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  • Communicating with Non-PBers About Fat?

    I've been eating low-carb Paleo for about 18 months so far, but I forget how I conquered my fear of saturated fat. As a result, I feel like I don't converse well with those who are still stuck with the fat-phobic fat-causes-you-to-get-fat mindset. In the past, I've lectured at great length about Ancel Keys, the role of insulin, etc... but time is usually a constraint and it's a lot of information overload on them in one short conversation. Are there good questions, quotes, or other replies that you've used to effectively communicate, or at least get a non-PBer (say, a co-worker) to reconsider whether fat alone causes one to become fat? Or, alternatively, is this even a worthwhile conversation to engage in? For instance, I know that if I just hand them some science journal article to back my point up, it probably won't persuade them overnight to abandon something they've been raised to believe since elementary school.

    Appreciate any thoughts. Thanks!
    In Sanity,
    Charlie

    Weight: 350/200 (within 16 months)/205
    Body Fat: 50%/12%/10%

    A Day in the Life of Groktimus Prime

  • #2
    I have had great luck with "there is so much research out there that you can find something to support whatever diet you want!" People seem hesitant to listen to anything that goes so much against their upbringing or the so called conventional wisdom, that I figure it'll take results for them to listen anyhow. I'm down 18 pounds in two months though. People are starting to give some creedance to it now!

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    • #3
      The best conversations I've had center around not demonizing a particular macronutrient. It took some work with a few friends to make them realize how HFCS works and why excessive fructose intake is essentially a toxically high fat diet attack on one's liver. The general consensus among the masses is that HFCS isn't that bad because it's roughly 50% fructose and 50% glucose. Once people become educated about the affects of the sheer amount of HFCS in everything they eat and what it does, it's usually eye opening. Even if it was only 5% Fructose, it wouldn't matter if one is consuming more than the liver can handle. Glucose and Fructose are not the same. Likewise, glucose is an important carbohydrate and if someone is a healthy weight/BF% and active, they need to be consuming more Glucose from clean sources than some of us fatties that are trying to burn off excessive fat.

      The same goes for the fat camp. Hell, there are plenty of proteins with incomplete AA chains that will make people sick as hell if that's all they consume. You can rarely get someone to see things your way if you end up just telling them that they're wrong and your right. In a sense, they are right because consuming fatty processed foods IS bad, just as bad as consuming fatty sugary foods in my opinion. What makes Paleo so different in my experiences with people is that I've found it hard for someone to argue with the fact that 95% of what I consume is clean and home cooked. I'm semi-snobbish about it, mainly because I like standing on a soapbox from time to time.

      The second people that live this lifestyle start demonizing what others do or start becoming preachy about it is the day that those of us living the life are going to start losing people to it. We'll all be viewed as fanatical morons. What I tell people is that it's not that I necessarily set out to eat a "high fat" diet, it's that it's a natural byproduct of eating clean and consuming vegetables, a little fruit, protein and avoiding grains. It makes it easier for me to convey my "why's" because I'm gluten sensitive. It's easier for me to explain why grains (not carbohydrates) are detrimental to health than why "Fat = Good" in broad terms, because the reality is that not all fat is good.

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      • #4
        Don't. There really is no reason to preach to other people. If they have questions, point them to Mark's site. Self discovery is best for people.
        I Kettlebell therefore I am.

        My Journal
        My Journal

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        • #5
          I think the best conversation starter is a very fit body eating an overwhelmingly enticing primal meal! Teach by example....eventually people will be interested enough to listen.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by tumbleweed View Post
            I think the best conversation starter is a very fit body eating an overwhelmingly enticing primal meal! Teach by example....eventually people will be interested enough to listen.
            Your biggest problem then becomes that, once you're fit, fat people who don't know your history won't listen to anything you have to say about diet. They figure you can't possibly know what you're talking about because you're "lucky to be thin". They also don't listen to you when you're fat, though, because how can you possibly know what you're talking about when you're still fat?

            I have concluded, people just don't want to listen. Oh, or they're happy to listen until the point where they hear they have to give up grains. LOL
            5'6" Female, 29 Years Old, 260/195/120

            "Discipline is choosing between what you want NOW, and what you want MOST!"

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Groktimus Prime View Post
              I've been eating low-carb Paleo for about 18 months so far, but I forget how I conquered my fear of saturated fat. As a result, I feel like I don't converse well with those who are still stuck with the fat-phobic fat-causes-you-to-get-fat mindset. In the past, I've lectured at great length about Ancel Keys, the role of insulin, etc... but time is usually a constraint and it's a lot of information overload on them in one short conversation. Are there good questions, quotes, or other replies that you've used to effectively communicate, or at least get a non-PBer (say, a co-worker) to reconsider whether fat alone causes one to become fat? Or, alternatively, is this even a worthwhile conversation to engage in? For instance, I know that if I just hand them some science journal article to back my point up, it probably won't persuade them overnight to abandon something they've been raised to believe since elementary school.

              Appreciate any thoughts. Thanks!
              When people at work are trying to convince me it's okay to eat honey and apples and whatever, they use the following B.S. line: "but it's natural sugar"

              So I'm thinking we should steal their tactic and start saying "but it's natural fat." And just leave it. If they want to ask why that's better/okay, you have the information to back it up.
              The Champagne of Beards

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              • #8
                When I mention how much I love fat, I try to keep it in their perspective. The bulk of my friends recognize that coconut and avocado are healthy fats. Once I start going on about bacon, their eyes glaze over.
                --Trish (Bork)
                TROPICAL TRADITIONS REFERRAL # 7625207
                http://pregnantdiabetic.blogspot.com
                FOOD PORN BLOG! http://theprimaljunkfoodie.blogspot.com

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by TorMag View Post
                  Don't. There really is no reason to preach to other people. If they have questions, point them to Mark's site. Self discovery is best for people.
                  I agree - unless they are already receptive - like the guy I converted on Thursday (there's a thread) - beating your head on a brick wall is likely to be more constructive.
                  Odille
                  F 58 / 170cms / SW 131.5 kgs / Current 112.4/ GW 65
                  following Primal Lifestyle and swimming my way to health

                  My Primal Blog / Photo Blog / RedBubble shop / My Calendars / My Facebook

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by GrokON View Post

                    I have concluded, people just don't want to listen. Oh, or they're happy to listen until the point where they hear they have to give up grains. LOL
                    Yep, that's been my experience. GIVE UP GRAINS?!?! But they're BIBLICAL! Um. Is there an answer for that besides the bread isn't the same now as then?
                    Best--
                    Kate

                    Still Craving Pterodactyl--my Primal Blueprint blog

                    70 is the new 50--without the hot flashes!

                    Goals: Feel good, be stronger, and hopefully kick that arthritis in the backside! Oh, yeah, and losing more weight would be okay, too.

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                    • #11
                      The masses like key words.

                      Don't say "fat", because that conjures up negative images. Say "healthy fats", which some people have heard before, and that will make them slowly differentiate between "pizza, hamburgers, etc" and "steaks, fish, etc".

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by GrokON View Post
                        Your biggest problem then becomes that, once you're fit, fat people who don't know your history won't listen to anything you have to say about diet. They figure you can't possibly know what you're talking about because you're "lucky to be thin". They also don't listen to you when you're fat, though, because how can you possibly know what you're talking about when you're still fat?...
                        I've actually experienced what it's like to go from morbidly obese to lean and thin, but I know what you're talking about. I've had obese people lecture me on different aspects of nutrition, and in my mind, I'm thinking "either your advice is wrong or you don't really believe what you preach, or both." On the other hand, people who have been naturally thin all their lives have a different perspective than me on the necessity of carbs that should be part of one's diet. In this case, I would caution that what has worked well for a naturally thin person may not work for someone else who struggles with losing weight.
                        In Sanity,
                        Charlie

                        Weight: 350/200 (within 16 months)/205
                        Body Fat: 50%/12%/10%

                        A Day in the Life of Groktimus Prime

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RichMahogany View Post
                          When people at work are trying to convince me it's okay to eat honey and apples and whatever, they use the following B.S. line: "but it's natural sugar"

                          So I'm thinking we should steal their tactic and start saying "but it's natural fat." And just leave it. If they want to ask why that's better/okay, you have the information to back it up.
                          That's very clever! I like it.
                          In Sanity,
                          Charlie

                          Weight: 350/200 (within 16 months)/205
                          Body Fat: 50%/12%/10%

                          A Day in the Life of Groktimus Prime

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Dr. Bork Bork View Post
                            When I mention how much I love fat, I try to keep it in their perspective. The bulk of my friends recognize that coconut and avocado are healthy fats. Once I start going on about bacon, their eyes glaze over.
                            I think I freak people out when I mention that sometimes I'll cook a pound of bacon and dip it in real, slightly melted better.
                            In Sanity,
                            Charlie

                            Weight: 350/200 (within 16 months)/205
                            Body Fat: 50%/12%/10%

                            A Day in the Life of Groktimus Prime

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Groktimus Prime View Post
                              I've actually experienced what it's like to go from morbidly obese to lean and thin, but I know what you're talking about. I've had obese people lecture me on different aspects of nutrition, and in my mind, I'm thinking "either your advice is wrong or you don't really believe what you preach, or both." On the other hand, people who have been naturally thin all their lives have a different perspective than me on the necessity of carbs that should be part of one's diet. In this case, I would caution that what has worked well for a naturally thin person may not work for someone else who struggles with losing weight.
                              Absolutely. I too, have been on both sides of the fence. I was "hot" enough a few years ago that I never had to open doors or carry my shopping bags to my car, and my husband literally uprooted and moved from half way around the world to marry me... He swears he loves me every bit as much as he did back then, but it's still been tough... I now feel genderless and invisible, and have entire groups of people I haven't seen for years because as far as they're concerned, I'm still a fit, healthy girl who models for performance automotive companies. I am just not comfortable being anything else.

                              Oh well. Life happens. I feel blessed, because I found MDA because of my weight, staved off diabetes, and was able to convert my parents to PB way of life. None of that could have happened if I didn't live through this experience. And I WILL be myself again.

                              That didn't really have any point... i just wanted to share. Sometimes, even behind the veil of internet anonymity, I feel embarrassed - like I need the folks who read my posts to know I'm a slim girl trapped in a fat girl's body. Crazy, huh? LOL
                              5'6" Female, 29 Years Old, 260/195/120

                              "Discipline is choosing between what you want NOW, and what you want MOST!"

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