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  • Omega 6:3 ratio

    I started using paleotrack.com to see how I'm doing nutritionally. I am strict paleo, and I also don't eat nuts, seeds, eggs, etc for autoimmune protocal. But my omega ratio isn't where I want it to be. I can balance it with a couple teaspoons a day of fish oil, but I'd like to try to do it with food. Seems that chicken reall throws it off. Do I need to worry so much if my omega 6 is coming from free range chickens and not nuts and oils?
    Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

  • #2
    Also, so far, 63% of my calories are from fat... Thanks to the coconut oil on my salad... Too much?
    Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by GeorgiaPeach View Post
      Also, so far, 63% of my calories are from fat... Thanks to the coconut oil on my salad... Too much?
      No, that's fine. Eat whatever macros you like. Just make sure to get ample protein and you can use whatever macros work best for you.

      Chris Kresser did an excellent series of posts on omega fatty acids. He recommends getting omega-3 from actual fish instead of fish oil in most cases and also goes into how absolute amounts of omega-6 and omega-3 must be considered, not just the ratio:

      The fish vs. fish oil smackdown
      How much omega-3 is enough? That depends on omega-6.
      How too much omega-6 and not enough omega-3 is making us sick

      Sounds like you are doing pretty well. I would not worry too much.

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      • #4
        I just sorted my list by omega 6 content... Turns out most of it is coming from the avocado I ate, not the chicken. I thought those guys were healthy. No? Eat just a bit notnthe whole? Eat 3 and die happy?
        Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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        • #5
          I think if you get a good quality, liquid fish oil to take every day, you don't need to worry about it being technically supplementation. It's still food, it's from a very primal food, and it shouldn't contain additives that could do harm to you. Honestly, if that's the only supplement that you take, you are way ahead of the curve. Way back in caveman times, all of our meat would have been free-range, grass-fed, etc. The higher levels of omega 3 in them were enough then. Nowadays unless you want to eat exclusively fish and grass-fed ruminants (cows, bison, etc.), taking a fish oil supplement really just "makes up" for what is missing from the meat we can get our hands on. As long as you aren't partaking of the high omega 6 foods (and that seems to be the case), you shouldn't have any problem!

          If you feel good at the fat %age that you are currently hitting, no need to change anything.
          Type 1 Diabetic. Controlling blood sugar through primal life.

          2012 Goals:
          Maintain A1c of 6.0 or lower
          More dietary fat, less carbs, moderate protein
          LHT and sprint as per PB fitness
          Play more!

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          • #6
            beyond the ratio, you have to consider the overall amount of PUFA in your diet. if the overall amount is really low, and if you're eating primally, and avoiding the foods that you are, it is, the ratio becomes less and less important.

            skip the fish oil, imho. it's never once been shown to even correlate with any health benefits, as opposed to eating fish.

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            • #7
              I went through this, too. I will parrot what others have been saying around here. Rancid, industrial fried omega-6 oils are not the same thing as natural, fresh chicken fat. The kinds of oil that are killing America are soybean oil, canola oil and other seed oils. Avocados and poultry are real food, it does not make sense to avoid them.
              Crohn's, doing SCD

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              • #8
                I'm curious how you find paleotrack.com compared to other sites such as Fitday and Cron-o-meter. I'm not a very happy user of the free version of Cron-o-meter: too hard to enter own recipes and too little cooked food nutrition info (vs. raw ingredients). Does Fitday and Paleotrack.com allow you to track Omega 6 vs. Omega 3? Reliably?

                Originally posted by GeorgiaPeach View Post
                I started using paleotrack.com to see how I'm doing nutritionally.

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                • #9
                  I just want to do it perfectly ya know?
                  Last edited by GeorgiaPeach; 05-30-2012, 11:38 AM.
                  Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by choppedliver View Post
                    I'm curious how you find paleotrack.com compared to other sites such as Fitday and Cron-o-meter. I'm not a very happy user of the free version of Cron-o-meter: too hard to enter own recipes and too little cooked food nutrition info (vs. raw ingredients). Does Fitday and Paleotrack.com allow you to track Omega 6 vs. Omega 3? Reliably?
                    I haven't used paleotracker.com long, and I haven't used the other sites. But it does let you enter custom foods.
                    Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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                    • #11
                      Avocadoes are a "PUFA bomb" according to Ray Peat and he seems to advise avoiding them. What's the n-6/n-3 balance in avocadoes? I didn't realize it was lopsided in favor of n-6. My take is that all naturally-occurring n-6 PUFA (avocadoes, wild-caught fish, pastured chicken, pasture-bred pork) can't be that bad; it's the n-6 PUFA in processed foods that are egregious (e.g., bread, dairy, processed flour products). I think the focus on n-6/n-3 imbalance is being second-guessed unduly when all you're eating is fish, chicken, pork, and unroasted/unsalted nuts. This is dramatically different than eating flour-based products, ice cream, and other SAD staples. In the latter case, you may need fish oil supplementation; in the former, I tend not to think so.

                      There seems to be more widsom in ancestral eating habits than in taking modern science literally. Sure, once digested, these items all dissolve into common denominators we refer to as n-3/n-6 PUFA. Supposedly the double carbon bonds make them unstable. But really, is that all there is to it?

                      Where are all those that ate non-fatty fish, pork, birds, avocadoes, nuts, etc. that fell easy victim to cardiovascular disease or cancer? A 10:1 imbalance may not be all that unhealthy if that imbalance is coming from such items, than when you're eating n-6 PUFA from gluten grain-based and vegetable oil products.

                      Originally posted by GeorgiaPeach View Post
                      I just sorted my list by omega 6 content... Turns out most of it is coming from the avocado I ate, not the chicken. I thought those guys were healthy. No? Eat just a bit notnthe whole? Eat 3 and die happy?
                      Last edited by choppedliver; 05-30-2012, 11:45 AM.

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                      • #12
                        So I can ditch the fish oils all together?
                        Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by apple View Post
                          I think if you get a good quality, liquid fish oil to take every day, you don't need to worry about it being technically supplementation. It's still food, it's from a very primal food, and it shouldn't contain additives that could do harm to you. Honestly, if that's the only supplement that you take, you are way ahead of the curve. Way back in caveman times, all of our meat would have been free-range, grass-fed, etc. The higher levels of omega 3 in them were enough then. Nowadays unless you want to eat exclusively fish and grass-fed ruminants (cows, bison, etc.), taking a fish oil supplement really just "makes up" for what is missing from the meat we can get our hands on. As long as you aren't partaking of the high omega 6 foods (and that seems to be the case), you shouldn't have any problem!

                          If you feel good at the fat %age that you are currently hitting, no need to change anything.
                          I eat almost exclusively local grass fed meats and wild caught fish, although I don't eat as much fish as I should, maybe only twice a month.

                          Would it be your opinion that I don't need an Omega 3 fish oil supplement?

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                          • #14
                            Real omega 3 is always better than taking it in supplement form.

                            Primal is about eating real foods.
                            F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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                            • #15
                              Paleotrack.com has carrots having more o6 than chicken breast. Is that right? I'm simply talking tenths of a gram here, but still. Coconut oil... Is that considered high in o6? I'm obsessing over nothingit seems, but I do find it interesting comparing them all.
                              Don't let anybody tell you, "You can't" just because they can't.

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