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  • #16
    1



    "Why assume that ZC is anything but better than VLC?"


    Because assumptions are weak. Show me some evidence that ZC is superior to VLC or LC.


    Rob, there's no reason for you to go ZC unless you find that it feels best for you.


    Repeat to yourself over and over that there's no one ideal diet. If you look into modern Hunter-Gatherer diets, which are possible approximations of what a "real" paleolithic diet might have looked like, you'll find a huge range of carb intake can result in good health.


    Focus on the really important stuff: ditch the sugar and wheat, and focus on getting enough fat and protein. Eat veggies and small amounts of fruit as you prefer. And stop worrying about what others are doing. Listen to your body instead.

    Comment


    • #17
      1



      Rob, unless you are a lifeguard, consider reading up on vitamin D before refusing to supplement. It is a special case. You could consider taking vitamin D as replacement rather than supplementation. Food has never been a very good source of vitamin D. We're supposed to get vitamin D from the sun, but modern lifestyles rarely allow for enough sun exposure to meet our needs.


      Michael Holick's talk is a good start, and he's really funny too.


      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cq1t9WqOD-0

      Comment


      • #18
        1



        the dry skin might be related to the dry winter weather...

        Comment


        • #19
          1



          You won't need any vitamin D supplements on ZC:
          [quote]

          catastrophic vitamin D deficiency can be largely be ameliorated by eating meat</blockquote>


          http://high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.c...uations-2.html

          The "Seven Deadly Sins"

          Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
          Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
          Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

          Comment


          • #20
            1

            [quote]


            You say you exercise (hard) 3 days a week followed by 3 T bone steaks (zero BF and Lunch)

            Please can you tell me what you consume on NON workout days (dont just say I eat when I&#39;m hungry) please elaborate and give examples...
            </blockquote>


            An typical example of a 3 day cycle would be:


            Day before workout:

            B: coffee

            L: nil

            D: 2lb of pork chops, some jerky.


            Day of workout

            B: coffee

            L: nil

            4pm: Workout for 50 mins

            D: 2lb+ of steak, jerky, whatever else is laying around


            Day after workout

            B: 6-8 hard boiled eggs

            S: Jerky

            L: Large tin of tuna/salmon maybe some leftover sausages

            S: Jerky

            D: 2lb of lamb chops, whatever else I can find


            ... and repeat

            The "Seven Deadly Sins"

            Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
            Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
            Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

            Comment


            • #21
              1



              Tarlach, we watched Man Vs. Food last night (instead of the siperbowl--we&#39;re not really into football) and the host&#39;s challenge was to eat a 48 oz steak in 20 minutes. I thought of you, and told my husband, &#39;I know someone online who could totally do that!&#39;


              (Not that competitive eating is something good/to aspire to, just saying, I bet you *could* if you wanted to/were hungry enough!)

              Comment


              • #22
                1



                Probably

                The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                Comment


                • #23
                  1



                  That&#39;s awesome.


                  I once ate a 2.5lb hunk of london broil. Best dinner I ever had.


                  As far as VLC or ZC... I typically eat VLC, with an occasional day in the 100-150g range.


                  I tried Zero Carb for a while, but I didn&#39;t like it. Wasn&#39;t for me. Nor do I see all that much evidence for it in our natural history. Food was eaten as food was available - I take that to heart when I make my dietary choices.


                  Some cultures have done zero carb, most of the time, though I wonder at how a people who REALLY have to use every part of the animal would handle stomach contents.. I think if you&#39;re eating every part of an animal for sustenance, you&#39;re going to be getting some level of carbohydrate.


                  At any rate: try zero carb, and if you like it, then do it. I do not believe that it is necessarily &#39;evolutionarily&#39; superior, and &#39;in the wild&#39; zero carb is an exception rather than a norm.


                  I&#39;m not saying its bad (though a couple of the zero carb blogs out there that I have seen, the authors have developed some interesting health issues, rashes, edema.. no thanks), but don&#39;t feel you HAVE to do it, by any stretch of the imagination.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    1



                    Tarlach, not true re: vitamin D. Go watch the Holick talk I linked to above.


                    Note that Peter said "catastrophic" vitamin D deficiency is prevented by eating meat. The paper he&#39;s talking about refers to rickets and osteomalacia, which are the classic vitamin D deficiency disorders.


                    He did NOT say eating meat will get you optimal levels of vitamin D, because it won&#39;t. He does say it is probably wise to aim for the upper end of normal, and suggests that meat plus UVB exposure is a reasonable strategy for getting there.


                    The consequences of subclinical vitamin D deficiency are just beginning to be recognized. It appears that vitamin D sufficiency is very important for healthy immune system function, and has implications for all sorts of disease conditions, from infectious disease to autoimmune disease, to cancer.


                    ZCs with plenty of sun exposure may not need additional vitamin D, but that&#39;s also true for VLC, LC, and SAD. For evidence-based vitamin D recommendations, check out the vitamin D council website.


                    http://www.vitamindcouncil.org/

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      1

                      [quote]

                      For evidence-based vitamin D recommendations, check out the vitamin D council website</blockquote>


                      Because they are so impartial?


                      You can&#39;t even get measured for vitamin D available in the body (only what is in the blood), so the standard test is rubbish anyway.

                      The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                      Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                      Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                      Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        1



                        Tarlach, what do you mean, impartial? Do you think they&#39;re in this for money? ROFL. There&#39;s no money in vitamin D. The Vitamin D Council is about preventive medicine.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          1



                          It is a fairly cheap supplement, to be fair - I&#39;ve been taking 20,000 IUs daily, and my supply is $20 for almost 3 months.


                          As far as supplements go, it would be more profitable to trick people into down other roads.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            1

                            [quote]

                            Tarlach, what do you mean, impartial? Do you think they&#39;re in this for money? ROFL. There&#39;s no money in vitamin D. The Vitamin D Council is about preventive medicine.
                            </blockquote>


                            Yeah they don&#39;t get paid or get grants or have to justify their existence or anything.


                            CSPI are apparently all about preventive medicine too.


                            The Heart Foundation in Australia are another department trying to &#39;help everyone out&#39; with crap science and misleading information.

                            The "Seven Deadly Sins"

                            Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . . Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
                            Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
                            Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              1



                              How does that invalidate the D Council&#39;s arguments? No one&#39;s saying supplementation is required; they&#39;re simply saying Vitamin D - however one obtains it - is important, even vital. Do you dispute that?


                              Europeans have fair skin for a reason.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                1



                                Tarlach - BIG + 111111111111111111111111 Sweet BT ,, Best M8 ...plan to try this for 3 months and increase my lift weights.


                                Rich

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