Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Iodine: a discussion, and perhaps a civilized debate

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • * Now water filters are ADDING Toxic Halogens to our water?????

    THIS IS HORRIBLE ! Fluoride & Chlorine being added by water filters????

    Originally posted by Zophie
    I was just changing the water filter and inside the box in tiny fine print it said "Now with added beneficial fluoride".

    Nowhere on the outside of the packaging does it say it adds fluoride. So, it seems I have been poisoning my self for a while now and all that buying the good toothpaste was for nothing. =( Things like this are frustrating to me. I would never have purchased that system if I had known.

    I am ordering a water distiller but until it comes what should I drink? What is the lesser of the two evils of fluoride and chlorine?
    Mine is a new wave pure 10. It is the kind that attaches under the sink with its own faucet.
    I do know that both brita and pur add fluoride and minerals also. (at least they are up-front about it!)

    I know for a fact that pur adds fluoride and minerals because our refrigerator came with a pur filter for the ice maker and that was one of their big selling points.

    =============================
    Wombat, "yikes. I looked it up on amazon:

    "The filter removes or greatly reduces chlorine, carcinogenic organic and chlorine compounds called trihalomethanes (THM), bad odors such as hydrogen sulfide, pesticides, herbicides, PCBs, toxic heavy metals like lead, cadmium, organic arsenic, asbestos, micro-organisms such as cryptosporidium and giardia, and dozens of other organic contaminants. Once your water has been filtered, inert and desirable minerals like magnesium, potassium, chlorides, and fluoride are left behind."

    Left behind? What the H does that mean? I would assume that it's somehow filtering out the other stuff FROM THE WATER and somehow magically leaving the !!desirable!! stuff, not ADDING it.

    And I did NOT know that brita and pur add fluoride and "minerals". Thanks for that info.

    We filter our water at the well and the sink, laundry, etc. Now I wonder.... gotta talk to hubby.

    =============================
    Chlorine or Fluoride? at Iodine Supplementation Support by VWT Team (MessageID: 1971376)
    All normal water filters just pass the fluoride or chlorine. I don't think they actually ADD fluoride. The only filters known to remove fluoride are Reverse Osmosis and Distillation filters.
    Distilled Water Myths
    I have been thinking of ordering a distiller. Does anyone have any buying tips?

    Grizz
    Last edited by Grizz; 08-15-2012, 12:02 PM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
      The only similar effects I am aware of is the acne-like rashes.

      Other than that a lot of the side effects of iodism that are being incorrectly blamed on bromism do not fit the symptoms of bromine toxicity. For example, I have seen people claiming that a racing heart after taking iodine was from bromism. Problem is that bromine does not stimulate the system like iodine. Bromine is a sedative, which is why bromine has a history of being used as a sleep aid and anticonvulsant.
      It was an outbreak of hard-headed pimplelike spots that made me back down. Within a couple weeks, my diverticula started inflaming, but it was another 2 weeks before the pain sent me to doctor. Now I'm back on 4 drops iodine daily, but will eventually switch to sea veggies and safe seafish, as I still prefer food to supplements. (But will supplement as long as I live, thanks to modern living.)

      Comment


      • I also looked up bromism in Wikipedia. Here's part of what it said: Quote:Jump to: navigation, search
        Bromism
        Classification and external resources
        ICD-10 F13.2, G92, T42.6, T59.8
        ICD-9 967.3, E852.2

        Bromism is the syndrome which results from the long-term use of the potassium bromide-based sedatives. Bromism was once a very common disorder, being responsible for 5-10% of psychiatric hospital admissions. It is now an uncommon disorder due to bromide being withdrawn from clinical use in many countries and severely restricted in others. The mechanism of bromism is due to high levels of bromide chronically impairing the membrane of neurons which progressively impairs neuronal transmission which leads to toxicity. Bromide has a very long elimination half-life of 9–12 days, which can lead to excessive accumulation. Doses of 0.5-1 gram per day of bromide can lead to bromism. The therapeutic dose of bromide is about 3-5 grams of bromide, thus explaining why chronic toxicity (bromism) was once so common. While significant and sometimes serious disturbances occur to neurologic, psychiatric, dermatological, and gastrointestinal functions, death is rare from bromism.[1] Bromide is still occasionally used, however, for epilepsy in some countries. Bromism is caused by a neurotoxic effect on the brain which results in somnolence, psychosis, seizures and delirium.[2] Endquote

        Hmm, interesting. Bromism is a sedative, a nerve toxin, and an intestinal disturber. So I can see iodine being used in sufficient quantities to displace the halogen bromine that causes any type of intestinal problem (including Chron's ), plus epilepsy and pyschoses. There is also a pix of an infant with bromide rashes, far more numerous and darker than what I had.

        Comment


        • Paysan,
          There is more in iodine references:
          See the chapter, "Detox & Chemical Poisons.
          http://tinyurl.com/iodine-references

          Bromide poisoning can put you in a bad mental space with dark thoughts, depression, brain fog and general lassitude. Don't we all, from time to time? Before you reach for tonics, adaptogens, immune boosters and smart drinks let us get to grips with some of the other symptoms of bromide poisoning. Neurodevelopment is adversely affected by bromide as it dominates iodine receptors, causing behavioural problems like attention deficit hyperactivity disorders, (ADD and ADHD) schizophrenia and unexplained headaches.

          We treat these symptoms with Rtalin, painkillers and mind altering drugs and expensive supplements out of the top drawer. But do we recognise the underlying causative factors? Along with an impaired emotional and intellectual status quo, bromide poisoning can result in adult acne, mouth ulcers and a bad metallic taste in the mouth. Iodine deficiencies also creep up in direct proportion to bromide toxicity. Because fluoride also displaces iodine, modern "hygienic" mouthwashes only make it worse.

          Bromide Poisoning and Thyroid Problems

          Elevated bromide levels have been implicated in every thyroid disease, from simple hypothyroidism to auto-immune diseases to thyroid cancer. Bromide levels are found to be 50 times higher in thethyroid tissue of thyroid cancer patients. By now we all know that iodine has something to do with the thyroid function and in many cases all it takes is a little iodine to correct hypothyroidism. But bromide competes with iodine and will not give up that easily! Auto-immune diseases like Hashimoto's and Graves' disease will flare up when the resident iodine reserves have been ousted by bromide. Initially, adding iodine to the equation will make matters worse as it will move the bromide into the bloodstream.

          The Battle of the Halogens

          Chlorine, fluoride, bromide and iodine belong to a group of elements we call halogens. They have a pecking order and iodine is subject to displacement by the other three halogens in this family. Thus if chlorine, fluoride or bromide levels are too high, they usurp iodine receptors. We experience familiar symptoms of iodine deficiencies even when we top up on kelp, seafood or Lugol's iodine. The bromide bully interferes with our iodine reserves. Chlorine and fluoride affect our thyroid glands and also displace iodine. We filter our water and use fluoride free oral hygiene products, yet we unwittingly saturate ourselves with bromide.

          Where Does the Bromide Come From?

          Where is bromide coming from? Bread! The staff of life, they call it. Prior to 1960, iodine was used as a dough improver but then it was replaced with bromide. You will not see bromide listed under ingredients on the packaging. All you see is a large, fluffy slice of bread. You will ingest the bromide and it will compete with your iodine reserves. A low iodine status will be the result. Investigative studies showed that when bromide was used by the baking industry instead of iodine, people became increasingly iodine deficient. A double whammy!

          Other sources of bromide include all grains that are treated with the pesticide: methyl bromide. That includes mealies, rice, beans, lentils and other pulses. We don't like eating weevils, mould, fungus or creepy crawlies in our food so all too often they get zapped with methyl bromide and we consume it. Some countries refuse to import such produce but for now, South Africa seems to be turning a blind eye, preferring toxins to "goggas". Some of our dried fruit is also treated with bromide to sustain its shelf life. We also breathe in the bromide-rich fumes coming from carpets, mattresses and other household items that have been chemically treated.

          Modern "Medicine" and Bromide Vaccines

          We know that mercury poisoning can be caused by vaccines, but who would want to be vaccinated with bromide? During the Gulf War, soldiers were inoculated with bromide. Some of them were totally unaware of what was going on, let alone the reason for the jab. Emotionally, they went to pieces until the true cause was tracked down. It was not war -induced trauma as much as the bromide poisoning! Bromide that invades the system gets stored as bromine in the tissues and fat cells and this is a very dangerous substance. The antidote is iodine, but not without a toxic backlash. The protocol is exacting, because the bromide needs to be flushed away as soon as the iodine is taken.

          Half a Spoonful of Salt Makes the Bromide Go Away!

          The Gulf war troops suffering from emotional issues were treated by orthomolecular physicians who guided them through an iodine-based detoxification protocol. To treat the bromide poisoning a supervised iodine supplementation was given to them. It was chased down with a good pinch of salt! Yes, salt contains chloride, another of the halogens that kicks out bromide. The salt loading technique is the brainchild of Dr William Shevin. a natural form of salt is best to use. Half a teaspoon of sea salt was mixed with cup of water for the treatment. As soon as an adverse effect was experienced from taking the dose of iodine, they drank the mixture. (Eating more salt does not work the same.)

          Over time, the iodine once again engage with its own receptors and restore full functionality once more. We do not realise how iodine contributes to so many aspects of our physical and emotional wellbeing. It is only when we lose it that we notice how terrible we feel both emotionally and physically. A few drops of the famous Lugol's iodine will not even out the score until the bromide factor is addressed. So, take it with a pinch of salt!

          From the Nature Fresh website Sue runs Q & A sessions. She focuses on dietary and lifestyle causes of illness and ways to treat them. She gives out free detox protocols, recipes and suggestions that have helped many individuals to solve conditions that did not respond to conventional treatment. Her book provides dietary adjustments and natural ways to deal with allergies, stress, inflammation, obesity, diabetes, asthma and hormone balancing.

          The Symptoms of Bromide Poisoning
          Bromide Poisoning May Be the Cause of Your Headaches, Bad Mood and Thyroid Problems!

          And we see why Dr. Brownstein requires Natural Salt as a part of the iodine protocol and the need for Salt Flushing when detox symptoms appear.

          Why take the salt?
          http://curezone.com/forums/fm.asp?i=1562970#i

          Grizz
          Last edited by Grizz; 08-15-2012, 03:47 PM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
            Yes, we need fats, but there are good fats and bad fats. So simply loading up on fats in not necessarily a good idea. They can provide a lot of calories, but they are also the most efficient dietary fuel for the body. I used to race running and triathlons and do cross country bicycling. One of the things I had learned back then was oil loading for races. You don't simply just go drinking a lot of oil without building up to it. Otherwise it can cause diarrhea. But an old racer's trick is to start out with a spoon full of oil then work up to a tablespoon and finally work up to a cup of oil right before a race. Since oil is a more efficient fuel that either proteins or carbohydrates it can help with energy and endurance. If the person is more sedentary though the oil can be a major calorie load.

            Also keep in mind that some fat sources are high in the pro-inflammatory omega 6 fatty acid arachidonic acid.

            Your diet does contain quite a bit of cholesterol and very little in the way of binders. But the main thing I see I would avoid is the liver. Liver is 6 times higher in cholesterol than beef, but the bigger issue with liver is what else is in it. When I was a little kid we had a really neat family doctor. He was more old school and did not believe in medications unless absolutely unnecessary. I remember something really interesting he mentioned about liver. He said he would not touch liver because it is the filter for the body's toxins. And eating liver means ingesting those toxins. Made a lot of sense to me. The more we put in to the body that the liver has to process the more stress we put on the liver.
            Originally posted by Radialhead View Post
            Liver's fine. Well when I say fine, I mean disgusting, but safe, assuming you're getting it from a reputable source. Filters store all the stuff they're filtering out - the liver doesn't.
            OK, now I am confused I am eating most of the things recommended on this side. There are claims that liver is SOOOO GOOOD for you. So is it good or bad or simply we don't know and therefore we should just avoid it? Some people put liver in their smoothies so they can eat as much of it as possible.

            What cholesterol binders am I lacking?
            Originally posted by JamesS View Post
            I forgot to add that coffee also raises cholesterol. This has long been a pet peeve of mine or a long time. Before going in for blood tests they tell you that you need to fast, but you are allowed to have coffee before the test. Coffee though alters many of the readings such as raising blood sugar, cholesterol and inflammatory markers among others. It can also alter non-blood tests such as raising blood pressure readings, which can lead to the prescribing of unneeded anti-hypertension medications for the false high reading of the blood pressure and other unnecessary drugs for the other false high readings.

            Therefore, if you want more accurate cholesterol readings I recommend avoiding all stimulants (caffeine, nicotine, etc.) before the blood draw. Also relax before the test since stress, such as getting stuck with a needle, also raises cholesterol levels temporarily.
            I do not drink coffee when I go for blood test. I don't even drink water.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Radialhead View Post
              Liver's fine. Well when I say fine, I mean disgusting, but safe, assuming you're getting it from a reputable source. Filters store all the stuff they're filtering out - the liver doesn't.
              Filters do not store what they filter. Consider the kidneys, which are filters. They are filters but not storage organs.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
                Filters do not store what they filter. Consider the kidneys, which are filters. They are filters but not storage organs.
                His point was that eating liver is not the same thing as eating the toxins that liver filters out.

                Changing the subject slightly James, why are you so high on Ozone treatment? I thought that a big part of what we were shooting for in our diet is anti-oxidants, yet from what I understand Ozone acts essentially by shedding the third Oxygen atom, which then oxidises something nearby. Why is deliberately creating an oxidised zone good in our body when generally odxidation is bad for us?
                Last edited by magicmerl; 08-15-2012, 08:14 PM.
                Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

                Griff's cholesterol primer
                5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
                Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
                TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
                bloodorchid is always right

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                  Where Does the Bromide Come From?
                  Some inhalers for asthma and COPD also contain bromide:
                  Atrovent, Apovent, Aerovent, Combivent, Duoneb, Duovent and Berodual N - ipratropium bromide HFA
                  Pressair - aclidinium bromide
                  Spiriva, and Tiova - tiotropium bromide

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by KathyH View Post
                    OK, now I am confused I am eating most of the things recommended on this side. There are claims that liver is SOOOO GOOOD for you. So is it good or bad or simply we don't know and therefore we should just avoid it?
                    It's good - it's one of the original 'super-foods' - packed with nutrients. I'm sure Mark did a blog post on this very subject if you want to search the archives.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by JamesS View Post
                      Filters do not store what they filter.
                      Air filters, oil filters, fuel filters, coffee filters, respirator filters - all store what they filter, & all the sort of things most people would think of when you mention filters.

                      Originally posted by JamesS View Post
                      Consider the kidneys, which are filters. They are filters but not storage organs.
                      And neither is the liver a storage organ. If you eat it, you won't also be eating all the toxins it's processed (a better word than filtered).

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
                        Changing the subject slightly James, why are you so high on Ozone treatment? I thought that a big part of what we were shooting for in our diet is anti-oxidants, yet from what I understand Ozone acts essentially by shedding the third Oxygen atom, which then oxidises something nearby. Why is deliberately creating an oxidised zone good in our body when generally odxidation is bad for us?
                        The whole point of cancer treatments is to kill the cancerous cells. Creating an oxidised zone in the middle of a tumour is good because it should kill (at least part of) the tumour.
                        Argue not with idiots, lest they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Sceptic View Post
                          The whole point of cancer treatments is to kill the cancerous cells. Creating an oxidised zone in the middle of a tumour is good because it should kill (at least part of) the tumour.
                          Sceptic,

                          I found this excellent article on Ozone Therapy:
                          How It Works

                          Cancer cells die when exposed to oxygen (cancer cells are anaerobic). There are many oxygen and ozone treatments, however, this article will discuss two of the best known and most effective "Stage IV" treatments - infusion bottle and ozone I.V.

                          Ozone therapy using an infusion bottle involves removing part of the blood from the body, saturating this blood with oxygen (i.e. ozone - O3), then putting this oxygen rich blood back into the body.

                          An ozone I.V. simply injects a fluid saturated with ozone into the blood. Both treatments work by getting oxygen into the body.

                          The Ozone RHP technique, which puts ozone gas directly into the bloodstream, is discussed in a separate article. (See link above)

                          Ozone Therapy

                          There are many different ways to get oxygen to the cancer cells using either Hydrogen Peroxide or Ozone. The Ozone treatments discussed herein must be administered by a medical practitioner.

                          In infusion bottle therapy: "a pint of blood is drawn from the patient and placed in an infusion bottle. The ozone is then forced into the bottle and mixed in by shaking gently, whereupon the blood turns bright cardinal red ... The treated blood is then given back to the patient."

                          There are very few cancer cells in the blood, for most types of cancer. In any case, it is the oxygen put back into the body that actually treats the cancer. It is very similar to an ozone I.V. except that the blood is being used as the fluid transport for the ozone. There are other benefits as well by using this treatment because of the high dose of ozone given to part of the blood.

                          Ozone treatments are generally given from twice a week to twice a day, depending on how advanced the disease is and other issues. Treatments can last for weeks or months.

                          Ozone I.V. is a similar treatment, except that no blood is extracted. An ozone saturated fluid is put into the bloodstream via I.V.

                          "Ozone has been found to be an extremely safe medical therapy, free from side effects. In a 1980 study done by the German Medical Society for Ozone Therapy, 644 therapists were polled regarding their 384,775 patients, comprising a total of 5,579,238 ozone treatments administered. There were only 40 cases of side effects noted out of this number which represents the incredibly low rate of .000007%, and only four fatalities. Ozone has thus proven to be the safest medical therapy ever devised." Considering that about 100,000 Americans a year die from drug reactions and interactions, ozone therapy is amazingly safe."
                          More here:
                          Ozone Cancer Treatments - Alternative Cancer Treatments

                          Grizz
                          Last edited by Grizz; 08-16-2012, 07:06 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                            JamesS,

                            I never said Trapper was an expert. What I said was there are iodine experts at the Curezone.
                            Iodine Supplementation Support Forum by VWT Team, Page 267, Vulcanel, Wombat & Trapper/kcmo:
                            So who are the experts there? If it not Trapper and everyone parrots his advice there who are the experts?

                            Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                            I consider the curezone to be the very best iodine forum available. Just beware of what is said. There is BS on that forum just as with any other forum, which is the major reason why I insist on following a Doctor's protocol when taking iodine. There is no legitimate doctor who would EVER suggest that anyone actually start iodine at 150mg. We must take everything we read with a grain of salt.
                            We will have to agree to disagree on the claim that the Curezone iodine forum being the very best iodine forum. That would be true if they were the only iodine forum on the internet, but otherwise that forum is so full of dangerous, hyped up misinformation that I would never recommend anyone go there for advice.

                            [QUOTE=Grizz;928970]PS) I would like to suggest that you write magazine articles & books about iodine. There are MILLIONS of women suffering from severe iodine deficiency and the resulting Fibrocystic Breasts, PCOS, Uterus Problems, hypothyroid & depression. QUOTE]

                            Again, fibrocystic breast disease, PCOS and uterine problems that you are referring to are fro elevated estrogen, not an iodine deficiency. And just because iodine antagonizes estrogen there are safer ways to do this such as phytoestrogens.

                            As for hypothyroidism as I also pointed out there are many causes of hypothyroidism and many have NOTHING to do with iodine deficiency. On the other hand high iodine levels can aggravate hypothyroidism from Hashimoto's and excess iodine can cause hypothyroidism or induce Hashimoto's. To imply that iodine is the for all cases of hypothyroidism is ridiculous.

                            The same applies to depression. Again, depression has numerous causes and the only cause associated with iodine is hypothyroidism that can be caused by a lack of iodine or an excess of iodine in some cases.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                              * Iodine Deficiency can result in Fibromyalgia
                              * Iodine Cures some cases of Fibromyalgia


                              What about Fibromyalgia & Iodine?
                              Fibromyalgia has been linked to low muscular ATP levels and low serotonin, not an iodine deficiency or heavy metal poisoning.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
                                * Iodine Cures Chronic Fatigue Syndrome
                                Again this is misleading. Chronic fatigue syndrome is just that, a syndrome. Syndromes are not diseases and thus cannot be "cured". Syndromes are simply groups of symptoms. And as with other syndromes chronic fatigue syndrome can have various causes. Hypothyroidism is one cause, which iodine helps in some cases and induces or makes worse in other cases.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X