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Iodine: a discussion, and perhaps a civilized debate

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  • [QUOTE=RobinNM;939311][QUOTE=Ferti;939309]
    Originally posted by JamesS View Post

    How do you make iodine? I'm too lazy to Google that right now.
    Take the time and do it right.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Ferti View Post
      And bromide can't cause break outs - FU JamesS. Sorry, I'm not particularly articulate.
      I don't know why you are deciding to be so rude. If you look back through my other posts I do state that this is the one thing that both bromine and iodine have in common. But as I have also pointed out numerous times it is extremely rare for levels to build up to any significant level where it can cause issues. In part because of how fast bromine is excreted normally and because of the amount of sodium, chloride and fluoride that we most people are exposed to on a regular basis, which accelerates the excretion even more.

      Since we are on the subject though why don't you explain to all of us in detail how any of what I said above is incorrect. while you are at it why don't you explain to all of us how it is that everyone is not getting these eruptions on a regular basis despite the regular exposure to high levels of the fluoride and chloride halogens that are more reactive than bromine and thus readily displace it. Why is this only occurring when people are taking excessive doses of iodine, which is LESS reactive than bromine but is still well known for causing acne-like eruptions. Let's see if you can give an intelligent response instead of more unintelligent trash like "FU".

      Comment


      • [QUOTE=Ferti;939309][QUOTE=JamesS;939082]
        Originally posted by Paysan View Post

        sorry, my posting skills suck, but once again "I MADE MY OWN" (without a nuclear reactor)
        I am sorry that this went so far over your head. But not surprising for someone who's most intelligent response was "FU".

        Iodine is an element. The ONLY way you can make iodine is though a nuclear reaction. You can make iodine compounds or iodine solutions, you can even displace iodine from an iodine compound like potassium iodide. But again, you cannot make iodine without a nuclear reactor. Thus the wink as the end of my post.
        Last edited by JamesS; 08-27-2012, 10:32 PM.

        Comment


        • James,

          "Kick them when they are up, kick them when they are down, kick them all around. "



          This is exactly why you were thrown out of 2 discussion groups. You are one nasty Troll for the record books.

          Grizz
          Last edited by Grizz; 08-27-2012, 11:04 PM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
            James,

            "Kick them when they are up, kick them when they are down, kick them all around. "



            This is exactly why you were thrown out of 2 discussion groups. You are one nasty Troll for the record books.

            Grizz
            Originally posted by Grizz View Post
            Piscator,

            JamesS is my hero, also. 3 cheers for JamesS.
            beautiful
            yeah you are

            Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
            lol

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
              James,

              "Kick them when they are up, kick them when they are down, kick them all around. "



              This is exactly why you were thrown out of 2 discussion groups. You are one nasty Troll for the record books.

              Grizz
              No matter how many times you repeat it this is not going to make it rue Grizz. I was banned by "Doc" Shillington because I provided solid evidence he was wrong and he did not like that. Interesting how his site description stated debate was welcome. He just left out the part as long as you were not proving him wrong that debate was OK.

              And I was banned from Curezone for providing evidence of so much of the quackery there such as "oleander soup", high dose iodine, "liver flushing", alkalizing, etc. Many of the people pushing such quackery were also advertisers for Curezone so they pressured the Webmaster to ban me. Why do you think the personal attacks against me are still going on to this day despite my not being on Curezone in several months. They want to make sure I don't come back because they know they can't counter the evidence that has been presented against their quackery. For example, Tony Issacs claiming that the phase 1 trials showed oleander was effective for cancer. First of all phase 1 trials do not test for effectiveness of a drug, only safety of dosing. But he misinterpreted the findings to try and make it sound like it was effective. Anyone reading the actual studies on oleander though will find that oleander had some effectiveness on some cancer cell cultures, but all human studies including those funded by the manufacturer showed oleander to be a failure for cancer. Tony was one of the people who pressured the Webmaster to get rid of me because Tony heavily pushes the oleander crap and other ineffective therapies for cancer and is a major advertiser on Curezone. So he got really upset when I showed the actual studies and how they proved oleander ineffective for cancer contrary to his claims.

              In case you have not noticed Curezone is dying a slow death because people are catching on to so much of the information there is quackery. When I first started posting on their about three years ago they would go through 1 1/2 to 2 pages a day of new posts. I have been watching it lately and right now it is taking about 2 1/2 days to get even one page of new posts. And about 90% of the posts have nothing to do with health and healing. All of the people who did have any real knowledge of health and healing left a long time ago because they got so tired of the personal attacks for posting actual evidence or got banned for doing the same.

              So believe what you want Grizz. Not everyone is intelligent enough to think for themselves so they simply follow the crowd instead of seeking the truth.

              Comment


              • Hey Grizz...
                This one's for you.

                ... cause everyone in this thread needs there own theme song!
                “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                Comment


                • Comment


                  • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
                    Something does not have to be expensive to be poisonous. I can go out and pick oleander for free, which is very poisonous and can kill me.

                    You also don't seem to understand simple economics. A person can make more money selling a larger volume of a product cheaply than they can selling less of the product at a much higher price. And by convincing your customers that you need even more of the product they go through the bottles faster than they would by using proper doses. Of course if your customers are getting sick from poisoning themselves from the product they are not going to stick with it. So they need to convince their customers that their symptoms are not from the product, but at the same time make sure they are treating their iodine poisoning with salt flushes so they go through those bottles of iodine faster so they can sell more.
                    Thanks James,
                    This is on a completly different tangent, I was reading some stuff today and then remembered this post,
                    If you just insert the word Wheat or Grains instead of Iodine or Oleander, explains perfectly why pharmanutritionists keep encouraging us to eat more grains, we get sick, they have twice the income stream, once for the food then again for the treatment of chronic disease.

                    Oh by the way, on balance of evidence that I have read and seen, I'd put my money on James regarding Iodine megadosing, there is no real data to back high doses as a blanket treatment for everyone, which is the impression I am getting from the pro Iodine side. Most people do quite well without any supplementation of Iodine and there is no indication of any culture with mega intakes that has a significantly different health profile that can't be explained by other factors.
                    Iodine may well have some therapeutic uses in the treatment of fibroids, but if I was looking at that I would seriously also investigate some of the alternatives that James has suggested, there may be some merit in them too.

                    Otherwise, good to see the thread moving at the std ratio of 10:1 waffle:value.
                    Last edited by Omni; 08-28-2012, 06:29 AM.
                    "There are no short cuts to enlightenment, the journey is the destination, you have to walk this path alone"

                    Comment


                    • Oleander soup? Seriously? What quackery will they think of next? The curezone just sunk even lower in my estimation (if that was even possible).

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Omni View Post
                        Thanks James,
                        This is on a completly different tangent, I was reading some stuff today and then remembered this post,
                        If you just insert the word Wheat or Grains instead of Iodine or Oleander, explains perfectly why pharmanutritionists keep encouraging us to eat more grains, we get sick, they have twice the income stream, once for the food then again for the treatment of chronic disease.
                        As with any protein source people may or may not have problems with grains. I am one of those people who has consumed grains and soy all my life and have not had any health issues other than allergies until the age of 5. Some people have reactions to meats ad dairy as well but this does not make any of these foods inherently dangerous. Again, it all depends on the person. But people have to be careful not to talk themselves in to becoming sick. If people believe strongly enough that something will make them sick then it can. Just like some people still believe that you can catch a cold by going out in the cold without a hat or walking barefoot in the cold. I cannot believe how many times people have told me that because I do both. And I have to explain to them that you cannot catch a cold that way, which is why I don't get sick when I do these things. Some people can have true reactions to grains, but some people will also develop psychosomatic reactions to the grains because they so strongly believe they cause illness.

                        Originally posted by Omni View Post
                        Oh by the way, on balance of evidence that I have read and seen, I'd put my money on James regarding Iodine megadosing, there is no real data to back high doses as a blanket treatment for everyone, which is the impression I am getting from the pro Iodine side. Most people do quite well without any supplementation of Iodine and there is no indication of any culture with mega intakes that has a significantly different health profile that can't be explained by other factors.
                        Iodine may well have some therapeutic uses in the treatment of fibroids, but if I was looking at that I would seriously also investigate some of the alternatives that James has suggested, there may be some merit in them too.
                        Yes, I for one do not supplement iodine and have been healthy. What I do is eat a highly varied diet, which some of the foods will provide iodine. And since the body does such a good job of holding on to iodine I get plenty from my diet. No need to take massive doses, which will just cause the body to excrete the excess and possibly cause adverse effects in the process.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                          Oleander soup? Seriously? What quackery will they think of next? The curezone just sunk even lower in my estimation (if that was even possible).
                          Its the same old BS. Some doctor supposedly cured thousands of patients using oleander soup, but there is nothing to back this claim. And all the studies in humans have shown oleander to be a complete failure for cancer. Some culture studies have shown oleander and other cardiac glycoside sources to be effective against some cancer cell lines in culture. But this once again shows that just because something works in a culture test this does not mean it will do the same thing in the body. For one thing the culture studies use concentrated cardiac glycosides in the cell lines. But cardiac glycosides from oleander are highly poisonous to the body in general. To get levels in the body high enough to have any significant effect on the cancer cells would likely kill the patient long before those levels are reached.

                          In fact, the process of making the "oleander soup" removes most of the deadly cardiac glycosides from the final product, which is what culture studies have shown to be effective against some cancer cell lines. Therefore, if the active components are for the most part being removed from the final product how is this crap supposed to work in the first place? And again if these cardiac glycosides are left in place they will kill the patient.

                          There are some immune stimulating polysaccharides in oleander but these types of polysaccharides are found in numerous non-toxic plants such as seaweeds, medicinal mushrooms, astragalus, Aloe vera, etc.

                          If people read the studies on oleander and know how to read them properly they will find that oleander not only failed to cure cancer in all the studies, but the most recent study appears to have shortened the lives of the patients.

                          Despite this every time someone asks about cancer and some other diseases such as hepatitis there are the bogus claims about "oleander soup" popping up including the bogus claim that the phase 1 studies showed oleander to highly effective for cancers.

                          Funny thing is the promoter of the oleander says the studies failed because they were not conducted long enough. According to him it takes at least two months to even start seeing results. Yet right there in the testimonials he keeps presenting as so-called "evidence" are supposed cures by the doctor in less than two weeks. Just goes to show why unverifiable testimonials are worthless. When I asked him about the discrepancy as to either he was lying or the doctor's testimonials were fabricated or both I never got a response explaining the discrepancy. And still to this day he is still making the same exact claims and still posting the same so-called testimonials despite the contradictions.

                          Comment


                          • Years ago when researching alternative cancer cures, I came across this guy selling this stuff called MMS or Miracle, Mineral, Supplement. First of all, anything with the term "miracle" in the title set's off my bs-ometer. He was using the same sales pitch as with the oleander, that it killed cancer cells in a petri dish. Upon further investigation, it turns out that what he is selling is pool disinfectant. All he does is take the powdered stuff which is dirt cheap wholesale, put it in solution and add an eye dropper, then charge exorbitant prices.

                            People like that are one of the lowest forms of human pond scum in my estimation.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                              Years ago when researching alternative cancer cures, I came across this guy selling this stuff called MMS or Miracle, Mineral, Supplement. First of all, anything with the term "miracle" in the title set's off my bs-ometer. He was using the same sales pitch as with the oleander, that it killed cancer cells in a petri dish. Upon further investigation, it turns out that what he is selling is pool disinfectant. All he does is take the powdered stuff which is dirt cheap wholesale, put it in solution and add an eye dropper, then charge exorbitant prices.

                              People like that are one of the lowest forms of human pond scum in my estimation.
                              They are still selling MMS on Curezone. The guy who makes it has his own forum there. We have gone head to head as well primarily over the chemistry that he claims is behind it. He tries to claim that the product is chlorine dioxide, which is not true. Chlorine dioxide is a gas. Here is a link to one of my posts that contains other links to posts I did addressing his bogus claims:

                              Re: mms at The Truth in Medicine (MessageID: 1457000)

                              Comment


                              • I see discussion on this thread seems to have ended several weeks ago. Since then, I have been doing quite a bit of reading over on Dr. Kruse's blog. It is now a little more clear to me that iodine is essential to our brain's health, our thyroid's health, and other organs. Basically, our whole body needs. I am now in agreement with Dr. Kruse and others on this thread, the best way to aquire it is by dietary means. And truly, the only means that has always been available is through seafood. Supplementation seems to be just that supplementation, since my land based diet is also iodine deficient. I am a true believer on the need for iodine as I am really amazed in some of the changes in my body that I have witnessed since supplementing iodine.

                                On Grizz, he is known over there and is tolerated as an enthusiastic proponent. He is not harshly criticized so much as he is gently corrected. I believe the tone taken in MDA to shout him down is wrong, on both this thread and the old thread. I believe that if you disagree with someone, it is more important for you to state your case more strongly and not succomb to the name calling and other insanity I saw here. When I was an empty vessel, he jump started my knowledge base. As that job of being a teacher, he did a fine job. He started me on a quest for more knowledge and provided some places for me to search. Yes, I supplemented rather high, but titrated back down and I thank JamesS for guiding me on that part of my magical tour. I think I learned something from everbody here. So I thank you all.

                                With that said, I am unsubscribing from this thread and bid you all a fond good day.
                                Learning the intricacies of healthy eating and nourishing my body the right way.
                                I am not bald, that is a Vitamin D collector. Time to Grok and Roll!
                                Eased into a primal diet starting at Christmas 2011. Goal weight - 205 started: 240 pounds waist 40, now 227 pounds and waist 38 Summer 2012 - weight =215 and waist is actually still 39"
                                ljbprrfmof = LJ = Little John = John

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