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  • Healing & FODMAPS

    Does anyone have any advice on healing a digestive system so that you can move away from the FODMAPS protocol?

    For the last 7 years I have been experimenting with foods due to chronic health problems, gluten free 100% the whole time, had candida issues, have been essentially primal for 5 years, etc. While I have improved 100 times over, I am still sensitive to so many things. I feel like I am chronically on a low carb regime with extremely restrictive food choices. I have taken numerous anti fungals (not prescription), taken every probiotic I think on the shelf, and I try and eat fermented foods (or at least ones I can still eat). I go to acupuncture quite often and she targets my digestive issues every time (for the last 6 months I have gone about 3 times a month).

    About 9 months ago I found out about fructose malabsorption and went on the FODMAPS protocol with great success (seemed like the last big missing piece of the puzzle). I am super sensitive to pretty much all fruits, even berries, along with honey, legumes, coconut milk, and quite a few veggies (broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, onions, garlic, etc).

    So my current food plan is meats, some veggies, no fruit. I do dairy off and on, I seem to be okay with full fat products, and I do potatoes and occasionally rice as starches (no sweet potatoes).

    I am on a clean 30 this month with my local paleo group, and frankly I feel SUPER restricted. No potatoes, no dairy, no rice.....so meat and some veggies only. My calories have been too low as I am just getting frustrated and skipping meals. This is making me realize how much I need to move forward from this current state.

    I am trying a coconut water kefir as my latest probiotic and continuing the acupuncture. I also take fish oil and vit d. Can anyone suggest anything else to help me 'heal' rather then just get by? I DO feel good on my current diet regime, but I just cannot see this as being a long term solution.
    Erin
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  • #2
    I'm in a similar boat, and alas have no real answers, but I am currently working on consuming gallons of bone broth a la GAPS, which is supposed to be great for gut healing.
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    • #3
      I'm trying Enzymedica Digest and Jarrow's S. Boulardii...

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      • #4
        Danny Roddy may have some thoughts. He believes that FODMAP malabsorption is a gut healing issue.

        I have to avoid many of the same foods as you, Meadow. However, I don't feel deprived at all. Maybe because I don't like fruit/veggies that much?

        I do eat small amounts of sucrose instead of honey (look up Ray Peat.) and since I am not eating much fruit, (I tolerate bananas in a raw milk kefir smoothie) I eat a 55% dark chocolate instead of 70%.

        Again, I do small amounts at each meal & drink 3-4 oz kombucha daily. Liver 2x/week. Gelatin 4-5 x/week. Finding lactose-free kefir and sour cream has definitely helped!

        I figure patience is the key to gut healing for me--NO gluten cheats whatsoever!

        In the meantime, I have some TUMS nearby, in case I want to sample my hubby's delicious guacamole.
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        • #5
          Thanks for the thoughts, I feel less alone now . I think I became more frustrated when I eliminated all sugars, starches and dairy yet again. Those 'cheats' I guess were making me feel less deprived. I wasn't doing any of them in excess, still under 50-75g of carbs a day, but I know deep down they are not helpful to long term healing.


          Originally posted by GoJenGo
          Which veggies have you found yourself able to tolerate? Ive had luck with spinach, romaine, zucchini, celery, and pumpkin so far. I doubt I'll even get gutsy enough to attempt fruit!
          My main veggies sound just like you. I also do cooked tomatoes (small amount of raw), carrots, peppers, jalapenos, small amounts of cucumber, spaghetti squash, and that's about it (I am testing mushrooms again). I don't seem to have an obvious reaction to the nightshades, or at least not that I know of. I was a little disappointed to find sweet potatoes just don't work for me.

          I still cook with onions and garlic on occasion, like for soups....I soften them in the pan on their own and then put them in a couple layers of cheese cloth to cook down in my dish. Its a pain, but at least it keeps the flavors of my recipes pretty much the same.
          Erin
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          • #6
            I think I will increase my bone broth consumption, and I definitely need to work on getting liver in my diet from a nutrient standpoint (thanks for the ideas!). After this 'clean 30' challenge I will get back on my yogurt regime, maybe add some digestive enzymes, and just bombard my system again.....see how that goes.
            Erin
            Daily Vlogs
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            • #7
              I'm in a similar boat, except I can't even figure out what's causing my bloating and inflammation - I am gluten/dairy/legume free, and I just finished a 2 week elimination diet where I didn't eat ANY fodmaps, not even the allowable ones, just in case. 2 weeks of meat and fish only, and I am no closer to figuring out what's bothering me. I'm starting to think it's not even food related, since it seems that I'm almost always bloated, with the occasional day that I'm not. I'm really at a loss at this point, and contemplating doing something even more drastic, like a 10 day fast or something. If it doesn't go away after not eating, then at least I'll know it can't be from food!

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              • #8
                I've heard that supplements of the amino acid Glutamine can be helpful for repairing the gut, but I have no personal experience yet. Not sure if I can post links, but I generally like this site and they have some info : WHFoods: glutamine . I've been FODMAPing for several months now and it's been great (done along with some elements of 'food combining', lots of water and taking 8 citrucel pills a day). Haven't wanted to mess things up by taking a supplement, but it's on my 'to try' list when I'm ready to move on to the healing phase.

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                • #9
                  Ugh, bestbetter, one person on this forum only ended bloating with a 3 day fast. On the fourth day she had chicken bone broth, and bloated. !!!

                  I think FODMAPS avoidance is just symptom-avoidance. I do think that leaky gut is at the root and that there is hope for being able to tolerate them again. I need to find someone who has had success with this. I know Chris Kesser says he has seen some.
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by BestBetter View Post
                    I'm in a similar boat, except I can't even figure out what's causing my bloating and inflammation - I am gluten/dairy/legume free, and I just finished a 2 week elimination diet where I didn't eat ANY fodmaps, not even the allowable ones, just in case. 2 weeks of meat and fish only, and I am no closer to figuring out what's bothering me. I'm starting to think it's not even food related, since it seems that I'm almost always bloated, with the occasional day that I'm not. I'm really at a loss at this point, and contemplating doing something even more drastic, like a 10 day fast or something. If it doesn't go away after not eating, then at least I'll know it can't be from food!
                    Hmmm....BestBetter, did you ever find out what caused your bloating?
                    So you were still bloated on animal meats only?
                    Were you gassy?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Alykat View Post
                      Hmmm....BestBetter, did you ever find out what caused your bloating?
                      So you were still bloated on animal meats only?
                      Were you gassy?
                      Ah, it's always fun to revisit old posts and see how much has changed. Really good for perspective!

                      At that point, when I was doing elimination diets like crazy, intermittent fasting, and in general digestive misery, I could never figure out the trigger. Now that I'm healed, and having figured out that one of my IBS triggers is eating too much in a meal, I think that likely my problem at that point was that I was fasting for a day or two, then eating one huge meal, which my system couldn't deal with, in conjunction with having messed up gut flora and chronic inflammation.

                      EDIT: Another possible issue for me during those elimination diet phases was that I was still eating high histamine containing/producing foods, which I'm now suspecting to be a problem for me.

                      I remember that in my desperation to heal my IBS, I even went fruitarian for a couple of days, just to see if meat could be causing my issues...those were the worst 3 days of my life. I went from chronic constipation with gas and bloating to a whole new level of digestive hell...there aren't even words to describe the toxic stench I was emitting! I don't know who can live on a 100% fruit diet, but there is no doubt that it's not me.

                      It just goes to show that even when things seem bleakest, like there's no hope for an impossible situation (which is how I definitely felt at that point), we always have the ability to heal and make improvements as long as we don't give up.
                      Last edited by BestBetter; 11-10-2012, 05:42 PM.

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                      • #12
                        How did you heal...I'm in the middle of a health crisis...chronic inflammation from who knows where, histamine and salicylate intolerance...can only eat peas, bananas, green beans, and meat. I'm in hell
                        I used to eat cashew butter, but for the last several months I have been going as low pufa as possible...I've had so many tests done, but they all come back relatively normal. Though a urine test I had done said I have slight yeast issues and fuminisn infection(fungus) and all my antioxidants are low or non existant despite taking supplements...not sure how accurate hormone tests are, but my estrogen was quite low(but ray peat doesn't think these tests are accurate) please help!

                        Originally posted by BestBetter View Post
                        Ah, it's always fun to revisit old posts and see how much has changed. Really good for perspective!

                        At that point, when I was doing elimination diets like crazy, intermittent fasting, and in general digestive misery, I could never figure out the trigger. Now that I'm healed, and having figured out that one of my IBS triggers is eating too much in a meal, I think that likely my problem at that point was that I was fasting for a day or two, then eating one huge meal, which my system couldn't deal with, in conjunction with having messed up gut flora and chronic inflammation.

                        I remember that in my desperation to heal my IBS, I even went fruitarian for a couple of days, just to see if meat could be causing my issues...those were the worst 3 days of my life. I went from chronic constipation with gas and bloating to a whole new level of digestive hell...there aren't even words to describe the toxic stench I was emitting! I don't know who can live on a 100% fruit diet, but there is no doubt that it's not me.

                        It just goes to show that even when things seem bleakest, like there's no hope for an impossible situation (which is how I definitely felt at that point), we always have the ability to heal and make improvements as long as we don't give up.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by snoopy View Post
                          How did you heal...I'm in the middle of a health crisis...chronic inflammation from who knows where, histamine and salicylate intolerance...can only eat peas, bananas, green beans, and meat. I'm in hell
                          I used to eat cashew butter, but for the last several months I have been going as low pufa as possible...I've had so many tests done, but they all come back relatively normal. Though a urine test I had done said I have slight yeast issues and fuminisn infection(fungus) and all my antioxidants are low or non existant despite taking supplements...not sure how accurate hormone tests are, but my estrogen was quite low(but ray peat doesn't think these tests are accurate) please help!
                          Hi Snoopy,

                          I've written some pretty extensive posts on my epic journey to recover and heal from a bunch of weird health issues that never seem to make much sense, I have several on this thread:

                          http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread62278.html

                          BTW, I am a big fan of Ray Peat, even though I disagree with some of his views and recommendations. But, I have substantially increased my intake of actual sugar (no HFCS!) and starches (so what I'm doing is more like a high sugar version of the Perfect Health Diet).

                          I don't have all the answers, and I'm certainly not a doctor, but I'm happy to share what worked for me. Unfortunately, my answers my not be yours, and it may take a long time, but you will figure it out. Anyway, if you have any questions, feel free to send a PM, I wouldn't want to hijack anyone's thread .
                          Last edited by BestBetter; 11-10-2012, 05:45 PM.

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                          • #14
                            Thank you! I might be sending you some questions...

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                            • #15
                              Everyone in this thread: take a look at healing your adrenals. Food sensitivities and candida are only a symptom of something bigger.

                              Licorice root powder, vitamin C, a very good B multivitamin (B#6 from Thorne Research is great); Chris Kresser had a podcast recently discussing adrenal fatigue and he recommended some products.

                              Adrenal Fatigue, Glutathione Status, and Rheumatoid Arthritis

                              I also second the l-glutamine supplementation. I healed a years worth of dermatitis around my nose and mouth in about a month taking an upwards of 20 grams per day. Don't OD on the stuff though! You'll experience severe abdominal cramping like never before if you do!
                              A Post-Primal PrimalPat

                              Do not allow yourself to become wrapped up in a food 'lifestyle'. That is ego, and you are not that.

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