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The Dairy Dilemma!

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Evita View Post
    When someone "cuts out" dairy and finds magical weight loss has ensued- is that just from calorie reduction ( due to not eating , cheese, butter, etc etc etc) or is dairy really straight up the devil and will cause weight gain?
    Many people really underestimate the calorie punch of heavy cream and cheeses, so cutting those out or down significantly can certainly help with weight loss, especially for women. I had a French neighbor when I lived in Germany who used to invite us over to dinner, and bring out the proverbial cheese tray afterwards (first time I had ever seen it done, lol). She cut only teeny slivers or cubes of cheese to have alongside her fruit (like two cubes each the size of a dice!). The yogurts I used to buy overseas in Europe were also small, maybe only 4-6 oz. each.

    I think that if you like and tolerate dairy products but want to lose weight, start by trimming portion sizes first and see if that helps.

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    • #47
      Well, it is not as simple as that. Both sugars and proteins in milk are special (lactose and casein), and, according to some it could mess with blood sugar/insulin and all that prohibiting the fat loss, not just calorie count straight out. Choco said he started to lean out by dropping just a 130 or so calories portion of yogurt that was almost entirely protein. I haven't seen this effect cutting out quark, but I still wonder...
      My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
      When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

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      • #48
        Need to buy cheese today. Would someone tell me what to look for on the label. I like cheddar, swiss, parmesan and mozzarella and usually just buy the store brand or Kraft. I mostly use shredded; I know stuff is added to keep it from sticking together. I'm not a cheese connoisseur just want something to scramble into my eggs or sprinkle over cauliflower.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Leida View Post
          There is nothing wrong with fermented raw dairy, that's why they fermented it, to prevent spoilage and use it for longer. But, in a lot of countries raw is simply not an option. I live in Canada, and it is illegal to sell raw milk.
          This...
          Raw yogurt is fine. Makes a tummy happy. =)

          Since swapping to raw (milk, cream, and homemade yogurt) I have ZERO symptoms of lactose intolerance.
          “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
          ~Friedrich Nietzsche
          And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

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          • #50
            Homemade yogurt and cheese are the best
            Homemade raw milk yogurt is great. To make it you first heat up the raw milk to get rid of any bad bacteria that could be there and the fermentation will allow the yogurt to last longer than liquid milk. They do not sell raw milk at stores and markets, but in states where it is not banned, you can buy raw milk directly from the farms.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Pigevil View Post
              Homemade yogurt and cheese are the best
              Homemade raw milk yogurt is great. To make it you first heat up the raw milk to get rid of any bad bacteria that could be there and the fermentation will allow the yogurt to last longer than liquid milk. They do not sell raw milk at stores and markets, but in states where it is not banned, you can buy raw milk directly from the farms.
              NO, No, no... to make RAW yogurt you do not heat the milk enough to kill off the bacteria and enzymes found in the raw milk. If you do that the yogurt is no longer raw.

              You CAN heat the milk to do so (to about 180 degrees)... and many people do. That is not raw yogurt. The milk is pasteurized by that heating process.
              But there are lots of people who only heat the milk to 110-115... never above, thus preserving the enzymes and bacteria found int the raw milk and adding the cultures to make it into yogurt. It often doesn't set as firmly as pasteurized yogurt because it is not heated enough to denature the proteins, but is delicious and safe to consume. And by draining some of the whey it becomes thick. Much silkier than pasteurized IMO. I like mine tangy and allow it to ferment for nearly up to 24 hours without any problems.

              Of course this is a personal decision, but to me... if I am going to go to the trouble and extra expense of getting raw milk (which does not make me sick like pasteurized/homogenized does), why would I kill all the good stuff in it? Just my 2c.
              Last edited by cori93437; 02-09-2012, 02:52 PM.
              “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
              ~Friedrich Nietzsche
              And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

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              • #52
                Yes, it might seem counterproductive, but a lot of people who are new or still hesitant about raw milk would heat it to at least sterilize it. But 180 degrees is too high for raw milk.
                I also depends on whether you want raw yogurt or yogurt made from raw milk.
                Also depends on preference, if you want runnier/thinner (less heat). If you want it thicker (more heat).

                For thermophilic cultures, at least the ones that I use, you still have to heat the raw milk to 160 to activate the mother culture, then you just incubate it at 110. Even when I heat the raw milk to 160, the yogurt still tastes better to me than yogurt made from pasteurized milk.

                It seems you are using a mesophilic culture since you let it set for 24 hours. If I let thermophilic cultures set for longer than 12 hours, it separates beyond repair and the bacteria begins to die. For mesophilic, I do not even heat the yogurt at all, not even to 110, but just inoculate it at room temperature and let it be for 24 hours or even more. Those are most of the Northern European or scandinavian type yogurts.

                One way or the other, I love homemade yogurts...

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by ASmallOne View Post
                  I have found that strangely my tolerance for butter increases as my fiber intake decreases. The combo of butter and fiber for me is like pouring paste into my gut. Butter alone is okay.
                  Same! Sort of. Dairy on its own is no problem but if I combine it with sugar eg. figs stuffed with cheese, nutella with cheese etc my body goes mad and it's always the same sad ending:
                  I can't stop shoving them in --> stomach feels like a barrel full of lead and starts churning --> stumble to toilet and spend next hour cursing my own stupidity.

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                  • #54
                    I dropped all dairy because I was nursing my DS who is allergic to dairy and within 3 months, I dropped 20+lb. I replaced dairy with almond milk and coconut milk, so I was still getting lots of calories. I am also apparently either allergic or intolerant to dairy though, so that may have something to do with it.

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                    • #55
                      When i stopped eating dairy a few years ago, my adult acne disappeared. As soon as I'd reintroduce it, bam, the acne came right back. I didn't noticed any fat loss, unfortunately.

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                      • #56
                        I have always eaten a lot of dairy. Going primal inspired me to switch to raw milk--I have a local source of raw milk from Jersey cows, which some people believe has healthier protein than Holsteins. For a while I made raw milk yogurt--only heating the milk to 115 degrees F--using this culture: Traditional Flavor Yogurt Starter. It made a nice thick yogurt even with raw milk. I've since switched to kefir, cultured at room temperature. I go through a half gallon of raw milk a week. I've also been drinking a cup of supermarket skim milk with my family most nights, but I may give that up. Or perhaps switch to drinking kefir at supper, and buy a gallon a week of raw milk. I use butter in cooking, and sometimes organic sour cream. I don't eat cheese every day but when I do eat it I often eat an ounce or two.
                        __________________________
                        age 56, type 2 diabetes, swimmer
                        low carb since 2006 thanks to Jenny, primal since Jan. 2012

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                        • #57
                          And what to make of the studies that suggest that the calcium from dairy (and not greens or supplements) can actually AID in weightloss?

                          Ah, conflicting info. I agree with what paleo-bunny says about lactose though. This is why I keep to veer low lactose forms of dairy like butter, cheese, and some types of yoghurt.
                          "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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                          • #58
                            I just tried raw milk (goat's) for the first time ever and omg it was so thick and creamy compared to cows milk which tastes so watery. Unfortunately I had trouble controlling myself and drank a litre in 2 days so I think I won't be buying it regularly, however if i wasn't trying to lose weight, I'd be buying it all the time
                            In the past I've avoided cows milk because i noticed myself coughing up phlegm whenever i had it but had absolutely no problems this time drinking so much milk at once- I'm guessing the fact that it was raw makes a big difference.

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