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Sugar Isn't The Problem. You're The Problem.

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  • Real foods can be toxic too.
    F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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    • Originally posted by dboxing View Post
      Choco nailed it. But, the problem is people confuse simple with easy. It's not easy because many people on here can't do moderation. They'll take absolutism over moderation, because moderation, as a life practice, requires restraint, nuance, and the ability to think critically. It’s much easier to quote Taubes, then say being obese is not really unhealthy, argue about minutia, and stay overweight and unhealthy, all the while rationalizing that you, and only you, are in the know (very much like a religion/cult).
      But that's the thing--you're saying that Choco *nailed* it but he has appeared to me to be an absolutist the majority of the time, well before this thread. Look at his carb cycle plan or whatever it was a few months ago:

      "I WONT eat this. I WILL drink a beer and I WILL ENJOY IT. If I DARE devolve from my plan, I'll give up my first born!!"

      Ok, I'm exaggerating but primarily for silliness. Because that kind of dogmatic flogging is only helpful to those who feel they need big, huge paint lines on the road or they'll forget it's possible to die if they drive off into the ditch.

      But his last paragraph could have been ripped from PB and gives me hope that the point of this entire thread is to find personal moderation:

      "Guys, this isn't hard. Health is SIMPLE. Eat real food. Make sure you're getting enough protein. Eat moderately 90% of the time. 5% of the time, starve yourself. 5% of the time, stuff your face. Go outside and get some fresh air and sunshine. Stop stressing about work, money and family and take some time to enjoy your life. Get enough sleep. Move around and pick up some heavy stuff. That's ALL you have to do - eat, sleep, go outside, occasionally stress yourself physically and don't overstress mentally. DONE! Stop counting carbohydrate and weighing yourself. You'll only make yourself stressed - and therefore you won't lose the weight!"

      If thats the point, it's one I can appreciate.

      “you aren't what you eat - you are what you don't poop.” Wavy Gravy

      Today I am Fillyjonk. Tommorow I will be Snufkin.

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      • Originally posted by Forgotmylastusername View Post
        I think it's pretty unlikely that ketogenic diets long term were the norm.
        Here's an interesting write up. Hunter-gatherer diets—a different perspective
        Totally, utterly fascinating. Thanks for that link -

        “you aren't what you eat - you are what you don't poop.” Wavy Gravy

        Today I am Fillyjonk. Tommorow I will be Snufkin.

        Comment


        • ^That write up is interesting. I take issue with "Such a suggestion, however well intentioned, seems ill advised given the high fat content of domesticated livestock relative to that of wild prey (2)" though. Just because the muscle meat is somewhat lean does not mean that our ancestors just threw out the mesenteric fat. How wasteful would that have been! Archevore - Archevore Blog - "Lean" grass fed bison*images

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          • Originally posted by Neckhammer View Post
            ^That write up is interesting. I take issue with "Such a suggestion, however well intentioned, seems ill advised given the high fat content of domesticated livestock relative to that of wild prey (2)" though. Just because the muscle meat is somewhat lean does not mean that our ancestors just threw out the mesenteric fat. How wasteful would that have been! Archevore - Archevore Blog - "Lean" grass fed bison*images
            Blasphemy! They obviously went straight for the london broil steaks and left the rest of the carcass for the birds...

            Comment


            • I found this pretty interesting as well. About some of the lengths the far Northern Indians went to when carbohydrates were scarce. I found it pretty interesting because I found that a starch and fruit free diet killed my libido.

              Chris Masterjohn on Cholesterol and Heart Disease (Part 3)

              "So, I think if you see those classics symptoms, if you see high cholesterol and low sex hormones, for example, I think those are good clues in addition to T3 and reverse T3 that might signify that an increase in carbohydrate intake might be needed, but I have an anecdote that I think is pretty interesting to share from Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, Weston Price’s book.

              Chris Kresser: Yeah, let’s hear it.

              "Chris Masterjohn: He says: “For the Indians of the far North this reinforcement” — he’s talking about reinforcement of nutrition for pregnancy — “was accomplished by supplying special feedings of organs of animals. Among the Indians in the moose country near the Arctic circle a larger percentage of the children were born in June than in any other month. This was accomplished, I was told, by both parents eating liberally of the thyroid glands of the male moose as they came down from the high mountain areas for the mating season, at which time the large protuberances carrying the thyroids under the throat were greatly enlarged.” So, what he’s saying is when the moose were about to reproduce, they naturally went into a kind of hyperthyroid state where their thyroids were enlarged, and the people there would harvest the thyroid glands so that they could reproduce, and as a consequence, most of their children were born nine months after the moose mating season.

              Chris Kresser: Wow.

              Chris Masterjohn: And what the indicates to me is — I mean, it’s difficult to interpret it because he doesn’t go into great detail, but I think what we might be seeing here is up in the Arctic circle — and these are the inland people, they’re not seacoast, so they probably don’t have a lot of iodine in the diet, they certainly don’t have a lot of carbohydrate in the diet. It seems like they, as part of their natural adaptation to their environment, they supplemented with thyroid hormone so that they could convert their cholesterol to sex hormones so that they could increase their fertility, and I think what we’re witnessing is perhaps a natural acknowledgement that under those certain conditions where you have an extremely carbohydrate-restricted diet, you may need supplemental thyroid hormone in order to maintain that fertility. "

              Comment


              • ^^ Yeah someone ELSE posted THAT link.. hahaha

                I love that part as well
                Primal since March 2011

                Female/29 years old/5' 1"/130ish lbs

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                • What would be a baseline amoutn of carbs to keep up sexual libido? I definitley am worried about the lack of sexual urges i have been having, granted before primal i wasn't overly keen either but that was more to my own choice and would excercsie sexual activities at will, but at this point in time i can't do it, completly zapped. Don't think the issue would be geting an erection, rather the want and urge to do so.

                  Sorry if this is derailling the thread...

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by zizou View Post
                    What would be a baseline amoutn of carbs to keep up sexual libido? I definitley am worried about the lack of sexual urges i have been having, granted before primal i wasn't overly keen either but that was more to my own choice and would excercsie sexual activities at will, but at this point in time i can't do it, completly zapped. Don't think the issue would be geting an erection, rather the want and urge to do so.

                    Sorry if this is derailling the thread...
                    I've moved to ~150grams of carbs (95% starch) on most days, and I've also started iodine supplementation and I've noticed huge improvements in my libido. However, there isn't any special number. Just start upping your carb intake until you feel good.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Kilian View Post
                      I've moved to ~150grams of carbs (95% starch) on most days, and I've also started iodine supplementation and I've noticed huge improvements in my libido. However, there isn't any special number. Just start upping your carb intake until you feel good.
                      Thanks for your reply, good to hear you've gotten results.

                      I don't think i've gone a week straight of 150g of carbs in a while, or atleast that i know of, so i should give it a shot for a week straight and note any changes. I am not VLC but i find myself at times, as a result of wanting to avoid easy carbs or just lack of preperation, of going down a protein+veggie+fat route and sometimes will only really have a starch or rice at 1 meal for the day. I'll look into incorporating some iodine rich foods in my diet too, seaweed being one of them.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by zizou View Post
                        What would be a baseline amoutn of carbs to keep up sexual libido? I definitley am worried about the lack of sexual urges i have been having, granted before primal i wasn't overly keen either but that was more to my own choice and would excercsie sexual activities at will, but at this point in time i can't do it, completly zapped. Don't think the issue would be geting an erection, rather the want and urge to do so.

                        Sorry if this is derailling the thread...
                        Yeah, I'm low carb but if there is ever a single day that there is not any lead in my pencil I will surely rethink my ways . Carbs, moose thyroid, whatever! Happily after for doing this for 2 years and a wife of 8 years I'm still ready to rock at any given moment. Good thing my wife also has a strong libido.

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                        • Originally posted by cmb939h
                          It isn't carbs that are the enemy of fitness. Carbs are fuel for fitness as long as they're the right kind of foods in reasonable proportion to one's activity level.



                          Please the best p4p boxers eat wheat,oats,whatever and have great health. I just don't see Wheat as that bad and too me is like it's a fad. But whatever. I see what you have on the table but I'm still undecided. All of it turns to sugar.

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                          • ^^responded to a bot

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                            • Originally posted by Dailytribal View Post
                              Please the best p4p boxers eat wheat,oats,whatever and have great health. I just don't see Wheat as that bad and too me is like it's a fad. But whatever. I see what you have on the table but I'm still undecided. All of it turns to sugar.
                              "Great Health" is a pretty subjective and acute measure. Just because they feel/look great now, doesn't mean their bodies aren't slowly accumulating the negative effects over time.

                              Comment


                              • Guys, this isn't hard. Health is SIMPLE. Eat real food. Make sure you're getting enough protein. Eat moderately 90% of the time. 5% of the time, starve yourself. 5% of the time, stuff your face. Go outside and get some fresh air and sunshine. Stop stressing about work, money and family and take some time to enjoy your life. Get enough sleep. Move around and pick up some heavy stuff. That's ALL you have to do - eat, sleep, go outside, occasionally stress yourself physically and don't overstress mentally. DONE! Stop counting carbohydrate and weighing yourself. You'll only make yourself stressed - and therefore you won't lose the weight![/QUOTE]


                                I absolutely LOVE this!!! It really is as simple as that!

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