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Iodine: a discussion, and perhaps a civilized debate

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  • Originally posted by Paysan View Post
    Hey Griz and JamesS , I love watching you fight over something I never said! Read carefully with sabres sheathed. I never started at 4 drops Lugol's 2%; I started with a single drop and it took 8 weeks to work up to 8 drops, with weekends off. And I took my salt in water when the rash (acne on body) started, as well as keeping all the other supplements going. Then I stopped for a couple weeks, started developing a gut ailment that may or may not be related to the "Boil Water Advisory" that I've been living under for at least 10 days. Whatever, I'm back on 4 drops a day, and feel it keeps me safer than w/o iodine.
    The ironic thing is that Grizz is arguing over something I never said either.

    But since you posted in your previous post about this as well I might as well say that you need to look up the symptoms of iodine poisoning vs. bromine poisoning. You were showing classic symptoms of iodine adverse effects. Yes, bromine can also cause the acne like eruptions just like iodine, but not the other symptoms. And again, it is virtually impossible to build up enough bromine in the body due to the normal rapid excretion of bromide from the body, and the amount of fluoride, sodium and chloride we are exposed to on a daily basis that speed up the elimination even more. If you want to keep believing in the mythical "bromine detox" go for it. Some people have to learn the hard way.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
      And again Grizz the claim was made up. Once I was banned I had no access to anyone's e-mails to contact them. So the only people I corresponded with were the people who wrote to me to tell me that "Doc" Shillington was telling people that I was a quack and to not have any contact with me because I posted solid evidence that he was wrong about the topic we were discussing. Clearly, like you, Shillington does not like being proven wrong.

      If you want to keep posting this lie then explain to everyone here how I was able to contact anyone on that forum first when I had NO access to anyone's e-mails when I was banned. I guess you believe in magic now.
      I don't care why you were banned. If you don't understand it by now, the reason you are being banned is that you have an obsessive need to prove everyone else wrong. Just look at yourself in this thread:
      Re: The Truth about Soy Foods at Diet & Nutrition Support Forum (MessageID: 1691711)
      You are attacking everyone in sight including doctors - just as you are in this thread.

      The fact is that you are banned from 2 forums and it is clear to me why. Keep causing trouble in this thread and the moderators will close it. You can start this process by admitting that Doctors who have done YEARS of research on iodine are not wrong. Stop trying to prove that everyone is wrong.

      However on the good side, you are extremely unlikely to ever be banned here at MDA. You have a forum here for life regardless of how obnoxious you are. The worst that happens is the moderators just close your thread, and you can just open a new thread.

      I would like to see you tone it down and not try to prove that everyone but you are wrong. Admit that the doctors who have spent > 5 years in the Iodine Project know more than you do about iodine is a great start.
      Read this link:
      http://www.gabrielcousens.com/LinkCl...language=en-US

      Grizz

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
        I don't care why you were banned. If you don't understand it by now, the reason you are being banned is that you have an obsessive need to prove everyone else wrong. Just look at yourself in this thread:
        Re: The Truth about Soy Foods at Diet & Nutrition Support Forum (MessageID: 1691711)
        You are attacking everyone in sight including doctors - just as you are in this thread.

        The fact is that you are banned from 2 forums and it is clear to me why. Keep causing trouble in this thread and the moderators will close it. You can start this process by admitting that Doctors who have done YEARS of research on iodine are not wrong. Stop trying to prove that everyone is wrong.

        However on the good side, you are extremely unlikely to ever be banned here at MDA. You have a forum here for life regardless of how obnoxious you are. The worst that happens is the moderators just close your thread, and you can just open a new thread.

        I would like to see you tone it down and not try to prove that everyone but you are wrong. Admit that the doctors who have spent > 5 years in the Iodine Project know more than you do about iodine is a great start.
        Read this link:
        http://www.gabrielcousens.com/LinkCl...language=en-US

        Grizz
        You are shitting me!

        OMG! Take a look at yourself Grizz. Too too funny for words. Need to gasp.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
          Interesting hypothesis about high carb diets leading to iodine deficiency disease. Thought perhaps the people in this thread could comment Elsevier
          It would be interesting to see the whole article to see how they came to this conclusion. The problem I see is they clearly state that the high carbohydrate intake led to an increase in T3, which requires iodine for formation. If the high carbohydrate intake is causing an iodine deficiency then where is the iodine coming from that is allowing the extra production of iodine based T3?

          There is also no mention of what carbohydrates they are referring to. If people were loading up on pure sugar, which does not contain any iodine I can think of another simple explanation of why there is an iodine deficiency. On the other hand other carbohydrate sources may be associated with some iodine content.

          Basically there is to little information to go on.

          Comment


          • Grizz YOU are the one demanding of others and insisting you are right.

            James is adding information from his knowledge, something you do not have.

            Comment


            • James,
              Don't call me a liar. Here is your exact words, as I have pointed out several times earlier.
              Originally Posted by Paysan
              It was an outbreak of hard-headed pimplelike spots that made me back down. Within a couple weeks, my diverticula started inflaming, but it was another 2 weeks before the pain sent me to doctor. Now I'm back on 4 drops iodine daily, but will eventually switch to sea veggies and safe seafish, as I still prefer food to supplements. (But will supplement as long as I live, thanks to modern living.)

              Originally Posted by JamesS
              Yep, symptoms of iodism.
              Now once again since you keep ignoring the question, tell us how many mg of iodine does it take take to cause iodism?
              * 4 drops of Lugols?
              * 12mg ?
              * 25mg ?
              * 50mg?
              All of these doses of iodine are considered safe by the iodine doctors:
              http://www.gabrielcousens.com/LinkCl...language=en-US

              Grizz

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                Paysan,
                Thank you for your update, but your starting level of iodine has nothing to do with the issue. Remember that he called your 4 drops of iodine "Poisonous."

                The issue is that James has been calling extremely safe levels of iodine "Poisonous," and has been insisting that the Iodine Doctors are prescribing "Poisonous" dosages of iodine, such as Dr. Brownstein' Iodine Protocol.
                Grizz, stop already with the personal attacks. If you want to discuss iodine then discuss iodine. But stop making it personal.

                As for the comment above this says nothing about Lugol's as you kept claiming. Secondly, you need to learn the difference between iodine and iodide, which is less toxic. And finally, Paysan was exhibiting symptoms of iodine poisoning as has been pointed out. If you also research the symptoms of bromine poisoning from credible sites, in other words not places like the Curezone iodine forum, you will find that all of his symptoms were not consistent with bromine poisoning. They are consistent with iodine poisoning though.

                Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                Then he attacks Trapper over at the Curezone for suggesting that people start with 100mg's of iodine. While I certainly don't agree with this, no one has died from this level of iodine, and those who follow his advice do report amazing success. Trapper's rational is that starting with such a high level gets Detox over with quickly, in a matter of a few days.
                Trapper also ignores all the overwhelming scientific and medical evidence that has been presented to him that the reason those symptoms disappear is because the excess iodine causes the thyroid to shut down to protect itself from the poisonous levels of iodine. This is part of iodine poisoning. And again, just because someone is poisoned this does not mean they are going to die from the poisoning.

                Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                James has been banned from 2 discussion groups and the image he chose for his ID at the Curezone was the Piranha. Perhaps fitting because he goes into a "Feeding Frenzy" with anyone who disagrees with him, as we have seen here.
                Maybe someday you will actually get something correct. That is my big baby Pirano. He got his name because he looks like a piranha but he is not one. He is a 20" long red pacu. By the way, pacus are primarily vegetarians. His diet consists mainly of vegetables, Brazil nuts and acorns. Occasionally I will catch large bugs for him such as cicadas or cockroaches as a treat. He is actually a very docile fish though and will come to be hand fed.

                Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                "Doc" said about hveragerthi aka James Sloane, aka ??, "Yessssssss, well some people love to spread confusion and trouble and I guess our friend James is like that. Kinda sad actually."
                What is really sad is that you feel you have to keep personally attacking me with whatever bogus "evidence" you can dig up in desperation since you have no real evidence to present to back your claims. So you have to resort to repeated character assassination. Yep, truly sad!

                Comment


                • I never thought I'd say it, for it's been kind of funny recently, but this is tiring and getting old fast.

                  Please knock off the 'Na Na Na Boo Boo' and 'Nyahh Nyahh' posts (and personal insults & name calling posts) and let's all disagree rationally and respectfully. Let's start afresh now, OK? There have been some interesting disagreements. The hysterical irrational screeching and nasty snarky comments really should stop.
                  Last edited by KerryK; 08-18-2012, 09:08 AM. Reason: Grammar
                  SW: 243
                  CW: 177
                  Goal: Health

                  Comment


                  • James,
                    You keep changing the subject.

                    I will keep posting this message until you answer the question.
                    Don't call me a liar. Here is your exact words, as I have pointed out several times earlier.
                    Originally Posted by Paysan
                    It was an outbreak of hard-headed pimplelike spots that made me back down. Within a couple weeks, my diverticula started inflaming, but it was another 2 weeks before the pain sent me to doctor. Now I'm back on 4 drops iodine daily, but will eventually switch to sea veggies and safe seafish, as I still prefer food to supplements. (But will supplement as long as I live, thanks to modern living.)

                    Originally Posted by JamesS
                    Yep, symptoms of iodism.
                    Now once again since you keep ignoring the question, tell us how many mg of iodine does it take take to cause iodism?
                    * 4 drops of Lugols?
                    * 12mg ?
                    * 25mg ?
                    * 50mg?
                    All of these doses of iodine are considered safe by the iodine doctors. Are they ALL wrong?
                    http://www.gabrielcousens.com/LinkCl...language=en-US

                    Grizz
                    Last edited by Grizz; 08-18-2012, 09:22 AM.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                      James,
                      You keep changing the subject.

                      I will keep posting this message until you answer the question.
                      Don't call me a liar. Here is your exact words, as I have pointed out several times earlier.


                      Now once again since you keep ignoring the question, tell us how many mg of iodine does it take take to cause iodism?
                      * 4 drops of Lugols?
                      * 12mg ?
                      * 25mg ?
                      * 50mg?
                      All of these doses of iodine are considered safe by the iodine doctors:
                      http://www.gabrielcousens.com/LinkCl...language=en-US

                      Grizz

                      Comment


                      • Yes, James, your purpose in life is to answer Grizz's demands.

                        A man who has no purpose but to jump on others' bandwagon. A man who has no answers himself.

                        Pathetic

                        Comment


                        • James,

                          What is the maximum level of Lugols iodine in mg that you consider to be safe?

                          Grizz

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by KathyH View Post
                            Liver aside. James, what would your suggestion be for someone who had thyroidectomy and has high cholesterol, taking syntroid and Lipitor, feeling constantly tired, thinning hair and having numerous other alignments. Any suggestions on how to get a person like that to feel normal? The person I am describing is my mother and I don't know how to help her. Thanks
                            Since the thyroid was removed they have no other choice other than to take pharmaceutical thyroid hormones. But I would go with Armour over Synthroid since it at least provides T4 and the more biologically active T3. Synthroid is only the less active T4.

                            As for the high cholesterol my main suggestions would be bitters and lecithin. The bitters help the liver process cholesterol more efficiently. Lecithin is a fat emulsifier and keeps cholesterol in solution and promotes its excretion. Fish oils will help increase HDL, which in turn lowers LDL. I also like sterol rich plants. Sterols have a very high affinity for cholesterol and tightly bind to it. Sterols will bind the cholesterol from diet and will bind to the cholesterol released in to the intestines in bile. The binding prevents the reabsorption of the cholesterol. Various plants contain sterols. The highest source I have found though is Gynostemma (jiaogulan). Food wise olive oil is a source and seeds have a fair amount. Here is more information:

                            Dietary Plant Sterols and Cholesterol Metabolism

                            Plant Sterols and Stanols for Helping High Cholesterol

                            Inverse relation between dietary intake of naturally occurring plant sterols and serum cholesterol in northern Sweden

                            Since hypothyroidism also increases inflammatory homocysteine increasing the risk of heart disease I also recommend trimethylglycine (TMG) to keep the homocysteine levels down.
                            Last edited by JamesS; 08-18-2012, 09:47 AM.

                            Comment


                            • James,

                              What is the maximum level of Lugols iodine in mg that you consider to be safe for most people?

                              Are you afraid to answer? Or do you just not know the answer?

                              Grizz
                              Last edited by Grizz; 08-18-2012, 10:00 AM.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                                Don't even start with your Iodine Poisoning BS again...


                                You were banned for for same reason that you are calling iodine poisonous - If they called you a QUACK then maybe the term fits. Stop calling iodine poisonous and we will get along just fine.
                                OK, I will not use the word poisonous I will use the word poison. Happy? Hmm.... Why do you suppose bottles of iodine have a skull and crossbones on them Grizz?

                                Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                                You have still not answered my question - Tell us where iodine poisoning begins in your opinion. 12mg? 24mg? 50mg? 100mg?
                                Was answered a while back. Not surprised though that you did not understand the answer.

                                Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                                You have called 4 drops of lugols iodine as causing iodism. Sorry but this is DEAD WRONG !

                                Grizz
                                Learn to read Grizz. I made no mention of Lugol's. If you ever get anything right we will have to have a great big celebration.

                                Comment

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