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Leptin: It probably doesn't do what you think it does.

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Drea6681 View Post
    thank you. Day two of my leptin reset and I am walking away. I'm sorry, I just don't think 6 slices of bacon, 4 eggs, and lots of butter is healthy unless you spend 5 hours at the gym.
    Gotta disagree here. That's a pretty common breakfast for me, although I usually have 5 eggs, and I don't spend 5 hours in a week (much less a day as you seem to be implying here) at a gym.

    Am I perfectly healthy? No, not yet. But, I'm getting there and it's a process. Eating a breakfast like this is a damn sight more helpful than eating toast, cereal, and OJ every day.

    Originally posted by paleo-bunny View Post
    He's totally right about the high protein breakfast, IMO, but 30g is enough for me.
    I really think the suggestion of 50g protein for breakfast should be a "scalable" number based on how much daily protein one is shooting for. I can do 50g of protein for breakfast no problem most days, but then again, I'm shooting for 150g/day. I know that's higher than a lot of people on here, so I wonder if something along the lines of "1/3 of one's targeted daily protein intake" would be a better suggestion than an absolute 50g number.
    Last edited by tim_1522; 03-21-2012, 01:47 PM. Reason: Adding a thought and didn't want a new post...
    Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

    Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
    Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

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    • #32
      Thanks for the information, pklopp.
      I ran into a few posts mentioning leptin reset and still have no idea what it is. It makes my brain hurt thinking about it.
      Female, age 51, 5' 9"
      SW - 183 (Jan 22, 2012), CW - 159, GW - healthy.

      Met my 2012 goals by losing 24 pounds.
      2013 goals are to get fit and strong!

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Anonymouse View Post
        First off, I'll say I agree with you partially. It is hard to say that leptin is the culprit for all of our problems given the complexity of our biochemistry. But leptin resistance due to high blood sugar is a real phenomenon, and, phrased in your analogy, could mean that the fuel gauge on your car is broken. It would trick you into thinking you don't have any fuel and you may overflow your tank in response, leading to car obesity.
        I think Lustig referenced some research regarding the competition with carbohydrates and I also believe that insulin competes with leptin for transport across the blood brain barrier. But that is moot, and a bit frustrating because I have yet to hear one credible explanation as to why the physiological response to leptin should be linear.

        It seems to me that when you look at biological systems, they are pretty much defined by their non-linearity. As a most fundamental motivating example, consider the amount of water you need in order to function properly. If you do not get enough water, you will die, but, just as deadly is getting too much water which will cause water poisoning and kill you just as surely as dehydration will. If you were to plot the body's response to water ingestion, you would get a bell shaped curve, definitely not a straight line where "more is always better." Of course, leptin resistance advocates would simply say that there was an underlying metabolic defect that was producing "water resistance." This is pure drivel that comes directly from the baseless assumption that the response curve is linear.

        I go into some more detail about this on my blog post which I am loath to copy and paste here, mostly because I like the formatting on my site, and it does have a cute picture of some fat mice.

        -PK
        My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

        Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by tim_1522 View Post
          I really think the suggestion of 50g protein for breakfast should be a "scalable" number based on how much daily protein one is shooting for. I can do 50g of protein for breakfast no problem most days, but then again, I'm shooting for 150g/day. I know that's higher than a lot of people on here, so I wonder if something along the lines of "1/3 of one's targeted daily protein intake" would be a better suggestion than an absolute 50g number.
          For sure I agree everything should be scalable. It's fundamentally unscientific otherwise. I was merely being lazy and couldn't be arsed to make the qualification that you did.
          F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
            if I read Kruse's words myself, I simply cannot follow him. He speaks in word salad - a big bowl of words. Not that following his ideas don't help people, just that he's not very good at communicating in my opinion and some of his ideas come across, I'm not sure how to put this, but as having more exclamation points than evidence.
            I find Kruse to be utterly incomprehensible. The worrying bit about that is that it probably indicates a muddled mind.

            -PK
            My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

            Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

            Comment


            • #36
              Most will never be able to eat less/the amount their body really needs unless they eat right. Leptin explains why calories is crap & why you likely can't diet the wheat away- it just won't budge.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by fiercehunter View Post
                Most will never be able to eat less/the amount their body really needs unless they eat right. Leptin explains why calories is crap & why you likely can't diet the wheat away- it just won't budge.

                I disagree with this. When I eat high calories, even with super low (<50g) carbs, I gain weight, or at the very least, I don't lose fat. When I monkey around with calories so that they are overall under my maintenance calories, I lose weight, regardless of adding more carbs. The problem for me is that being a petite woman, it is unenjoyable to eat below maintenance calories for a long enough time. And in my opinion, it's supposed to be - I don't think humans were designed to be able to lose weight effortlessly, that wouldn't be in the best interest of survival. Losing fat isn't easy, it wasn't meant to be. It's only now that we live in a world of processed cheap easy calories that this has become a problem.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by BestBetter View Post
                  I disagree with this. When I eat high calories, even with super low (<50g) carbs, I gain weight, or at the very least, I don't lose fat. When I monkey around with calories so that they are overall under my maintenance calories, I lose weight, regardless of adding more carbs. The problem for me is that being a petite woman, it is unenjoyable to eat below maintenance calories for a long enough time. And in my opinion, it's supposed to be - I don't think humans were designed to be able to lose weight effortlessly, that wouldn't be in the best interest of survival. Losing fat isn't easy, it wasn't meant to be. It's only now that we live in a world of processed cheap easy calories that this has become a problem.
                  It may be a matter of genetics. I am thinner on higher calories than I was a few years ago on lower calories- the main difference seems to be I don't eat carbs every day & eat more fat. I am eating like hundreds of calories more per day than I was.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by pklopp View Post
                    I find Kruse to be utterly incomprehensible. The worrying bit about that is that it probably indicates a muddled mind.

                    -PK
                    I was going to delve into some of his stuff since his name comes up a lot in the community, but then I saw some of his outlandish behavior on paleohacks and other sites and decided that I'd rather not get into his work.
                    Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who has said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own experience.

                    In the mind of the beginner, there are many possibilities; in the mind of the expert, there are few.


                    I've shaken hands with a raccoon and lived to tell the tale

                    SW: 220- 225 pounds at the beginning of January
                    CW: 180 pounds

                    Goals for 2012: Lose a bit more fat and start a serious muscle and strength routine

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                    • #40
                      If you have had trouble losing weight on regular Primal and Paleo despite your best efforts, and wonder why..well then you should give the Leptin Reset a try. It is Paleo/Primal with easy parameters: First is be leptin resistant, this is not everyone. Second, eat within a half hour of waking, and eat 50+ g of protein. No snacks and 4-5 hrs between meals. Sleep 3+ hours after last eating. Do things to enhance your body's natural circadian rhythm. That is it.

                      It freaking worked like a champ for me when nothing else did, including 100% hardcore "perfect" primal. I was despondent that all I believed in paleo-wise just wasn't delivering. I am just saying, for some people who fail at Primal regular style, it has been a great experience. If Primal is working for you then you don't need this. It is a deeper look at your body in terms of testing etc than regular primal. If you have crap going on that just isn't the usual highly responsive to paleo diet stuff....go for it! Remember, the man and the message are separate. Jack Kruse is not Mark Sisson. Get what you need, and take it and work it I say. You just might really find a benefit. If you find the man annoying or whatever, just ignore that part and look at the plan. I feel like I got what most people get just by going Primal when I did the Leptin Reset. My 2 cents.
                      Started Whole30 December 31, 2011
                      Integrated Leptin Reset/Jack Kruse plan Jan 13, 2012
                      Starting Weight: 174.8
                      CW:160.0 lbs

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by L8F View Post
                        Second, eat within a half hour of waking, and eat 50+ g of protein. No snacks and 4-5 hrs between meals. Sleep 3+ hours after last eating. Do things to enhance your body's natural circadian rhythm. That is it.
                        Yup, and all of that fits within PB. None of it's that hard to implement -- except maybe the 50g protein for breakfast thing, which I already said up thread should probably be scaled to the person's daily protein target. And Mark is *always* stressing how important sleep and natural circadian rhythm is to the bodies processes, so it's not like this is really any re-write the Primal book stuff here.
                        Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

                        Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
                        Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by tim_1522 View Post
                          Yup, and all of that fits within PB. None of it's that hard to implement -- except maybe the 50g protein for breakfast thing, which I already said up thread should probably be scaled to the person's daily protein target. And Mark is *always* stressing how important sleep and natural circadian rhythm is to the bodies processes, so it's not like this is really any re-write the Primal book stuff here.
                          Agree, first step of the reset is to buy Mark's book, or Robb Wolfs and get on the diet. Believe or don't believe in it, I certainly don't mind either way. BUT...if you are struggling and can't sort it out, why the hell not try it for 30 days??? Why all the fuss? I don't care who is delivering the message. Many of those who wonder about why one would need such a thing are already cranking along nicely with regular Paleo/Primal (or Leptin Sensitive already).

                          I am posting this not to be controversial, but in case there are those reading out there who are stuck, and bummed out about it, and might wander away from Primal/Paleo cause "it doesn't work" It does, and I fully believe it is the key to good health. But some need a little more tweaking to get to the promised land.
                          Last edited by L8F; 03-21-2012, 05:20 PM.
                          Started Whole30 December 31, 2011
                          Integrated Leptin Reset/Jack Kruse plan Jan 13, 2012
                          Starting Weight: 174.8
                          CW:160.0 lbs

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                          • #43
                            Leptin Reset= lower carb Zone diet.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by fiercehunter View Post
                              Leptin Reset= lower carb Zone diet.
                              Hardly...
                              Re-focusing on the Primal Lifestyle in 2012!

                              Starting: 221.0lb, 29.5% BF (1/9/2012)
                              Latest: 208.9, 26.1% BF (3/19/2012)

                              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread35679.html

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by L8F View Post
                                Agree, first step of the reset is to buy Mark's book, or Robb Wolfs and get on the diet. Believe or don't believe in it, I certainly don't mind either way. BUT...if you are struggling and can't sort it out, why the hell not try it for 30 days??? Why all the fuss? I don't care who is delivering the message. Many of those who wonder about why one would need such a thing are already cranking along nicely with regular Paleo/Primal (or Leptin Sensitive already).
                                If it works to eat that way, great. It's basically paleo/primal with some stricter rules. But Kruse's science is pretty sketchy, which is what people are arguing with--the leptin reset works because high satiety protein/fat meals, no snacking, and adequate rest are all known strategies for weight loss, not because it's magic medicine for your leptin signalling system.
                                “If I didn't define myself for myself, I would be crunched into other people's fantasies for me and eaten alive.” --Audre Lorde

                                Owly's Journal

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