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Is a pwo meal really necessary?

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  • Is a pwo meal really necessary?

    I understand that the theory of post workout carbs is that your muscles are depleted of glycogen (or glucose? I don't yet understand the difference) and when you don't take in carbs after working out your muscles will be eaten to be turned into glycogen. But don't the muscles use the glycogen stored in the liver?

    I would say it doesn't matter when you take in carbs as long as you eat enough overall, correct?
    And why does protein timing matter?
    well then

  • #2
    You're a bit confused, youngling..
    Everything is bad for something - How do you feel today?

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    • #3
      wow, confusion abounds on this one...

      after weight training or anaerobic exercise, both muscle and liver glycogen will be depleted. your muscles will fuel their anaerobic activity with locally stored glycogen, as liver glycogen is primarily for the brain and to stabilize blood sugar, but it's not exclusive. both will be used. as will fat, for the aerobic component.

      the muscle doesn't hold glucose. in fact, your body either burns glucose, or quickly stores it as glycogen. you eat glucose, but it should not hang around in your blood stream for too long, or problems will abound.

      another great reason to take in carbs post-workout (at some point, along with protein - it doesn't have to be as immediate as some people say), is that they bring water into the muscle and volumize the tissue. the volumized tissue can absorb protein and other nutrients much better.

      in short, eat food at some point after you workout.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Gilleh View Post
        You're a bit confused, youngling..
        That's an understatement.

        In very simple terms:
        Glycogen is mostly stored in the muscles and liver. Glucose is sugar that is ingested via carbohydrate and proteins (or created from the breakdown of glycogen). Glucose is converted to glycogen in the liver using insulin. Glycogen is broken down into glucose, in the liver, using glucagon as the catalyst.

        Sometimes the timing thing can be overdone. However, there is a window of opportunity that is better (for lack of a better term) than others for protein synthesis, glucose uptake, efficient glycogen storage, etc. 20 minutes before training and 90 minutes PWO are the optimal window for all of those. Your body will not grow, efficiently, if you do not give it the fuel it needs to rebuild itself.

        Gadsie, I am saying this as someone who has seen others like you, over the past 20 years, sabotage themselves because they over-think shit and try way too fucking hard to do everything at once. You don't have to take my advice, you can ignore it and do it your way and you may or may not succeed. However, having worked with power lifters, olympic lifters and bodybuilders for a long time, I highly doubt you are going to get where you want to be by changing gears every 5 days.

        Eat, lift, sleep, repeat. That's it. You might lose your abs, you might not. But, you have to decide if you want to keep the emaciated look while never building quality muscle mass, or you want to build the mass and then strip down the fat. Your body naturally wants to be lean and have enough muscle mass to survive. To change that (the muscle mass part) you have to trick your body into adapting. AND, it takes a long time. Much longer than your other posts have eluded to how long you think it should take.

        I am not talking about the typical bulk-cut-bulk cycle that a lot of bodybuilders go through. Dude, you gotta eat. I know you are, but give it some time. At least a year. Come back in June of 2013 and report back.
        People too weak to follow their own dreams will always try to discourage others.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by IcarianVX View Post
          That's an understatement.

          In very simple terms:
          Glycogen is mostly stored in the muscles and liver. Glucose is sugar that is ingested via carbohydrate and proteins (or created from the breakdown of glycogen). Glucose is converted to glycogen in the liver using insulin. Glycogen is broken down into glucose, in the liver, using glucagon as the catalyst.

          Sometimes the timing thing can be overdone. However, there is a window of opportunity that is better (for lack of a better term) than others for protein synthesis, glucose uptake, efficient glycogen storage, etc. 20 minutes before training and 90 minutes PWO are the optimal window for all of those. Your body will not grow, efficiently, if you do not give it the fuel it needs to rebuild itself.

          Gadsie, I am saying this as someone who has seen others like you, over the past 20 years, sabotage themselves because they over-think shit and try way too fucking hard to do everything at once. You don't have to take my advice, you can ignore it and do it your way and you may or may not succeed. However, having worked with power lifters, olympic lifters and bodybuilders for a long time, I highly doubt you are going to get where you want to be by changing gears every 5 days.

          Eat, lift, sleep, repeat. That's it. You might lose your abs, you might not. But, you have to decide if you want to keep the emaciated look while never building quality muscle mass, or you want to build the mass and then strip down the fat. Your body naturally wants to be lean and have enough muscle mass to survive. To change that (the muscle mass part) you have to trick your body into adapting. AND, it takes a long time. Much longer than your other posts have eluded to how long you think it should take.

          I am not talking about the typical bulk-cut-bulk cycle that a lot of bodybuilders go through. Dude, you gotta eat. I know you are, but give it some time. At least a year. Come back in June of 2013 and report back.
          +1 on all of this. you can't change things up every couple days. and you can't expect to see results overnight. you might gain 10lbs of lean mass in a year. at your age, if you lift like a monster and eat like a pig, you might put on 20lbs. stop overthinking every single minute little detail of this stuff. you're working against yourself by doing this. and stop listening to every little suggestion that every single person makes. there are a few people on this forum that ACTUALLY know what they are talking about, based on real experience. people who have trained athletes. people who are athletes. there is no magic formula for this stuff. like icarian said, eat, lift, sleep, repeat. that's it.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Gilleh View Post
            You're a bit confused, youngling..
            No shit, that's why I ask
            well then

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            • #7
              Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
              +1 on all of this. you can't change things up every couple days. and you can't expect to see results overnight. you might gain 10lbs of lean mass in a year. at your age, if you lift like a monster and eat like a pig, you might put on 20lbs. stop overthinking every single minute little detail of this stuff. you're working against yourself by doing this. and stop listening to every little suggestion that every single person makes. there are a few people on this forum that ACTUALLY know what they are talking about, based on real experience. people who have trained athletes. people who are athletes. there is no magic formula for this stuff. like icarian said, eat, lift, sleep, repeat. that's it.
              Maybe I'm just interested.. I'm not changing anything, I'm still doing starting strength 3 times a week exactly like 2 months ago when I started
              well then

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Gadsie View Post
                Maybe I'm just interested.. I'm not changing anything, I'm still doing starting strength 3 times a week exactly like 2 months ago when I started
                you're 14. go to school. go to the gym. play sports. hang out with friends. it's the summertime.. why are you even on the internet right now?

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                • #9
                  It's not nessassary to eat after a work-out, but if someone get inbetween me and food after I've been swiming I will kill them then eat the food, and if it's been a few hours in the sea trying to surf I will kill them and then eat them and then eat the food
                  You know all those pictures of Adam and Eve where they have belly button? Think about it..................... take as long as you need........................

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                    you're 14. go to school. go to the gym. play sports. hang out with friends. it's the summertime.. why are you even on the internet right now?
                    That's a goo question, I'm procrastinating my homework and my friends REFUSE to understand that I don't eat crap so I try to only hang out with them at places where food is unavailable otherwise I have to awkwardly refuse food every 10 minutes
                    well then

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Gadsie View Post
                      That's a goo question, I'm procrastinating my homework and my friends REFUSE to understand that I don't eat crap so I try to only hang out with them at places where food is unavailable otherwise I have to awkwardly refuse food every 10 minutes
                      i don't know what to tell you then..get new friends. or do something else besides go to food places. or eat something healthy while you're there. or hell, eat something unhealthy. who cares. it won't ruin your life to eat a couple slices of pizza with your buddies once a week. in the long run, it will be more damaging to be a social outcast then to eat the pizza. live a little. this is what people mean when they tell you to stop overthinking things

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                        i don't know what to tell you then..get new friends. or do something else besides go to food places. or eat something healthy while you're there. or hell, eat something unhealthy. who cares. it won't ruin your life to eat a couple slices of pizza with your buddies once a week. in the long run, it will be more damaging to be a social outcast then to eat the pizza. live a little. this is what people mean when they tell you to stop overthinking things
                        I considered just eating unhealthy sometimes with friends, but then I realized I also want my monthly pint ice cream and I have to eat out twice a month with my parents AND I eat quite some greek yogurt. So also eating unhealthy with my friends would make my "20%" too big.
                        But I have a lot of fun with friends at school and I go to gym with a buddy so I guess that's where I hve to live with
                        well then

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Gadsie View Post
                          I considered just eating unhealthy sometimes with friends, but then I realized I also want my monthly pint ice cream and I have to eat out twice a month with my parents AND I eat quite some greek yogurt. So also eating unhealthy with my friends would make my "20%" too big.
                          But I have a lot of fun with friends at school and I go to gym with a buddy so I guess that's where I hve to live with
                          dude.. i'm trying to be helpful here. but i'm going to be honest with you. you are drastically underweight. like, drastically. when you eat ice cream, does it make you sick? if not, then you should eat a pint of ice cream every day. you're 14. at your age and activity level, you need to eat. greek yogurt (dairy) isn't part of the 20%. does it make you feel crappy when you eat it? if not, then eat it daily. how many meals do you eat in a week? if its 20 meals, then 4 of them can be non-paleo and that would be 20%. if you insist on sticking to 20%, then you get 4 "cheat" meals every week. and i hate using the term "cheat" because paleo isn't a fad diet like atkins or south beach.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by not on the rug View Post
                            dude.. i'm trying to be helpful here. but i'm going to be honest with you. you are drastically underweight. like, drastically. when you eat ice cream, does it make you sick? if not, then you should eat a pint of ice cream every day. you're 14. at your age and activity level, you need to eat. greek yogurt (dairy) isn't part of the 20%. does it make you feel crappy when you eat it? if not, then eat it daily. how many meals do you eat in a week? if its 20 meals, then 4 of them can be non-paleo and that would be 20%. if you insist on sticking to 20%, then you get 4 "cheat" meals every week. and i hate using the term "cheat" because paleo isn't a fad diet like atkins or south beach.
                            okay, but when something is not making you sick it is not automatically healthy. Mcdonalds doesn't make me feel sick. While other healthy things like liver or seaweed make me gag when it's in my mouth.
                            And how do you know I'm underweight? this is not a rhetorical question but an actual question.
                            according to a bmi calculator (which I know is actually not really trustable) I could drop 6 pounds and still be at a "healthy weight". But yes, on the other hand, I could gain 44 pounds and also be at a "healthy weight". But according to bmi calculators, I have been (almost) underweight for my entire life. But always been healthy. Does that mean I should have been eating more my entire life?
                            well then

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Gadsie View Post
                              okay, but when something is not making you sick it is not automatically healthy. Mcdonalds doesn't make me feel sick. While other healthy things like liver or seaweed make me gag when it's in my mouth.
                              And how do you know I'm underweight? this is not a rhetorical question but an actual question.
                              according to a bmi calculator (which I know is actually not really trustable) I could drop 6 pounds and still be at a "healthy weight". But yes, on the other hand, I could gain 44 pounds and also be at a "healthy weight". But according to bmi calculators, I have been (almost) underweight for my entire life. But always been healthy. Does that mean I should have been eating more my entire life?
                              dairy isn't reall unhealthy. i meant this: if you eat greek yogurt, do you feel lousy afterwards? if not, then eat it more. that's not part of the 20%. some people eat yogurt and have bloating, gas, shit their brains out, etc. . thats what i mean

                              again, i'm trying to be helpful. you are 6'1" and 140lbs. you post pictures online. in my opinion, you appear to be underweight. i'm not busting on you, just stating the obvious. you are doing all the right things. you're eating and lifting and growing and gaining weight. you are moving in the right direction, but you still appear to be underweight. and yes, bmi is crap. i am 5'10", 178, with visible abs, but bmi tells me that i'm overweight. my friend, who was a college running back, is 5'9", 215. accodring to bmi, he's obese. he's not. he's jacked.

                              to answer your quesiton, i don't know if you should have been eating more your entire life. i don't konw you and what you used to eat. i konw what you post on the internet. and like i said, you're moving in the right direction, but you need to stop overthinking things.

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