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  • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
    Here's what I ate today to give you an idea of my typical Peat-y day:

    7am -> Coffee(Espresso shot w/ 8oz raw whole milk and 1Tbsp sugar)
    11am (post yoga) -> Chocolate shake (12oz raw whole milk, 2tbsp homemade chocolate syrup, 1/8tsp salt, and 1tbsp gelatin)
    1pm -> 2 hardboiled eggs w/ salt, 1 nectarine, 10oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz 70% dark chocolate
    3:30pm -> "Yummy Earth" Cherry lollipop w/ salt.
    4:30pm -> 30ish cherries, 8oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz raw cheddar cheese.
    8pm -> Grass-fed beef hot dog w/ ketchup(made with sugar), 1 nectarine, 8oz whole raw milk
    Eeek...!

    Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    I respectfully disagree. Yogurt (as with all fermented dairy) generates more insulin than milk.



    Insulin: An Undeserved Bad Reputation, Part 3…MOOOOO!!!! Weightology Weekly

    I don't believe bad reactions to dairy have nothing to do with insulin. I don't think Type II Diabetes has much to do with insulin. If you look at the facts, starches and sugars may give diabetics issues, but dairy doesn't. Dairy comes paired with a glucagon reaction that balances the massive insulin spike in the absence of increased blood sugar. There is something else going on, here.

    People are probably having bad reactions to milk because of the inflammatory proteins or natural bovine growth hormones it contains - after all, it's designed to grow baby cows into massive beasts. Fermenting milk removes a lot of these things thanks to the lactobacillus bacteria - it partially digests the milk so your gut doesn't have to do so much work. JMO.
    Wow... bloody hell - you know your stuff choco!

    Btw - you mentioned in one thread here that you get cold after eating - it happens to me too, and apparently feeling chilled after eating is a sign of an imbalance in the digestion. With properly functioning digestion, you should be feeling a little warm after eating (the digestive enzymes are fired up, which generates heat). have you ever looked into it?

    Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Lol....there has been a lot of that going around too (I actually heard it would make my hair AND penis fall out though )
    Lol see you in the sweet shop!!
    "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

    In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

    - Ray Peat

    Comment


    • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
      I don't believe that. Martin Berkhan has shown pretty definitively that, at least for men, smaller feeding periods and less meals with the same caloric totals provide better results. They consistently have less issues with "stubborn fat" because the longer fasting periods increase the oxidation of alpha-2 receptors, which is the notoriously hard fat to get rid of (bellybutton fat on men and thigh fat on women). In addition, since Ray Peat is all about minimizing stress on the body, I'm not sure how you could support so much eating and stressing the digestive system so much. You are constantly walking around with elevated insulin and blood glucose, never giving yourself time to normalize and never giving your digestive system a break until you're asleep. Humans weren't made to snack all day. We are not cows, we are not grazers.
      I don't think you can generalize that for all humans. I am not trying to imply that either. You should do what makes you feel best. If I do 2-3 larger meals and/or IF I get bloated and gassy, more reflux and just feel crappy and lathargic. I can't handle large meals, no matter the diet. That's why the 5-6 smaller meals works better for me. I have no problems with fat storage. I am 6 feet tall, 152lbs and 10% body fat. If anything, I have problems gaining weight.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
        Eeek...!
        I don't know if it deserves an "Eeek." I don't think insulin is evil at all. I think demonizing insulin is evil.

        Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
        Btw - you mentioned in one thread here that you get cold after eating - it happens to me too, and apparently feeling chilled after eating is a sign of an imbalance in the digestion. With properly functioning digestion, you should be feeling a little warm after eating (the digestive enzymes are fired up, which generates heat). have you ever looked into it?
        I'm not worried. Pre-primal, I had thick blood. Now, my blood is so thin it's like water. If I get a paper cut I bleed and bleed and bleed. My friend got a new blood glucose meter and I pricked my finger with it. It bled for 5 minutes. So, I have very thin blood and after you eat, blood rushes to your stomach for digestion. It only lasts 5-10 minutes so I'm not all that worried.

        BTW, my BG was 73. It was 79-80 when I was strictly low-carb Primal (my first 4-6 months on the PB). Since incorporating large, regular refeed days for nearly a year (300+g of carbohydrate 3 times a week) it has actually gone down even more. Interesting eh?
        Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
          I don't know if it deserves an "Eeek." I don't think insulin is evil at all. I think demonizing insulin is evil.


          I'm not worried. Pre-primal, I had thick blood. Now, my blood is so thin it's like water. If I get a paper cut I bleed and bleed and bleed. My friend got a new blood glucose meter and I pricked my finger with it. It bled for 5 minutes. So, I have very thin blood and after you eat, blood rushes to your stomach for digestion. It only lasts 5-10 minutes so I'm not all that worried.

          BTW, my BG was 73. It was 79-80 when I was strictly low-carb Primal (my first 4-6 months on the PB). Since incorporating large, regular refeed days for nearly a year (300+g of carbohydrate 3 times a week) it has actually gone down even more. Interesting eh?
          The 'eek' had to do with bopher's food plan...

          And what does all the rest of it have to do with my question about body temp?!

          edit: just saw the bit about blod rushing to your stomach for digestion. Apparently this shouldn't make you feel cold though - the opposite in fact. Unless you think having thin blood has something to do with it..?

          Not saying it's a cause for concern at all - but it is intriguing.
          Last edited by YogaBare; 07-11-2012, 11:00 AM.
          "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

          In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

          - Ray Peat

          Comment


          • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
            How do you stay skeptical and at the same time be open-minded and not stubborn? If ANYONE can walk that line I'll be very impressed. I don't think it's been done by a mortal.
            It's definitely very difficult. I struggle with it too. What did help me was failing on Primal/Paleo. For the first 6 months or so I felt so good on it and I was convinced it was "the way" for everyone to get healthy. I definitely would like to take back some things said to friends and family. I kept chugging along for another 18 months or so while all my previous symptoms came back along with some new ones.

            Now I realize that the feeling good in the beginning was really just because of the SAD food items I removed from my diet, mostly PUFAs and grains from all the processed crap. That's why all diets, from Paleo to raw vegan, "work" in the short term at least.

            That all made me refocus on: What is truly the best food to feed our cells? Regardless of the time period we started eating it as humans. Ray Peat's work is the closest I have found for answering that question. I don't know if he's right about everything and I am definitely going to keep an open mind, but so far it's working for me.

            The only piece of advice I give to family and friends now is: Go back about 1900 and don't eat anything invented since then. It's all been down hill since the invention of margarine.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
              It's definitely very difficult. I struggle with it too.
              I have to say... I have quite a few friends who aren't gullible, know their own mind, but are still open to new ideas and things. You can do it if you don't identify so much with your beliefs.
              "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

              In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

              - Ray Peat

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Apex Predator View Post
                This is exactly it. People want to defend to "Primal Canon" and don't realize that it changes. Mark, to his credit, changes primal, slowly but surely. Much of that change is spurred by threads like this.
                Mark always said that calories matter, see chapter 8 in the PB. It's just that a lot of the people on the forum didn't want to hear that. Eating bacon by the pound is more fun.

                The 2012 paperback edition is billed as being "Updated and expanded". (I don't have a copy yet.)

                Comment


                • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
                  I don't think you can generalize that for all humans. I am not trying to imply that either. You should do what makes you feel best. If I do 2-3 larger meals and/or IF I get bloated and gassy, more reflux and just feel crappy and lathargic. I can't handle large meals, no matter the diet. That's why the 5-6 smaller meals works better for me. I have no problems with fat storage. I am 6 feet tall, 152lbs and 10% body fat. If anything, I have problems gaining weight.
                  My goodness. No wonder. By all means, eat, anything you want including sweetened OJ and milk. You have no reserves to tap into while IFing so it makes sense that that is not optimal for you.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                    I have to say... I have quite a few friends who aren't gullible, know their own mind, but are still open to new ideas and things. You can do it if you don't identify so much with your beliefs.
                    The most common response I get is "Everything in moderation", which pretty much shuts down the conversation. I mostly just let people come to me now. When they ask me questions, they are much more open minded to what I tell them.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                      It's totally fine to be skeptical - mild skepticism is healthy. How do you stay skeptical and at the same time be open-minded and not stubborn? If ANYONE can walk that line I'll be very impressed. I don't think it's been done by a mortal.
                      You just have to be willing to accept that what you are trying may be wrong. Failure is not that big of a deal, neither is being wrong. I am skeptical of everything I read and try - and it's usually wrong and turns out to be a waste of my time and money - but I just don't care. I keep trying new things even though I know they will likely fail.
                      Using low lectin/nightshade free primal to control autoimmune arthritis. (And lost 50 lbs along the way )

                      http://www.krispin.com/lectin.html

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                        I like Paleobird. She's very smart, very experienced and sticks to her guns. She's not afraid to stand her ground and I respect her for that. In a lot of ways we're a lot alike, and it gets us into trouble. She knows what works well for her, so she's naturally stubborn and resistant to change when she's had so much success. It's understandable.

                        I'm a bit younger so I'm probably by definition more open-minded and more open to change. I'm at the point in my life where experimentation is still fun. The issue with being open-minded is you can't be so open-minded you let your brains leak out.

                        The issue with The Primal Blueprint is we KNOW it works very well, and CW is so incredibly ass-backwards with nutrition we lose faith in all things CW. It's tough to meter it. Because of the PB, I'm wary of all conventional wisdom, but the fact is conventional wisdom is so because it's typically correct. Nutrition is just where it's horribly, horribly wrong. It's totally fine to be skeptical - mild skepticism is healthy. How do you stay skeptical and at the same time be open-minded and not stubborn? If ANYONE can walk that line I'll be very impressed. I don't think it's been done by a mortal.
                        Thank you, Sweetums.
                        Not all us old folks are done experimenting. I'm not. It's just that I have had the time to see so many fads and fashions in nutrition come and go that I can recognize a paradigm shift from a fad. PB/paleo/low(er) carb is a paradigm shift. Peat is a fad.

                        I agree that CW nutrition is mostly hogwash. This is why Peat's ideas strike me as more of the same just in different packaging. He keeps talking about frequent high energy density feedings to keep your metabolism ramped up. This is just CW revisited.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
                          I buy Knox unflavored gelatin. It's right next to the Jello in the grocery store. I think it's around $1.49 for a 3 pack container. I keep them on hand to make ice cream. No smell.

                          I don't believe that. Martin Berkhan has shown pretty definitively that, at least for men, smaller feeding periods and less meals with the same caloric totals provide better results. They consistently have less issues with "stubborn fat" because the longer fasting periods increase the oxidation of alpha-2 receptors, which is the notoriously hard fat to get rid of (bellybutton fat on men and thigh fat on women). In addition, since Ray Peat is all about minimizing stress on the body, I'm not sure how you could support so much eating and stressing the digestive system so much. You are constantly walking around with elevated insulin and blood glucose, never giving yourself time to normalize and never giving your digestive system a break until you're asleep. Humans weren't made to snack all day. We are not cows, we are not grazers.
                          Yep. I make iced tea Knox blocks.

                          Well said. I think it was the guy at Free the Animal that said "eat like a predator, not like prey"

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                            My goodness. No wonder. By all means, eat, anything you want including sweetened OJ and milk. You have no reserves to tap into while IFing so it makes sense that that is not optimal for you.
                            On Paleo/Primal, which included IF and less meals, I was 135lbs, 6% body fat and looked sick and emaciated. Many people asked me if I had cancer. Even adding in "safe starches" for a few months didn't help.

                            No thanks. I will take what I have now over that any day. Like I said, do what works for you.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                              PB/paleo/low(er) carb is a paradigm shift. Peat is a fad.
                              Paleo and low-carb is most definitely a fad. Eating Real Food is real the paradigm shift.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by homunculus View Post
                                I'm really interested in Peats ideas. I was low carb for a few months (not strict as I had a few high carb days, and not intentionally, I just don't like many high carb foods). But now my hair is falling out in clumps, and I stopped menstruating a few months ago. Not really something that should happen when I'm 19. I increased my carbs for the last 2-3 months but nothing changed, and I was healthy before. I guessed this was thyroid related but I didn't want to think it was caused by my change in diet( I really enjoy eating this way) so I want to try some of Peats ideas to fix this.
                                Especially since you say it was only a few months and you were "not strict", I really don't think this can be blamed on lowering your carbs. It, does, however sound like you have some real medical issues and consulting a doctor would be a good thing to do. Chasing off after the next guru who says you can eat sugar, probably not so much.

                                Comment

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