weight lifting, but you have to make sure the aerobic exercise you do is truly aerobic and that you aren't going too hard and pushing yourself into the anaerobic side. Otherwise you are working against yourself.
                  Hey girls, It's 220 minus your age for max heart rate. Don't get too hung up on this. You're reading CW which we all know is dangerous. Heart rate monitors are great for making you move faster when you realise you're just cruising at 110 but that's all. Go with how you feel. To challenge the burn body fat wisdom it's still all about calories in and calories out. I don't remember the exact numbers because I gave up being a slave to it a long time ago but if you go at a rate than burns 50% fat as fuel and an hour burns 250 calories that's 125 calories in fat. If you work hard and burn 700 calories and you drop to 25 % fat burning you burn 175 calories in fat. It's always been the case that change takes effort. There's an awful lot of fat people in the gym walking or cycling slow. The lean fit ones are moving fast and lifting heavy.

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                  • This HR training thing is interesting. Here is a little info if anyone wants it.

                    220 - age is not a particularly good indicator for those that want to work properly in the various zones. That equation has a margin of error of around 16 bpm, so you could in theory be 8 bpm either side of there you think you are, so, you could be working too hard, or not hard enough. Not critical to worry about if you are just after a ballpark figure. Problem is, it does not take into account ANY variable that is specific to YOU.

                    The HRR (Heart Rate Reserve) equation, aka the Karvonen Formula is more accurate, as it takes into account a personal variable, your own resting heart rate, which ideally will decrease as you get fitter, so you need to adjust your work intensity. Be aware that HRR zone %'s are not exactly the same as the 220-1ge Heart Rate Max %'s.

                    Here is some info about Karvonen -http://www.topendsports.com/fitness/...en-formula.htm

                    Phil Maffetone's 180-age is a good calulation. But realise that the 180 is purely an arbitary figure with no correlation with estimated Max HR. Maffetone did a lot of research and testing with athletes from many disciplines, using a variety of systems, including 'respiratory quotient' to measure the fat/sugar ratio being burned at varying exercise intensities. He kind of did the whole thing backwards, find out where people are burning fat most efficiently, and then put together an equation that allows 'most' people to work at the appropriate level.

                    I have used Maffetone method on and off for a long time, for running etc. If you do run, you'll find yourself walking a lot at the start to stay within the HR zone, but as you become more aerobically efficient 9fitter) you will see your pace increase for the same intensity.

                    Maffetone also encourages intervals after building a good aerobic base, replace these with the PB sprint sessions and you should get pretty fit.
                    Last edited by PureFunctionalFitness; 09-04-2012, 05:32 AM.

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                    • Re Dotty Byrd's previous post - A lot of people actually work far to hard far too often when exercising. That CW of working yourself into the ground to get any gains. The HR monitor is a great tool to actually hold you back when training. Even someone relatively unfit following Mark's advice to go hiking could end up at far too high a heart rate to get the benefit of fat burning (I know, I train some quite obese people and even a brisk walk has them spluttering and wheezing). Respiratory quotient testing is real, and Maffetone used it to find a good aerobic level for improved fitness and fat burning.

                      Maffetone is not CW, he is actually something of a 'renegade' in the training world. It is his association with Mark Allen who won multiple Hawaiian Iron Man events on his training method that really made him famous, amongst other things.

                      Moving fast, lifting heavy is essential, but only a bit of the time, the rest needs to be low level aerobic, and a HR monitor is a great way to speed you up or slow you down as necessary.
                      Last edited by PureFunctionalFitness; 09-04-2012, 05:43 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by PureFunctionalFitness View Post
                        Re Dotty Byrd's previous post - A lot of people actually work far to hard far too often when exercising. That CW of working yourself into the ground to get any gains. The HR monitor is a great tool to actually hold you back when training. Even someone relatively unfit following Mark's advice to go hiking could end up at far to high a heart rate to get the benefit of fat burning (I know, I train some quite obese people and even a brisk walk has them spluttering and wheezing)

                        Maffetone is not CW, he is actually something of a 'renegade' in the training world. It is his association with Mark Allen who won multiple Hawaiian Iron Man events on his training method that really made him famous, amongst other things.

                        Moving fast, lifting heavy is essential, but only a bit of the time, the rest needs to be low level aerobic, and a HR monitor is a great way to speed you up or slow you down as necessary.
                        So which formula do you recommend... Maffetone or the top end sports one?

                        I'll have to pull out my heart rate monitor... haven't used it in years.

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                        • In reality, it's your call. Maffetone is a conservative aerobic training zone, ideally don't go over the max of 180-age, and work up to 10 beats below it. I was happy working at 27-137bpm, and increased my running pace from 11:30 min miles to 9:00 min miles over 2.5 months. Not fast, but working at a low HR and being able to train for longer with no ill effects.

                          I would go with Maffetone, it is conservative, but you will get the aerobic adaptations, like increased mitochondria numbers and improved efficiency. It might be a slower method of getting fit, but you avoid adrenal stress and increased cortisol production (none of these a problem for our sprints and lifting, you just don't want it during prolonged aerobic activity)

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                          • Originally posted by healthy11 View Post
                            So which formula do you recommend... Maffetone or the top end sports one?

                            I'll have to pull out my heart rate monitor... haven't used it in years.
                            I agree...and an awful lot of people don't work nearly hard enough. You need to work out your own common sense as well. 180 - my age 130 for a maximum heart rate would be daft given that I frequently work at 170+.

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                            • Originally posted by Dotty Byrd View Post
                              I agree...and an awful lot of people don't work nearly hard enough. You need to work out your own common sense as well. 180 - my age 130 for a maximum heart rate would be daft given that I frequently work at 170+.
                              But that is the point. Working at 170bpm is fine on occasions, but if you follow the BP philosophy, then you want to be working at a much lower HR for most of the time. That max HR of 130 is for your slow aerobic work, not for you occasional high intensity sprints etc

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                                I got the monitor at Big 5. It was on sale. Nothing special about it. It's the kind that straps around your chest with a little wrist watch.

                                To figure your max heart rate, 180-age. Then you have to answer some questions. Like if you just had major surgery or take medications, subtract 10. If you are out of shape, you have asthma or allergies, you have been getting worse in your training instead of better, you get sick often, you never exercise ever, subtract 5. If you've been exercising for a few years do it about 4x a week, not injured, subtract 0. If you are a competitive athlete and none of the other stuff applies, add 5. Then subtract 10 for your lower end. Try to exercise within that range. I guess the range is a little different if you are a teenager or over 65.

                                Aside from these details, his theories are really very interesting about the anaerobic and aerobic fitness. It's okay to do anaerobic exercise like weight lifting, but you have to make sure the aerobic exercise you do is truly aerobic and that you aren't going too hard and pushing yourself into the anaerobic side. Otherwise you are working against yourself.
                                I have yet to find someone to answer this question, but I thought I would throw it out here (and apparently hijack this thread, sorry). I've been using a heart rate monitor for years (Polar brand). My heart rate is *high*, really really high when I exercise. My resting is fantastic, if I sit down for a few minutes it's right around 60 bpm. I'm sure it's significantly lower when I wake up but I've never checked it.

                                I'm 32, female, and have always done some sort of exercise. If I go for a job, my heart rate skyrockets up to the 170s and easily stays there (it gets up to 190 when I do sprints). Supposedly, this is really bad, but it's where my heart rate goes and it doesn't bother me. But it's just weird that my high is sooooo much higher than most people's high. Any thoughts??

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