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Grokette still hungry!

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  • Grokette still hungry!

    Heya! My name is Jasetyn, been around for a while and really going hard out on getting myself primal and healthy! I am still finding, however, that I am very hungry and sleepy mid day though my late night snacking has practically been quashed! Just wondering if anyone who knew anything about food or nutrition could give me a little bit of a hint as to what I'm doing wrong. Many thanks!!

    So a typical day for me looks about like this:

    2 scoops egg white protein powder after Upper Body workout, 7:30 am

    1 Can of sardines in pure olive oil, oil drained a bit, 10:00 am

    1 lean pork tenderloin cooked in coconut oil and handful of salad veggies, no dressing, 12:30 pm

    approximately 15 roasted unsalted almonds, 12:45 pm

    1 lean pork tenderloin cooked in coconut oil, 3:30 pm

    15 roasted unsalted almonds, 5:45 pm

    4 hard boiled eggs, salad veggies, 1/2 cup cooked carrots, 1 T. rice bran oil, salt and pepper, 6:30 pm

    I work out every morning, hard! I also have Crohn's disease which limits my ability to intake sugars and carbs, so fruit isn't really an option. I know I'm a complicated case, but I appreciate any feedback at all.


  • #2

    Hello Jasetyn! Congrats on your primal journey so far. Don't worry about no fruit, carbs are a crutch!

    My hunch from your menu is that you might not be getting enough fat, particularly saturated. Maybe work in a little organic butter and some fattier meats like bacon or sausage?

    My wife and I both have big appetites on the PB so far (at least when not fasting). I think it's because we're putting on muscle, which is probably to be expected when you cut insulin and the anabolic hormones take over. We just keep on eating different animal proteins and fats until we're full. My wife likes lots of veg too like chard and kale, but full carnivore seems to suit me best.

    Also, watch out for the grains (rice bran oil). There are much more nutritious substitutes, and if you're like me, a tiny amount of grain can wreck everything.


    • #3

      I agree that you need more fat.

      Instead of the protein powder, why not have 4 strips of bacon and a couple eggs friend in the grease?

      If you have a big enough breakfast, you probably won't need that morning snack, but sardines are a good choice if you do snack.

      I'd make lunch bigger. Turn that salad into about 4-6 cups worth instead of a handful and dress it with oil. Put both slabs of pork on the salad and skip the afternoon snack (or add in a different one, like a swig of coconut milk with the evening almonds).

      Dinner looks okay, but you could add in more veggies topped with butter.

      If the Chron's keeps you from adding this many veggies, look instead at adding more meat. Dip strips of cold chicken, steak, or pork in olive oil and balsamic vinegar. Eat ground beef and other, fattier cuts. You shouldn't need to be hungry on the PB.

      Nightlife ~ Chronicles of Less Urban Living, Fresh from In the Night Farm ~ Idaho's Primal Farm!

      Latest post: Stop Being Stupid


      • #4

        At least make sure you enjoy something fatty with your salad. You aren't getting nearly the nutrients from your salad that you could be because a lot of them are fat soluble.


        • #5

          Fourthing the suggestion to add fats.

          Primal eating in a nutshell: If you are hungry, eat Primal food until you are satisfied (not stuffed). Then stop. Wait until you're hungry again. Repeat.

          Looking for my Cholesterol Primer? Here it is:

          Ditch the scale!:

          My Success Story:


          • #6

            I would move and change your workout routines to evenings, after 7 pm, Do Intervals instead of working out hard. You will be more efficient, loose less time exercising and you can be more rested.

            Dietwise, to less fat. Get some bacon over there. Loose the protein powder. Get real eggs instead.


            • #7

              Hey I have Crohn's as well.

              I had severe pains and was bleeding a lot taking many drugs including prednisone before I started eating primal and reversed it. No pains, no blood, no drugs --after over 1 year but the reversal in the symptoms started quickly. I also noticed extremely low inflammation on a strictly carnivore diet.

              Doctors told me diet has nothing to do with Crohn's and that I would be on drugs for good...LOL

              How have you faired so far? Mine is probably not as bad as yours because I can still eat veggies and fruits.


              • #8

                I find that eating larger meals less frequently is much more effective in a low-carb context. I found that when I was constantly eating all day I was more hungry than now when I have a satisfying meal 3 times a day. In a carb-junkie context, eating more frequently makes sense because insulin is always high and for many of us, glycogen runs out too quickly, sense the "stable blood sugar" thing. But we are not carb-junkies!

                Try upping the fat and decreasing meal frequency is my advice.

                Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!


                • #9

                  I'm going to third (fourth?) more fat. For me, that's absolutely the difference from being full or not. And it's really easy to add in to what you've got going now. Add some avocado to one of the dishes... olive oil to the salads/greens... butter to the meats.

                  For me, there's nothing like some bacon and eggs in the morning to set me right for hours. I keep nuts at work in case I get the hungries, but honestly if I have my 2-3 pieces of bacon and 2-3 eggs at 7:30 or 8, I'm usually not the least bit hungry until 1 or 2. I haven't dipped into the nuts for a few weeks...

                  sigpic "Boy I got vision and the rest of the world is wearing bifocals" - Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid


                  • #10

                    You don't need all the protein you've got in there. You should be eating at least 50% of your calories from fat. No lean meats! Too much protein and not enough fat will cause "rabbit starvation". You can eat and eat and still be hungry if you don't get enough fat.

                    If you're eschewing carbs, then you'll want to go for at least a 1:1 ratio of fat to protein. For instance, a 100g (about 3.5oz) portion of lean pork will give you 3g of fat for 22g protein. That's 1:7.3 ratio, which is bad. Egg whites have no fat, so I'd avoid them unless the protein powder has lots of added fat in it. If you want to use protein powder, I'd suggest you blend it with coconut milk, which is mostly fat.

                    The whole eggs have a 1:1.2 ratio, which is pretty good. Drained sardines have about a 1:2 ratio, so use the sardine oil to coat your salad veggies and you'll get a much better ratio. Hope that makes sense! :-)


                    • #11

                      I would say you are still a sugar addict. Even though you don't eat a lot of sugar, you eat so frequently that you are running mostly off the sugars you do get. Combine the meals into a couple large meals rather than spread out over the day.

                      It's grandma, but you can call me sir.


                      • #12

                        Thanks heaps everyone! I can't believe how many replies I got in a day. Very appreciated. So from all of this I am receiving this information:

                        1.) I am eating to much protein compared to fat, need more fat, but need to avoid rice bran oil.

                        2.) Eat more 'hefty' meals less frequently.

                        3.) Attempt to either A.) Get more veggies, or B.) be more carnivorous, depending on which method works better for me.

                        I will truly take these suggestions to heart!

                        Blaze, welcome fellow Crohn's-er! I have been on a mishmash of the FODMAP and SCD diets with a dairy allergy ( so no butter!) for sometime. Since going SCD (without dairy) I have improved in leaps and bounds. But I still eat very nibbly because of that dreaded fear of pain! I have never taken drugs for it (refused) and went on this diet journey right after I was diagnosed, which has its negatives, but I'm very happy with primal. Thanks again everyone!



                        • #13

                          Hi Jasetyn, not sure if it makes much difference but looking at my post again I realized that I gave confusing advice about the fat ratios before. If you're going carnivorous, then you'll want to keep a 1:1 ratio of fatrotein, which will give you about twice as many calories from fat as from protein, since fat has more calories than protein does (per gram). If you're going for more veggies, then you'll want to go for about 50% total of your calories from fat. Hopefully I didn't just make that even more confusing! :-)


                          • #14

                            Thanks Kcurtain, I think I'm taking it all in, haha.


                            • #15

                              Jasetyn, good going on managing the Crohn's!

                              I'm glad to see that you are aware of the SCD diet. I read Elaine Gottschall's book last year, and while I don't have Crohn's or ulcerative colitis, my digestion has never been very good either (especially when it comes to tolerating "healthy" vegetables!). I tried the SCD diet and did better than before. In particular, it was a miracle cure for the hay fever that had made me miserable in late spring for 50 years! Never thought I'd manage that ...

                              Anyway, I was quite compliant about eliminating disaccharides and starches, but I got an almighty peanut butter and honey habit going. Now I've thrown them both out of my diet and am still adjusting to their loss.

                              One of the very best foods for intestinal healing, which I don't see in your menu, is bony soup/stew. I take a lamb roast (leg of lamb, or shoulder roast, or ham hocks, or lamb shank, or a chicken carcass, and of course oxtail would be good if you can get it) and cook it very slowly in the crockpot till the connective tissue is just falling off the bones. If the broth cools it will gel, with a little solid fat on top. Then I scoop out some of the meat, eat it, and put everything (minus bones) into a saucepan, adding some carrots and celery, maybe an onion, and a mushroom or two now and then (though Elaine doesn't like them.) Sometimes a dab of butter or coconut oil, sometimes a few cherry tomatoes. The fat from the meat is all there, too. The gelatin is very healthy, and the whole dish is extremely satisfying. Plenty of fat to satisfy your other advisers.

                              Once all the broth is made into soup and gobbled up, I just wash out the crock pot, bring another grassfed lamb or beef cut or ham hock out of the freezer, plug in the crock pot, turn it to low, put in water, and start all over. I always have this delicious and satisfying food at some point in the process from thawing frozen joint or ham hock (my favorite) to the last of the soup.

                              Glutamine powder is supposed to help heal intestines as well, and overcome carb cravings. The bony soups are similar in chemistry to glutamine, I believe.

                              Once cleaned right off, the bones can be saved as well. I put them in the wood stove's firebox to char, and then crumble them into the garden soil. Calcium phosphate is where you find it ... by doing this, everything these good local grassfed animals have given me is put to use. I like to think, they didn't live all that long, but they should surely have been happy, safely grazing in a beautiful place, looked after by good people (my friends.)

                              My aim isn't just to heal my lifelong leaky gut. (Caesarean, two weeks premature, then no breast milk --cow's milk formula-- then weaned to cheap carbs - corn flakes, white bread with margarine and grape jelly for breakfast - ugh.) I want all the glucosamine and chondroitin and gelatin in that connective tissue to heal my knees and tendons. I certainly hope that even after several years of bad knees, they will still be able to heal eventually, slowly if necessary.