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  • #16
    1



    I wouldn't think that it would be a particular tuber. Just like we don't rely on a particular fruit, a particular nut.


    Why should Tuber be any different?

    Comment


    • #17
      1



      For the same reasons that peanuts are not primal. Because it matters if we evolved eating it or not.


      Different species of tubers have different toxins to prevent decay/bacteria/fungus/insects and if we were not exposed to those toxins, we didn't evolve to handle them.


      That's pretty much the whole premise of the paleo diet and how PB works. We are able to eat what Grok evolved eating and anything outside of that is inherently risky or downright harmful.


      If we evolved eating a mint tuber then we are not automatically able to eat potatoes.


      Potatoes contain the glycoalkaloids solanine and chaconine. Solanine is found in the plants of the nightshade family and not the mint family. The concentration of these glycoalkaloids in wild potatoes makes them toxic to humans.

      The "Seven Deadly Sins"

      Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
      Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
      Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

      Comment


      • #18
        1



        I found a potential candidate for a fallback tuber foodsource for Grok - Tiger Nut. It doesn't look like it was around in Africa, so we haven't had very long to adapt to it though.


        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyperus_esculentus


        Interestingly quite high in oil (20-36%) - 18% saturated (palmitic acid and stearic acid) and 82% unsaturated (oleic acid and linoleic acid) fatty acids.


        Making them a far cry from the modern tubers and probably a much better food source.


        I don't know how well you would do trying to gather a feed of them in the wild, but in times of desperation they might have helped Grok survive?

        The "Seven Deadly Sins"

        Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
        Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
        Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

        Comment


        • #19
          1



          Here's some info on the one tuber I can find from Africa that may have been consumed by paleo man. Part of the mint familiy:


          http://database.prota.org/PROTAhtml/Solenostemon%20rotundifolius_En.htm


          Of the 3,000 members of the this family, only two (treat synonymously) from Africa produce human food below ground. However, quantities produced in any one location are generally small.

          They also have much more protein and amino acids than modern potatoes and some localized types can safely be eaten raw.

          The "Seven Deadly Sins"

          Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
          Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
          Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

          Comment


          • #20
            1



            I drool a lot.


            Does that mean I have many AMY 1 genes haha!


            I hate white potatoes though.

            Don't be a paleotard...

            http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nut...oxidation.html

            http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nut...torage-qa.html

            http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat...rn-fat-qa.html

            http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/nut...-you-need.html

            Comment


            • #21
              1



              What about arrowroot? This was all over the world as humans were coming of age and is quite edible.


              This matter of toxic solanum is hogwash for most people, as is alleged toxicity for raw white potatoes. I've eaten pounds and pounds over the years while prepping food or while Mom was.

              Comment


              • #22
                1



                Arrowroot (maranta arundinacea) is from India and was not in Africa with our ancestors.


                Modern potatoes are cultivated to reduce the toxins. Raw wild potatoes are toxic to humans.

                The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                Comment


                • #23
                  1



                  The same would apply to fruits. So we couldn't call them primal either. We don't know which ones where eaten in primal times. Current versions are already quite deadly, lots of fructose. Which is far more deadly than starch.


                  I would say that potatoes are far more primal than apples ;-).

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    1



                    Most modern fruit are nothing like what would have been found in the wild and I would avoid them as much as potato.


                    http://heartscanblog.blogspot.com/2010/02/diabetes-from-fruit.html


                    The modern apple is nothing like what a wild apple was:


                    http://www.pbs.org/thebotanyofdesire/apple-sweetness.php


                    However, the apple did come from Asia and we have had a lot longer to get used to eating them than the potato.


                    * And we do know about fruits were available to Grok, you just have to research it

                    The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                    Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                    Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                    Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      1



                      id say neither are primal. or maybe in a very narrow, existential and seasonal sense.

                      challenge yourself
                      i blog here http://theprimalwoman.blogspot.com/

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        1



                        @Anand Srivastava, thanks for the interesting analysis.


                        If potatoes and yams are new world foods, then so are tomatoes and no one argues they are not primal. It makes more sense to say that we do not know for sure what was available back then, and tubers available in relative abundance is not at all an out-there idea.


                        I feel that we seem to accept plants and vegetables that are low in carbs/starch as primal and thus ok, but the ones that are high in it, we look for further confirmation. This is falling into the same trap of making a theory and then looking only for the data that fits it (pretty much what the current research does).


                        The same way the Masai and the Inuit (the French too) were a thorn in the side of the low fat movement. The Kitavans, the Hadza, and others are a thorn in ours. I loved what Gary Taubes said of good science: you have to focus on what disproves your theory.


                        I want to add that I am one of those people who do not feel great on very low carb. And I've been at this for years (going on 8 now). I tried a lot but I keep going back to some starchy food/legumes. I don't have a sugar crash or crave sweets after a meal that includes some form of starch. I feel perfectly content and fine. I actually crave sweets if my meal was mostly meat and protein. But what sends sweet cravings through the roof is sugar.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          1



                          I'm quite happy to say tomatoes aren't paleo and I won't eat them for the same reasons as potatoes. Quite a lot of paleo eaters don't eat nightshades. They aren't harmless:


                          http://www.fitnessspotlight.com/2008/01/06/nightshades/

                          http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12358437


                          Mark did talk about them here:

                          http://www.marksdailyapple.com/nightshades/

                          The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                          Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                          Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                          Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            1



                            Assorted responses:


                            1. The arrowroot I'm referring to is a plant found at the edge of ponds, allegedly found all over the world. Is this the same as the "out of India" variety?


                            2. The fact that we have so much amylase production genes compared to our cousins convinces me that long ago ancestors were eating starches way beyond what some leaves provide.


                            3. Some folk here try to emulate, as best as possible, that (probable) diet of so long ago. Go for it. Others, myself included, recognize that we can't eat the same, even if ZC carnivorous, at least in urban settings. So, get rid of the worst (grains, milk, sugar), and you are 90-95% "there." Keep (modern) fruit and starchy foods in moderation and you are maybe 85-90% "there." Moderation for me meaning 100g a day carbs or less. If on a 2000 calorie/day diet, that's only 20% carbs, some of which would be there anyway, even on "Z"C.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              1

                              [quote]

                              If potatoes and yams are new world foods, then so are tomatoes and no one argues they are not primal.
                              </blockquote>


                              Tarlach does--they are nightshades and were not available to paleo man I *believe*.


                              (Just sayin! I personally do eat tomatoes and nightshades. I&#39;m certainly not strict paleo though--I eat tubers as well. But some folks do argue that tomatoes are not primal/paleo.)

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                1



                                FairyRae2, there are those here that believe if our Homo ancestors did not eat that exact food 2 million years ago, we shouldn&#39;t eat it now. As I said, "Go for it," presuming one can still do so.


                                I think most of us recognize that there are foods available to us now that were not part of the literal paleo diet but aren&#39;t negative for us in some way now.


                                Tarlach is one poster here that says "No!" to Solanum. Most humans have no side effects, so like most humans, I eat them.


                                Life without New Mexico style green chile wouldn&#39;t be worth living. In fact, I think I&#39;ll go eat the last of the last batch right now.......

                                Comment

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