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  • #16
    Originally posted by gopintos View Post
    I am still experimenting. Trying to figure out what works best of me.

    But it is so confusing, all the different advice you hear. It would seem to make sense to keep metab. revved up, and keeping insulin consistent all day, makes sense. But the flip side makes sense also.

    When I started my journey, I thought smaller more frequent was the way to go. And I was losing weight. But I was always hungry. Always thinking about food. And the foods I was eating had my carbs up there, foods I thought I was suppose to eat so I started eating them, like whole grains, steel cut oats, legumes... And again, I was losing 10 lbs a month.

    Then I thought there had to be a better way. I was constantly thinking about food, fixing food, hungry all the time. I researched and discovered primal. I naturally settled into 2 meals a day, maybe an afternoon snack. Way fewer carbs than before, way more fat, about the same protein. Getting full on 900 - 1200 calories per day, a few days of 13 & 1400 thrown in there also, maybe some 15 & 16's, but mostly around 1000 - 1200. It seems like a naturally fit, but weight loss is anywhere from 1 - 5 pounds per month.

    I realize as you get closer to goal, things slow down. But I am not close to goal.

    And then there is the whole Calorie thing. If at the end of the day it is CICO, I don't know why it would matter if you eat them all once a day, or eat 20 times a day.

    I am just typing outloud. Just the thoughts that go through my mind every day as I am trying to figure out what works for me. I thought maybe I should revert back to the smaller more frequent meals as I was losing weight faster. But I was eating more carbs so I was hungrier more often. So this past week, I added in more carbs like fruit (peaches are ripe) and it seems like I have been hungrier, but I have been more physical also, and I have had a steady gain every day this week. Uggghhh. I know, dont trip on the scale. I am hoping it is water as I had a few things I don't normally have. Like a few glasses of sweet tea (which I had completely cut out). I also had a hamburger bun. I also had (2) 4 inch pancakes w/sugar free syrup. I also probably had 2 cups of milk, and 2 bowls of cereal. I just dont eat those things but I did this week. I dont usually do the 20% so I guess I was making up for it this week. I was just hungrier than I have been for a long time. But I was also working outside, physically for 6 - 8 hrs every day. I had to keep coming in to fix the kids something and it was just too easy to grab a peach or scarf down a bowl of cereal before returning outside. However based on calorie intake and expenditure, there is no way it could be fat. Just no way. I tracked it later and was still eating 1500 - 1600 calories.

    I just dont understand how there can be so many theories. I guess because we are all different. I was just reading this week, on a link from a post here, about more carbs and fewer fats to lose weight. Uggh. Perfect Health Diet. The trouble is, it all makes sense when I read it. And then I read something else that makes sense.

    I am just having trouble figuring out what I need to do. I was so close to losing 50 pounds, and now the scale is going the other direction and I know enough to know there are many factors and I do not think it is fat. But I also feel like I am 20 pounds behind where I should have been by now. Just frustrating is all. I know I will get there. I know or feel like what I have lost is a permanent thing. Like everybody else, I just wish I was there already.

    Okay this isnt about me. I just need to babble sometimes.

    edit: I just remembered some other things I did different also. Didnt sleep as well. Didnt take any supplements all week. Didnt drink as much water. And I had two pina coladas the same night I had the bun. I did just now weigh and 2.2lbs lighter than yesterday, so maybe some of the junk I had earlier in the week is finding it's way out. I need to remember all this, especially when I wonder wth is wrong & why it's not working
    OMG you sound so much like me! I am hugely interested in anything health/nutrition and I also have a few hundred theories floating around in my head and agree with you that they really do all make sense! I Have actually just purchased the Perfect Health book and I am eagerly awaiting it's arrival! The conclusion I have had to come to is to find and stay with what works for ME, just ME and only ME. With regards to your hunger levels with the more frequent eating, IMO it may have been the carbs causing the hunger (they also do this to me). You could try having smaller protein based meals. I do eat carbs but find I handle them much better earlier on in the day so eat them for breakfast and maybe lunch. For an example I might eat bacon, eggs and some veggies (including potato) for breakfast then 3 hours later just have some meat on it's own (only about 3 oz or 100g actual weight), then lunch meat/salad/fat and maybe some sweet potato, 3 hours later more protein (meat/egg) and so on....... this way my insulin levels remain stable and I'm not trying to dive into the workplace biscuit jarl! Unfortunately I really need to eat something healthy BEFORE I get hungry as once I am hungry I will eat pretty much anything that isn't nailed to the floor! If I have a healthy snack on hand as in a couple of meatballs or a boiled egg I can eat that and go on my merry way without thinking about food again until meal time. I also lose more weight when eating frequently throughout the day. My digestive system doesn't like big infrequent meals at all........... I have just learnt that whilst I love learning about all the different nutritional advice out there I need to stick with what best suits me and that is why there is so much conflicting information out there as we are all so very different Best of luck in finding what works for you!
    Last edited by TARNIP; 06-23-2012, 05:46 AM.

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    • #17
      I'm also trying to sort out meal size/frequency. Plus capping the total calories. I have a big kefir smoothie every morning which is my main carb boost for the day. Then I usually have meat/cheese/almonds at lunch. Sometimes it's slices of good lunchmeat rolled with pickle slice, lettuce, sliver of cheese. I would also have something again at my 3pm break, maybe sardines or meat. I tried cutting this out, but found I would get really woozy in the afternoons. I didn't feel hungry, just kind of faint and tired.

      So I think for me having that afternoon snack is important, even if I have to adjust portions elsewhere. Dinner is usually meat, veg, avocado, wine.
      Seven Trees Farm - diversified subsistence farming on 1.25 acres.

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      • #18
        Personally, my experience is that what's important is WHAT I eat and HOW MUCH I eat--period. When or how often I eat is irrelevant to weight loss/management as long as a limit amounts and eat primal (and low carb, since I am very carb sensitive).

        There are many days when I have only two meals; other days I may have one meal and several snacks, but some days I will have two meals and a small snack late in the day. The only constant in my life is a high-protein breakfast (usually my main meal).

        I try to avoid eating within 3 hours of bedtime, but there have been days when I've been ravenous (for some unknown reason) and had a snack at bedtime.

        None of these changes in how often I eat has caused any issues that I'm aware of.

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        • #19
          I'm trying to find ways to avoid the junk. I've found myself eating a lot of junk lately, especially with my health issues. It seems as if every time I take 1 step forward, something happens and I fall back by 2 steps. I haven't been allowed to workout or anything for the past 2 weeks and I'm being forced back on the pill for the time being. Hoping to be off it in the next year, but right now, I have no choice but to take it. I'm just frustrated as hell right now. Actually feel like giving up on a lot of things and just say, "I'm supposed to be the fat chick, just deal with it." I've done great with eating 2-3 meals in the past but now, I need something to stop me from having attacks of wanting to eat junk. Plus, I do not want to eat when I get home since I'm typically in bed within an hour of walking in the door.
          Georgette

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          • #20
            Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
            Why would you want to? It's way less convenient than eating 0-3 larger meals, and probably worse for your metabolism in the long-run. Also, is it really that difficult to figure out?
            Some people (with hiatial hernia, reflux/GERD etc.) have to.

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            • #21
              Geo, don't know if it will help or not but sometimes I just have a tablespoon of coconut oil + coconut manna if I feel like I want food before bed. I hear you on the BC pills!

              Tarnip, I totally agree with your approach. Tweaks (I'm not talking major departures from primal basics) that work for one person may not work for another. One person's large meal is another's small one. I seem to do fine with a little whole fat dairy, some need to avoid it entirely. A healthy person building muscle has different requirements than a person recovering from some big systemic insult, etc.

              My personal opinion is that the forum gives an opportunity to find out what works for others, share ideas and get inspired to live well. I don't take anyone's comments as mandates, nor of course are mine meant to be.
              My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57034.html

              "...since our orthodox theories have not saved us we may have to readjust them to bring them into harmony with Nature's laws. Nature must be obeyed, not orthodoxy." Weston A. Price

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              • #22
                Originally posted by geostump View Post
                I'm trying to find ways to avoid the junk. I've found myself eating a lot of junk lately, especially with my health issues. It seems as if every time I take 1 step forward, something happens and I fall back by 2 steps. I haven't been allowed to workout
                I do know you can't give up. I had things this week that I shouldn't have, but I made a conscious decision to have it. We can't always do exercise for whatever reason, but we can make the decision about what we eat. And from what I have read, it is 80% nutrition. So we just have to become our own science experiment and see what works for us. The scale wasn't my friend this week, but I know things are moving around and looking better, so while it didnt move favorably, I know it could not have been fat. After I posted earlier, I remembered that I also didnt IF like I normally do. I ended up eating breakfast some days, and that probably set up my hunger for the entire day. I also didn't CT any this week. And not taking my supplements, well I just think I do better when I take them.

                So I did learn lots this week, and giving up is not an option. You can NOT give up
                65lbs gone and counting!!

                Fat 2 Fit - One Woman's Journey

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                • #23
                  Major health scare this week, still feeling shaky and don't trust my body anymore. It actually had me to the point where I wanted to not go back to work at all after this happened. When it happened, my doctor told me not to workout for about a week so tomorrow I can start back to working out. I sort of feel as if I take one step forward with things and then I fall 2 steps back. I know that losing weight is going to be nearly impossible for me now with going back on the pill. I lost a bunch of weight 6 years ago eating small meals and am thinking about going back to that minus the grains. I finally have found a doctor that is saying that what I am going through isn't normal and wants to talk about taking of the matter.
                  Georgette

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                  • #24
                    The Zone teaches you how to put meals together based on balanced ratios of carbs and proteins. You can add extra fats as needed.

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                    • #25
                      Georgette, sorry to hear you're having such troubles. From one (former) Buckeye to another, let me know if I can help.
                      My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57034.html

                      "...since our orthodox theories have not saved us we may have to readjust them to bring them into harmony with Nature's laws. Nature must be obeyed, not orthodoxy." Weston A. Price

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                      • #26
                        I'd like to come in and say yes i do eat a few smaller meals per day rather than the 3 or even only 2. i feel far too icky full and tired after eating huge meals - even sans grains. i find grazing small amounts per day works better for me. i don't get tired, bloated, sick feeling or get heartburn. i still get my breakfast, lunch, dinner. but much smaller ratios and sizes than i see of people posting in here. two snacks inbetween. i have a small child that eats 3 meals plus 2 snacks per day i find it easier also to prepare food for both of us as she likes eating with me and not on her own. i think everyone can adapt this lifestyle to fit their own needs.

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                        • #27
                          am curious as to how anybody's doctor can "force" them to go on the pill? i realize for some it's not a problem, but is the doc holding a gun to your head? you're dreading doing it and it will only upset any hormonal cues that are already off-kilter anyway.

                          i work weird hours too, in a restaurant. 3 days a week, i am up by 7:30, out the door by 8:15 and not back home until 11-12 midnight. most of those days, i do not get a break, do not sit down. i eat in a few minutes, while standing. the other days are shorter, but not short, by any means. this kind of shift work and interrupted circadian rhythms can accelerate cortisol production, which causes the body to store fat. keep that in mind too and do your best to rest.

                          personally, i come from a background of ed and disordered eating so mostly i just eat twice a day. i can't handle planning or thinking about having to eat 6 times. work days i eat around 11 and then again around 5. that's it. even on off-days, i keep a similar window.

                          do what works for you.
                          As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                          Ernest Hemingway

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                          • #28
                            just as a general reminder: the cw advice to graze and eat lots of small meals came about right when the usda began recommending high-carb diets. it was an absolute necessity to keep insulin in check, or it would dip too low and cause issues. back in the day it was 3 squares, no snacks.
                            As I ate the oysters with their strong taste of the sea and their faint metallic taste that the cold white wine washed away, leaving only the sea taste and the succulent texture, and as I drank their cold liquid from each shell and washed it down with the crisp taste of the wine, I lost the empty feeling and began to be happy and to make plans.

                            Ernest Hemingway

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                            • #29
                              Bump!

                              So i'm looking at eating about 4 times a day tops, due to digestive issues. I've unfortunately got gastroparesis, which basically doesn't allow me to fully thrive on primal. I've done some damage to my metabolism and im rather pissed with myself. It all came about trying heal inflammation and fix my gut, which initially i thought i was doing. I over did the meat and fat though and basically feared carbs due reading diets like gaps and stuff which proclaim carbs feed bad bacteria. It made sense.

                              But, fat and meat digest considerably slower than simple carbs, not what you want with gastroparesis which is a paralyzed stomach and emptys slower.

                              Enough about that, my question is, are there any tradeoffs with eating more regularly during the day? I'm guessing stuff like more insulin spikes, might not be favourable. Is there any official word on the, perhaps, negatives of eating more regularly throughout the day?

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                              • #30
                                The problem is that 6 meals a day is what the "clean eating healthy SAD" eaters do. That is, 6 meals of sugary yogurt, 1/2 whole grain bagel, baggie of fruit, small salad with sugary dressing, 100-calorie pack crackers, that type of food. They don't know this, but they are eating every 2-3 hours because their hunger is actually a symptom of withdrawl from addictive wheat. They just accepted the 2-3 hour interval to satisfy, rationalize, and justify that hunger.

                                In other words, it's not the number of meals that's the problem, it's WHAT you're eating during the meal that makes you need to eat more often. So, as long as you're eating primal stuff, I see nothing wrong with 5-6 half-meals.
                                5'0" female, 45 years old. Started Primal October 31, 2011, at a skinny fat 111.5 lbs. Low weight: 99.5 lb on a fast. Gained back to 115(!) on SAD chocolate, potato chips, and stress. Currently 111.

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