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Why does Danny Roddy recommend sugar to reduce stress/estrogen?

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  • Originally posted by otzi View Post
    Could you give us a sample menu for a day?
    Here's what I ate today to give you an idea of my typical Peat-y day:

    7am -> Coffee(Espresso shot w/ 8oz raw whole milk and 1Tbsp sugar)
    11am (post yoga) -> Chocolate shake (12oz raw whole milk, 2tbsp homemade chocolate syrup, 1/8tsp salt, and 1tbsp gelatin)
    1pm -> 2 hardboiled eggs w/ salt, 1 nectarine, 10oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz 70% dark chocolate
    3:30pm -> "Yummy Earth" Cherry lollipop w/ salt.
    4:30pm -> 30ish cherries, 8oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz raw cheddar cheese.
    8pm -> Grass-fed beef hot dog w/ ketchup(made with sugar), 1 nectarine, 8oz whole raw milk

    Comment


    • Originally posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
      I completely agree with most of that statement. You were one of the first people on MDA to call out the "all about insulin" and "calories don't count" BS that populated this forum since it started. I like Taubes, he has great ideas, he got a lot of people on the right path...but calories are the biggest key to weight loss. I didn't believe this for the longest time due to the insulin-bashing that used to go on here but have since done a big 180.

      I do think we agree on most of this stuff. I just feel you're focusing on the extreme approach - eating cups of sugar and gummy bears. I think that's taking Ray Peat out of context. There is no Peat plan. It's all an amalgamation of research that individuals have tried to translate. Maybe they messed up. Peat acknowledges that white sugar should only be treated as a supplement - he states it's empty calories, so only add it if you "need it". I feel that Peat and Primal can exist simultaneously. A diet of moderately lean red meat, bone broth, lots of fruit and some squashes is pretty darn Primal. I'm not going to start drinking gallons of milk and orange juice because milk makes me break out and I'd rather eat whole oranges. I disagree with that advice.

      The past two dinners were the same: london broil with watermelon and coconut milk pudding (coconut milk + water + gelatin) and 1% cottage cheese. I'm deloading from the gym this week and not eating any starches so I'll see where it takes me. I've been salting my watermelon and lunch salad HEAVILY - probably 3 times more than normal. I typically get cold after I eat, but I feel noticeably warmer already. Not sure if it's the salt, coconut or both?
      See, we are not that far apart. I'm glad you are not planning on taking the advice about glugging sweetened OJ and milk. You are more sensible than that. (And that looked like a delicious and fully Primal dinner for a young active guy like you.) Unfortunately, some people just follow whatever is "hot" at the moment and don't think for themselves. I agree with you that there are probably some people taking things out of context and going Whoopie! we get to eat sugar now because this guy said so and he is a doctor. Fiercehunter has been posting all over the place about how great she feels now that she is drinking Coke and eating ice cream all the time thanks to Peat. That gets a bit over the top. This is what I want to avoid. You and I sniping at each other serves no purpose. Fun as it may be sometimes.

      Nobody has a problem with the meat, bone broth, fruit, and tubers part but the chugging OJ and milk and eating table sugar are central to Peat's statements in his blog. You're right that there is no definitive Peat Plan, but I'm just going by what he writes.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
        I don't think it's an exact math. I don't measure calories. At all.

        700 calories is below starvation level. That seems excessive to me. Why not keep eating until you gain weight slightly, then cut that a little so you are just under? It's weight loss you want right? Or is it 'must lose 100 pounds in 2 months' mode you want to enter?

        The thing that I realised, and I only realised it after being primal for about six months, was that I never knew what it was to be hungry before. I had always eaten like clockwork as a habit. Now I intentionally skip lunches at work (it was just easier than the hassle of bringing something) and since it's 4pm right now, I feel a mild nagging from my stomach that I can easily note as 'hey, hungry' but that doesn't drive all other thoughts from my mind like a low blood sugar hunger would.

        What is your goal? Health? Weight loss? Living a long time? Avoiding diabetes? Some combination of the above?

        For me, the other side of diet is exercise, which I definitely see as a minor component. I don't want to be able to bench press my own body weight. I want to be able to get up off the floor by myself with I'm 70 and I fall over. Or be able to paint the roof of my house when I'm retired. Or go swimming in the sea with my grandkids (when I have any).
        Yeah I didn't intentionally mean to eat that little. I was just never hungry. I was always full after eating. I was pretty surprised at the numbers when I crunched them. I'm afraid to "test", because it's really ...really hard to lose even a pound once I gain it. I don't need record speed weight loss of course, haha. But taking 3 weeks for a pound, if, is rough ...especially when I have about 180 more to lose.

        My goal is weight loss, but I have some other issues (basically every symptom of PCOS except the period thing).

        Is that how you guys did it? You just kinda came up with a number and tested? If you maintained, you created a deficit to lose?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
          Here's what I ate today to give you an idea of my typical Peat-y day:

          7am -> Coffee(Espresso shot w/ 8oz raw whole milk and 1Tbsp sugar)
          11am (post yoga) -> Chocolate shake (12oz raw whole milk, 2tbsp homemade chocolate syrup, 1/8tsp salt, and 1tbsp gelatin)
          1pm -> 2 hardboiled eggs w/ salt, 1 nectarine, 10oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz 70% dark chocolate
          3:30pm -> "Yummy Earth" Cherry lollipop w/ salt.
          4:30pm -> 30ish cherries, 8oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz raw cheddar cheese.
          8pm -> Grass-fed beef hot dog w/ ketchup(made with sugar), 1 nectarine, 8oz whole raw milk
          Are you using the gelatin sold normally in stores, or something like this:: Great Lakes Unflavored Gelatin, Kosher: Grocery & Gourmet Food.

          I have 4 canisters of those, and after using a bit ... I don't think they would work in your recipe, haha. Very stinky, not exactly flavorless.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
            Here's what I ate today to give you an idea of my typical Peat-y day:

            7am -> Coffee(Espresso shot w/ 8oz raw whole milk and 1Tbsp sugar)
            11am (post yoga) -> Chocolate shake (12oz raw whole milk, 2tbsp homemade chocolate syrup, 1/8tsp salt, and 1tbsp gelatin)
            1pm -> 2 hardboiled eggs w/ salt, 1 nectarine, 10oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz 70% dark chocolate
            3:30pm -> "Yummy Earth" Cherry lollipop w/ salt.
            4:30pm -> 30ish cherries, 8oz OJ w/ baking soda, 1oz raw cheddar cheese.
            8pm -> Grass-fed beef hot dog w/ ketchup(made with sugar), 1 nectarine, 8oz whole raw milk
            Hmmm. "Eat six times a day to keep your metabolism up". Seems I've heard that somewhere before.............

            Comment


            • Originally posted by They call me BUTTLOCK View Post
              Are you using the gelatin sold normally in stores, or something like this:: Great Lakes Unflavored Gelatin, Kosher: Grocery & Gourmet Food.

              I have 4 canisters of those, and after using a bit ... I don't think they would work in your recipe, haha. Very stinky, not exactly flavorless.
              Yes, I use Great Lakes. There are 2 kinds. The orange can is regular gelatin, which is used in things like marshmallows and jello (both of which I make on occasion). The green can is hydrolyzed and doesn't gum up. So, you can add it to cold liquid as a protein powder.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                Hmmm. "Eat six times a day to keep your metabolism up". Seems I've heard that somewhere before.............
                It's irrelevant how many times one eats per day. I ate 6 times a day when eating paleo and SAD. I do have days where I only eat 3 times, but most of the time it's 5 or 6. I feel better that way no matter the diet.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by They call me BUTTLOCK View Post
                  My goal is weight loss, but I have some other issues (basically every symptom of PCOS except the period thing).

                  Is that how you guys did it? You just kinda came up with a number and tested? If you maintained, you created a deficit to lose?
                  Sorry, I can't really help with weight loss, since that's not what I'm aiming of or have really achieved. I lost about 5kg of water weight when I first went low carb, and since then have lost about 10kg in a year, which I think is pretty slow. However, I've taken about 15cm off my waist (my current newest belt is too big, boo hoo) and my bodyfat has gone from about 27% to 21%.

                  To all the random pro-salt comments: I have noticed that I now salt my food quite prodigiously (I NEVER used to salt my food pre-primal). What's the science or explanation behind that? Any links to share?
                  Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

                  Griff's cholesterol primer
                  5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
                  Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
                  TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
                  bloodorchid is always right

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
                    Yes, I use Great Lakes. There are 2 kinds. The orange can is regular gelatin, which is used in things like marshmallows and jello (both of which I make on occasion). The green can is hydrolyzed and doesn't gum up. So, you can add it to cold liquid as a protein powder.
                    Oh crap, I knew that and forgot. Ha, thanks.

                    (and thanks to all answering my questions. i appreciate it ... a lot)

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
                      It's irrelevant how many times one eats per day. I ate 6 times a day when eating paleo and SAD. I do have days where I only eat 3 times, but most of the time it's 5 or 6. I feel better that way no matter the diet.
                      The relevance is that, with a fat burning metabolism which one gets by eating on the Primal plan, you don't *need* to eat so often. It is easy to skip the snacks entirely and even skip meals while maintaining stable blood sugar and energy levels.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                        The relevance is that, with a fat burning metabolism which one gets by eating on the Primal plan, you don't *need* to eat so often. It is easy to skip the snacks entirely and even skip meals while maintaining stable blood sugar and energy levels.
                        Didn't work for me and many people I know. And I stuck to it for a long time thinking "Any day now, I will be fat adapted". BS. There's no such thing. Not in today's world at least. Running on fat is stressful. That on top of our modern, stressful life is a recipe for disaster.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
                          To all the random pro-salt comments: I have noticed that I now salt my food quite prodigiously (I NEVER used to salt my food pre-primal). What's the science or explanation behind that? Any links to share?
                          Basically, salt is anti-stress, anti-inflammatory and pro-thyroid. You can check out Peat's article: Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

                          Or read Matt Stone's summary:
                          Ray Peat – Salt – 180 Degree Health

                          And before anyone (PaleoBird, I am looking at you) goes off on Matt Stone, I am not endorsing him. He just did a pretty good series of posts in May 2011 summarizing Peat's ideas

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by bopfer View Post
                            Didn't work for me and many people I know. And I stuck to it for a long time thinking "Any day now, I will be fat adapted". BS. There's no such thing. Not in today's world at least. Running on fat is stressful. That on top of our modern, stressful life is a recipe for disaster.
                            Hmmmm....I used to get shaky, sweaty, nauseous and desperate to eat when I missed a meal before going primal. Now, when I am eating properly I can sometimes easily go 16 hours without even thinking about food. I know which one was more stressful for my body for sure.
                            Using low lectin/nightshade free primal to control autoimmune arthritis. (And lost 50 lbs along the way )

                            http://www.krispin.com/lectin.html

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by jammies View Post
                              Hmmmm....I used to get shaky, sweaty, nauseous and desperate to eat when I missed a meal before going primal. Now, when I am eating properly I can sometimes easily go 16 hours without even thinking about food. I know which one was more stressful for my body for sure.
                              That was on a SAD diet though, right? I would say it's the PUFA+sugar combo that causes those issues (plus possible genetic traits). I can easily go 16 hours(dinner to lunch) if I need to, even on a Peat diet. I have done it several times when needing to fast for a blood draw. But, I am not going to put my body through that stress any more than I have to.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                                The relevance is that, with a fat burning metabolism which one gets by eating on the Primal plan, you don't *need* to eat so often. It is easy to skip the snacks entirely and even skip meals while maintaining stable blood sugar and energy levels.
                                I agree with this. Before primal I used to graze all day - I was constantly eating and always wanted food. Now if I wait for myself to get truly hungry before eating, I'd have to wait around 40 hrs and even then I don't feel like I need to eat.

                                Comment

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