Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Please help, I need advice

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
    Haha I can't kick and punch people; it just feels wrong.
    My mum keeps saying I'm anorexic too but I think she thinks I'm just on a diet. I don't think she understands the feelings behind it.
    Thanks, hopefully I'll be able to change my mindset after exams when I'm a bit less stressed.
    Ribbons, she won't understand until you tell her. If you want her to understand, you need to TELL HER! She can't help you until she understands your thought process, because your current thinking is that of a person with disordered thinking. She won't understand because she hasn't had to go through this life hurdle.

    Excerpt: Anorexia nervosa can be a difficult disorder to diagnose, since individuals with anorexia often attempt to hide the disorder. Denial and secrecy frequently accompany other symptoms. It is unusual for an individual with anorexia to seek professional help because the individual typically does not accept that she or he has a problem (denial).

    Does this sound familiar? Ribbons, you need to get professional help. You won't be able to just change your mindset. This is a psychological disorder that needs to be addressed by a professional. Please make sure you go to the Dr.! You are doing the right thing by speaking to your parents and going to see a Dr. I know it's hard to see it now, but it's the only way to get on the road to recovery and to start enjoying your life again. I know you aren't enjoying your life as much right now because you are being consumed day in and day out by your disorder. I've been there. Life will be better once you accept that you have an eating disorder and that you get professional help for it.
    Last edited by Metric; 06-06-2012, 06:06 AM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Metric View Post
      Ribbons, she won't understand until you tell her. If you want her to understand, you need to TELL HER! She can't help you until she understands your thought process, because your current thinking is that of a person with disordered thinking. She won't understand because she hasn't had to go through this life hurdle.
      I tried to explain but she didn't understand so I'll just have to accept that.

      Excerpt: Anorexia nervosa can be a difficult disorder to diagnose, since individuals with anorexia often attempt to hide the disorder. Denial and secrecy frequently accompany other symptoms. It is unusual for an individual with anorexia to seek professional help because the individual typically does not accept that she or he has a problem (denial).


      Does this sound familiar? Ribbons, you need to get professional help. You won't be able to just change your mindset. This is a psychological disorder that needs to be addressed by a professional. Please make sure you go to the Dr.! You are doing the right thing by speaking to your parents and going to see a Dr. I know it's hard to see it now, but it's the only way to get on the road to recovery and to start enjoying your life again. I know you aren't enjoying your life as much right now because you are being consumed day in and day out by your disorder. I've been there. Life will be better once you accept that you have an eating disorder and that you get professional help for it.
      I don't remember what I used to think about, or do in my spare time, or talk about before this. I just realised how empty my life would be without the disorder.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
        I tried to explain but she didn't understand so I'll just have to accept that.
        Best thing is to keep telling her. Some people can be very stubborn but usually they all learn, even mothers. Learning is all about repetition.
        I don't remember what I used to think about, or do in my spare time, or talk about before this. I just realised how empty my life would be without the disorder.
        Yeah, that was why people asked about hobbies etc. You definitely need to find some sort of hobby that doesn't involve sitting about worrying about calories and planning diets. It might feel wrong to you to kick and punch people, but it is nothing compared to starving and cutting yourself, and martial arts are great fun! Any hobby will do though, especially if it is outdoors.

        Comment


        • Nicely done! So glad you talked to your parents. Now take them up on the offer of seeing a doctor. Tell them you are afraid of being weighed and it's possible they'll let you skip that at first. Although as you enter treatment they will want to monitor your progress.

          Keep us updated on your progress.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
            Haha I can't kick and punch people; it just feels wrong.
            My mum keeps saying I'm anorexic too but I think she thinks I'm just on a diet. I don't think she understands the feelings behind it.
            Thanks, hopefully I'll be able to change my mindset after exams when I'm a bit less stressed.
            You don't have to kick and punch people. Martial arts isn't just about fighting, it's about discipline and fitness. Did you know tai chi chuan is a martial art? There is no punching and kicking of opponents there, although there is a two person aspect to it called push hands where you maintain contact with a partner, but that's usually taught to more advanced students. There are many moves in tai chi that are the same as kung fu, but are done in a slow motion rather than fast.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by billp View Post
              Best thing is to keep telling her. Some people can be very stubborn but usually they all learn, even mothers. Learning is all about repetition.
              - be blunt about how you feel, no beating around the bush!! Tell her exactly what you are thinking. You won't be able to get all the help you need if you are not 100 % honest. Again, I really regret not telling my parents about my impulse control disorder while I was suffering from it. It would have given me someone to go to, in addition to my psychiatrist visits.

              Yeah, that was why people asked about hobbies etc. You definitely need to find some sort of hobby that doesn't involve sitting about worrying about calories and planning diets.
              - The Dr will help in this regard. The will help you to move beyond your disordered thinking about health and it's over-consumption of your life. This is a very important step in the process to recovery. I agree, find something you enjoy doing, and when you find yourself thinking about it, do your hobby. The Dr and I figured out that puzzles and cross-word puzzles) were a thing to do when the impulse came, because it allowed me to focus on something else, rather than the impulse to pull. Find something. One of my favourite hobbies now is photography. I go out and I take photo's of nature/city, etc. It doesn't have to be an expensive camera. It's just something to get you out there when you need it.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by billp View Post
                Best thing is to keep telling her. Some people can be very stubborn but usually they all learn, even mothers. Learning is all about repetition.


                Yeah, that was why people asked about hobbies etc. You definitely need to find some sort of hobby that doesn't involve sitting about worrying about calories and planning diets. It might feel wrong to you to kick and punch people, but it is nothing compared to starving and cutting yourself, and martial arts are great fun! Any hobby will do though, especially if it is outdoors.
                Originally posted by Lynna View Post
                You don't have to kick and punch people. Martial arts isn't just about fighting, it's about discipline and fitness. Did you know tai chi chuan is a martial art? There is no punching and kicking of opponents there, although there is a two person aspect to it called push hands where you maintain contact with a partner, but that's usually taught to more advanced students. There are many moves in tai chi that are the same as kung fu, but are done in a slow motion rather than fast.
                Well I'll find some sort of hobby when exams are over. I was also thinking of doing aikido..
                Originally posted by teach2183 View Post
                Nicely done! So glad you talked to your parents. Now take them up on the offer of seeing a doctor. Tell them you are afraid of being weighed and it's possible they'll let you skip that at first. Although as you enter treatment they will want to monitor your progress.

                Keep us updated on your progress.
                Thanks, I will.
                Originally posted by Metric View Post
                - be blunt about how you feel, no beating around the bush!! Tell her exactly what you are thinking. You won't be able to get all the help you need if you are not 100 % honest. Again, I really regret not telling my parents about my impulse control disorder while I was suffering from it. It would have given me someone to go to, in addition to my psychiatrist visits.


                - The Dr will help in this regard. The will help you to move beyond your disordered thinking about health and it's over-consumption of your life. This is a very important step in the process to recovery. I agree, find something you enjoy doing, and when you find yourself thinking about it, do your hobby. The Dr and I figured out that puzzles and cross-word puzzles) were a thing to do when the impulse came, because it allowed me to focus on something else, rather than the impulse to pull. Find something. One of my favourite hobbies now is photography. I go out and I take photo's of nature/city, etc. It doesn't have to be an expensive camera. It's just something to get you out there when you need it.
                I don't think it's necessary to tell my parents everything. They'll get worried if they know I sometimes cut myself and get very anxious but it's fine because I'm not always like that and I'm not considering suicide for anytime soon. I will find a hobby but I'm still a bit worried that I'll stop caring about losing weight.

                Also I still have an online counselling appointment for next Monday.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
                  I just realised how empty my life would be without the disorder.



                  This is the most amazing thing you've written in the entire thread!!!
                  Do you think you can say that to the doctor? Even if you have to be alone with the doctor without your mom? May I ask how long you've wanted to lose those rolls of fat? (the doc may ask you this too, so you should probably have an answer) Yes, the doctor has to weigh you, they all do that. But ask the doctor if you're healthy. Is there good muscle on your shoulders? Is your heart beating like it should? Are you strong? That sort of thing.

                  I have to disagree with billp on the number of calories. 900 calories is not enough, true. But I don't think you'll starve on it, not yet, and it's certainly better than what you're doing now. The reason I asked about 900 is that I think it would help you if you had a constant number of calories a day, even if it's low. You're yo-yo-ing between 0 and 2000 and it's confusing the hell out of your body. Get used to eating a little and you can worry about ramping up later. IMO, it's more important that you don't freak out and have the bad thoughts that you had the other night.

                  [To be honest, I'm not sure about 2000 . On a normal (wheat) diet, I lived on 1200 a day. On Primal I think I'm closer to 1500, but I don't keep track. At your height you need a little more, but 2000 might be a wee bit too much, especially now.]


                  Are you trying primal? Have you been through carb flu or anything like that yet?
                  900 Primal calories will likely fill you up, until you get used to it.

                  What do you usually eat on a 2000 calorie day, the days that freak you out?
                  5'0" female, 45 years old. Started Primal October 31, 2011, at a skinny fat 111.5 lbs. Low weight: 99.5 lb on a fast. Gained back to 115(!) on SAD chocolate, potato chips, and stress. Currently 111.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by oxide View Post




                    This is the most amazing thing you've written in the entire thread!!!
                    Do you think you can say that to the doctor? Even if you have to be alone with the doctor without your mom? May I ask how long you've wanted to lose those rolls of fat? (the doc may ask you this too, so you should probably have an answer) Yes, the doctor has to weigh you, they all do that. But ask the doctor if you're healthy. Is there good muscle on your shoulders? Is your heart beating like it should? Are you strong? That sort of thing.
                    Haha thanks. Hmm, I've wanted to lose weight since I was a kid. I've had this book that has the calorie and fat content of food since I was about 11 or 12 and I used that to make diet plans. But I also recently found a diary I wrote in when I was like 10 and I'd written down my weight and my goals and I recorded my food in there for a while and rated each day based on how many calories I'd had. I don't even remember doing it.
                    Btw I don't think I'm unhealthy, just fat. My heart seems to be working fine and I still have muscles, even though they're probably a little less strong than they used to be when I did gym.

                    I have to disagree with billp on the number of calories. 900 calories is not enough, true. But I don't think you'll starve on it, not yet, and it's certainly better than what you're doing now. The reason I asked about 900 is that I think it would help you if you had a constant number of calories a day, even if it's low. You're yo-yo-ing between 0 and 2000 and it's confusing the hell out of your body. Get used to eating a little and you can worry about ramping up later. IMO, it's more important that you don't freak out and have the bad thoughts that you had the other night.

                    [To be honest, I'm not sure about 2000 . On a normal (wheat) diet, I lived on 1200 a day. On Primal I think I'm closer to 1500, but I don't keep track. At your height you need a little more, but 2000 might be a wee bit too much, especially now.]
                    I know that 2000 is too much and I'm not aiming to eat that many calories, it just happens when I binge. I know that on CW I can lose around 0.5-1kg a week on 1200 calories. Actually that's on food less healthy than CW. I was eating a lot of sugar and even more carbs than CW recommends back then (this was nearly 2 years ago).

                    Are you trying primal? Have you been through carb flu or anything like that yet?
                    Yeah I'm doing primal now. I don't really know if I've been through the carb flu or not because any symptoms that I have could also be due to eating less calories.

                    What do you usually eat on a 2000 calorie day, the days that freak you out?
                    It varies but the most recent one (2 days ago) I ate too many nuts like I knew I would and I also had some meat, veggies, fruit, and dark chocolate, so it wasn't a particularly unhealthy binge but it was still pretty bad.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by oxide View Post
                      I have to disagree with billp on the number of calories. 900 calories is not enough, true. But I don't think you'll starve on it, not yet, and it's certainly better than what you're doing now. The reason I asked about 900 is that I think it would help you if you had a constant number of calories a day, even if it's low. You're yo-yo-ing between 0 and 2000 and it's confusing the hell out of your body. Get used to eating a little and you can worry about ramping up later. IMO, it's more important that you don't freak out and have the bad thoughts that you had the other night.
                      The reason why I recommend she ate at least 2000 cals a day was so she would eat too much and not too little. 900 calories is starvation territory, and it is making her crazy. She may have times when she feels fine, but there are other times when she really does not. Recommending she carry on doing something that is making her crazy is pandering to her condition and a very bad idea.

                      Ribbons, I honestly don' t know how much you should eat, and no one does. Once things are working better for you will be able to tell how much to eat based on whether you are full or not. But at the moment you are actually starving. It will take some time - two weeks to several months - to get out of that state, and that means eating lots during that time. Of course you will put on weight, not least because after the shock you have given you body is it going to have an awful lot of rebuilding to do, and will want to conserve fat and build muscle. That's fine though. Once you are metabolically normal you will find your weight levels off, and that by carefully nourishing yourself you naturally slim down in the right places without compromising your health. That is what heaps of women on this forum has been doing, and it works very well. But the only way to do it is to eat an unlimited calorie diet high in essential nutrients - meat, fish, fats, veg.

                      You cannot go from where you are now, starving, to naturally slimming down while well nourished. You most definitely need a period of substantial calorific surplus. Go with it. Paleo style eating makes is really easy to lose surplus fat later on, once you are on an even keel again. A the moment you long term mental health is much more important that your weight.

                      900 calories a day will still kill you. It is still anorexic. You still need to go to the doctors, and before your exams. If you leave it until after your exams you will be in worse mental shape and will have sustained more damage, and the doctor won't be able to get such a clear picture of what's wrong because a key contributing factor will be missing.
                      [To be honest, I'm not sure about 2000 . On a normal (wheat) diet, I lived on 1200 a day. On Primal I think I'm closer to 1500, but I don't keep track. At your height you need a little more, but 2000 might be a wee bit too much, especially now.]
                      Oxide - are you a man or a woman? Your profile picture seems to be of a bearded man. Am I mistaken? Given Ribbons starved state I am sure she will need more like 2000 cals per day to recover, or more. Besides, a primal calorie seems to be significantly smaller than a CW calorie.
                      Last edited by billp; 06-07-2012, 02:41 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by billp View Post
                        The reason why I recommend she ate at least 2000 cals a day was so she would eat too much and not too little. 900 calories is starvation territory, and it is making her crazy. She may have times when she feels fine, but there are other times when she really does not. Recommending she carry on doing something that is making her crazy is pandering to her condition and a very bad idea.

                        Ribbons, I honestly don' t know how much you should eat, and no one does. Once things are working better for you will be able to tell how much to eat based on whether you are full or not. But at the moment you are actually starving. It will take some time - two weeks to several months - to get out of that state, and that means eating lots during that time. Of course you will put on weight, not least because after the shock you have given you body is it going to have an awful lot of rebuilding to do, and will want to conserve fat and build muscle. That's fine though. Once you are metabolically normal you will find your weight levels off, and that by carefully nourishing yourself you naturally slim down in the right places without compromising your health. That is what heaps of women on this forum has been doing, and it works very well. But the only way to do it is to eat an unlimited calorie diet high in essential nutrients - meat, fish, fats, veg.

                        You cannot go from where you are now, starving, to naturally slimming down while well nourished. You most definitely need a period of substantial calorific surplus. Go with it. Paleo style eating makes is really easy to lose surplus fat later on, once you are on an even keel again. A the moment you long term mental health is much more important that your weight.

                        900 calories a day will still kill you. It is still anorexic. You still need to go to the doctors, and before your exams. If you leave it until after your exams you will be in worse mental shape and will have sustained more damage, and the doctor won't be able to get such a clear picture of what's wrong because a key contributing factor will be missing.
                        I really suck at this. I ate pizza tonight. I tried to purge but I couldn't do it and now the only thing that's stopping me from continuing to panic is the thought of fasting tomorrow. I don't even know how many calories I had today. I can't just go straight up to 2000 (unless I'm binging), it's too much for while I'm trying to lose weight. And I need to detoxify my body now that I've had pizza, so I'll eat as little as I can for the next couple of days and then 900-1200 next week because of exams.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
                          Btw I don't think I'm unhealthy, just fat. My heart seems to be working fine and I still have muscles, even though they're probably a little less strong than they used to be when I did gym.
                          You would want a real medical opinion on that, not your own. Remember Anoriexia is a mental illness, and if you could rely on self-judgements like that you wouldn't be ill.
                          I know that 2000 is too much and I'm not aiming to eat that many calories, it just happens when I binge. I know that on CW I can lose around 0.5-1kg a week on 1200 calories. Actually that's on food less healthy than CW. I was eating a lot of sugar and even more carbs than CW recommends back then (this was nearly 2 years ago).
                          Did you know that is is normal to binge? I do purposefully, now and again. And of course when I do it is carb and sugar heavy. One of the features of this forum is that almost everyone is utterly unfamiliar with one of the key gurus of our age, Nassim Taleb. Because of the industry I work in, for me he is a household name, I follow him in Facebook and I work will people who have lunch with him. He is actually a significantly more important guru than Mark Sisson, Gary Taubs, Jack Kruse etc.

                          One of his major contributions is understanding that polynomial functions and power laws don't just apply in financial markets, they apply everywhere. Including to diet. He explains it here, a chapter taken from his Black Swan book: http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/whyIwalk.pdf

                          It is human nature to go to extremes. You see this in building - lots of low rise, a few skyscrapers. The skyscraper is like the binge, or occasional flood of the desert. Binging is when you are at your healthiest - hitting the peaks of human possibility. It is the same with weightlifting - you can train all you like, but it is the occasional mad victory with a dead lift heavier than yourself that does you the good.

                          I live in Frankfurt, a city that was basically bombed and burnt flat by 1945. BY the very early fifties they were building skyscrapers - that is like a building binge after a period of destructive famine/anorexia beforehand. It is totally normal and a sign that things are getting better. It is not something to feel guilty about.

                          Nassim Taleb's key idea is that the steady state - eating so many calories a day, financial markets have a steady value, buildings being two stories, jogging 5km on a treadmill, whatever - the steady state is not a stable or robust state - it is a fragile state. You see this with heart rates - a steady rate heart beat is an indicator that someone is dying of heart failure. Great variety is how things are supposed to be. You eating a fixed amount every day, even worse knowing how much and its calorific value, is a steady state and therefore fragile. Binging is not - it is fine. You thinking you can have a steady calorific deficit is steady-state dynamics, and is exactly how you ended up anorexic, as you are doing something your body is not designed to do. You need to feast. It is healthy. (It is why the major religions all have so many feast days, in fact.) What you need to be careful about, once you have recovered, is fasting. You will probably never be able to safely fast, as it has already tipped you into illness and is likely to again. Feasting is fine though. You can do it more.
                          Yeah I'm doing primal now. I don't really know if I've been through the carb flu or not because any symptoms that I have could also be due to eating less calories.
                          You aren't 'doing' primal if you are restricting calories. You are still anorexic. You still need to spend a good period eating much more (probably several weeks) and you still need to see a doctor urgently. You, of course, will never go through what they call carb flu. You have been metabolising your own muscles an fat for quite a while. That state passed a long time ago.

                          It varies but the most recent one (2 days ago) I ate too many nuts like I knew I would and I also had some meat, veggies, fruit, and dark chocolate, so it wasn't a particularly unhealthy binge but it was still pretty bad.
                          Like I said above, binging is good. It is probably binging that is keeping you alive. It is the bits between where you have a problem, as you aren't eating enough normally.

                          Comment


                          • I don't understand why binging would be a good thing while I'm still fat though... It just makes me gain weight and never want to eat again.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
                              I really suck at this. I ate pizza tonight. I tried to purge but I couldn't do it and now the only thing that's stopping me from continuing to panic is the thought of fasting tomorrow. I don't even know how many calories I had today. I can't just go straight up to 2000 (unless I'm binging), it's too much for while I'm trying to lose weight. And I need to detoxify my body now that I've had pizza, so I'll eat as little as I can for the next couple of days and then 900-1200 next week because of exams.
                              You can eat pizza if you want to. You are highly unlikely to be allergic to gluten. I eat pizza sometimes, and I am not anorexic and probably at least double your weight. You priority is getting food, not what kind of food. You will find Paleo style foods more nourishing in the long run, but currently it doesn't really matter what you eat as long as you do eat. Pizza is not poisonous and does not contain toxins.

                              Like I said above, it is ok to binge. Normal and healthy. And you totally could go up to 2000 calories a day if you started cooking things in beef tallow, or started eating beef suet, like I recommended pages ago

                              You are not going to be able to safely lose weight until you have nourished yourself again. And even the you probably won't lose weight - you will convert excess fat around the tummy and hips into muscle so it looks like you lost weight and you find yourself with a smaller clothing size, even though the scales are stable or even a bit up. Muscle is much denser than fat.

                              If you eat 900-1200 calories a days next week you seriously risk hospitalisation. You are already starving. You can't carry on doing it from a starved state. Things will get much worse. You will end up strapped to a bed with a tube in your stomach.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Ribbons View Post
                                I don't understand why binging would be a good thing while I'm still fat though... It just makes me gain weight and never want to eat again.
                                Read the Nassim Taleb article I linked to. Extremes are normal for human beings. Without extremes we get problems and become fragile. If you want to convert excess fat (assuming you have any!) into muscle, binging will help you. What is not helping you is systematically failing to eat enough.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X