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  • Originally posted by breadsauce View Post
    Actually, I care about Paleobird's medical texts - usually properly researched and therefore very much more valid than anecdote.

    My concerns about pushing these very high levels of iodine intake - and from many of the anecdotal "cures" that you have reported, Grizz, it appears that SHORT TERM high dosage use has improved health for some people - I worry that LONG TERM use will undermine health - possibly severely.

    And I don't care about the Brownstein protocol at all - I prefer the more measured approach of Dr Gaby.

    And please stop calling people who disagree with you trolls - cori, paleobird, radial head etc could just as easily (and justifiably) accuse you of troll activity.
    Originally posted by Hawkward View Post
    They aren't "trolling this thread" any more than you are. You sir do not own this thread, and therefore do not get to decide who posts here. I for one welcome other points of view. If you don't, then gosh, I guess that's just tough. This is a message board.
    Those "renegades", eh, Grizz? Tough to keep em in line.

    Originally posted by Quarry View Post
    Is Grizz joking? His behaviour is so crazy I can't tell if it is an inside joke!
    Or is he actually taking the piss about this Dr?
    Or just obsessed with iodine and deluded this is his thread and his mission and he must lead the masses?
    But it is an inside joke, right?
    I wish it were a joke. It sure looks like one. I do believe that Grizz is sincere in his desire to help people but that he is listening to a few very questionable sources as if they were the word of god in his ear.

    Originally posted by breadsauce View Post
    t2t, you are one of the ones I mean when I say that the high supplementation has helped some on this thread - you obviously feel that this regime has saved your life, and I think that this is wonderful.

    But I do feel that many (most?) will be able to see benefits on smaller doses. My N=1 is that on a single drop of Lugol's 3%, three times a week, I seem to be benefiting. Yesterday I realised that I now have NO psoriasis on my body AT ALL. It improved a lot when I began primal almost 3 years ago. I think that D3, vitamin K mk 4 and 7, and iodine have all had an effect.
    I vote for breadsauce as the new king of this thread!

    But seriously, this brings up an important point. Confounding variables. Many of us are changing our diets and lives in many ways at once as we adopt the primal lifestyle. It's hard to isolate one variable and say, "The iodine cured me". That is simplistic. Sure iodine is a part of a healthy diet. All those other factors are at work too.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
      Ferti,

      Haw Haw that was the funniest thing I've seen all week, calling her Yuckbird !


      Grizz
      How pathetic. Whose the Troll now?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Grizz View Post
        Ferti,

        Haw Haw that was the funniest thing I've seen all week, calling her Yuckbird !


        Grizz
        How pathetic. If childish, abusive name calling is "the funniest thing I've seen all week", you're in a really bad way.

        Iodine overdose, perhaps?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by t2t View Post
          Hi Breadsauce,

          This is great to hear that your psoriasis has abated…!

          BTW K2 mk4 is wonderful for the skin also! One to
          3 MILLIgrams a day seems to work great for many people
          across the net and with a tad (micrograms) of K2 mk7 too
          from blogs I have read.

          t2t
          Thanks! I haven't been taking the Vitamin K mk4 / 7 very long, but either it, vitamin D3 or my low doses of Iodine have worked wonders on the last, stubborn outposts of psoriasis.

          I also think my age spots on hands are lessening - although, it could just be that a developing tan is hiding them!

          Comment


          • Why the hell are the pro-low dose iodine group belittling/mocking/degrading the pro-high dose iodine group and vice versa. Can we stop bitching about other people and stick to just talking about iodine and your experience on it. If you want to try iodine but are worried about taking it in too high a dose then stick to very small amounts of it, tell us if you get any benefits from it, I'd love to read about that. If you want to go higher because of an illness or something feel free to try that too, lots of people have positive experiences from doing that as well, just know the problems that could potentially arise. Its not like this thread has kept the hazards of high iodine dosing a secret, for example in Grizz's first post on the front page is a big picture of a rash. Why all the hate between the two camps? Like vegans vs paleo, we agree that iodine is great but you are a horrible person and will kill yourself because you believe you need to take iodine in a high/low amounts.

            For me, I've seen great improvements in my menstrual cycle because of my iodine supplementation. For the first time ever this month I had no painful menstrual cramping. I've been taking iodine + the supplements for almost 3 months and i had some painful cramping in the first two months and I was supplementing with very low dose, about 0.5-4mg of iodine. Now, I've worked up to 12.5mg a my menstrual pain is gone. Some might tell me I'm too high, omg that's so unnatural I'm going to die, but I feel much better than before. I probably won't go any higher since I don't think I have a need for that much but that's up to me to decide. If I feel anything negative then I'll mention it, and I'd hope anyone else following this thread would mention their benefits/side effects so we all can be informed on peoples experiences on iodine whether that be in a high/low dose.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by lizzychan5 View Post
              Why the hell are the pro-low dose iodine group belittling/mocking/degrading the pro-high dose iodine group and vice versa. Can we stop bitching about other people and stick to just talking about iodine and your experience on it. If you want to try iodine but are worried about taking it in too high a dose then stick to very small amounts of it, tell us if you get any benefits from it, I'd love to read about that. If you want to go higher because of an illness or something feel free to try that too, lots of people have positive experiences from doing that as well, just know the problems that could potentially arise. Its not like this thread has kept the hazards of high iodine dosing a secret, for example in Grizz's first post on the front page is a big picture of a rash. Why all the hate between the two camps? Like vegans vs paleo, we agree that iodine is great but you are a horrible person and will kill yourself because you believe you need to take iodine in a high/low amounts.

              For me, I've seen great improvements in my menstrual cycle because of my iodine supplementation. For the first time ever this month I had no painful menstrual cramping. I've been taking iodine + the supplements for almost 3 months and i had some painful cramping in the first two months and I was supplementing with very low dose, about 0.5-4mg of iodine. Now, I've worked up to 12.5mg a my menstrual pain is gone. Some might tell me I'm too high, omg that's so unnatural I'm going to die, but I feel much better than before. I probably won't go any higher since I don't think I have a need for that much but that's up to me to decide. If I feel anything negative then I'll mention it, and I'd hope anyone else following this thread would mention their benefits/side effects so we all can be informed on peoples experiences on iodine whether that be in a high/low dose.
              Finally, the first sensible post in this pissing match. Everybody should decide which course of dosing is best for them. My prostrate is broken from before my stroke, worsened by my stroke. It was improved with the much maligned testicle painting. Now I am trying the high dose to see if I can get an erection again. Anyone want to criticize me? Thank you Lizzy.
              Learning the intricacies of healthy eating and nourishing my body the right way.
              I am not bald, that is a Vitamin D collector. Time to Grok and Roll!
              Eased into a primal diet starting at Christmas 2011. Goal weight - 205 started: 240 pounds waist 40, now 227 pounds and waist 38 Summer 2012 - weight =215 and waist is actually still 39"
              ljbprrfmof = LJ = Little John = John

              Comment


              • Originally posted by lizzychan5 View Post
                Why the hell are the pro-low dose iodine group belittling/mocking/degrading the pro-high dose iodine group and vice versa. Can we stop bitching about other people and stick to just talking about iodine and your experience on it. If you want to try iodine but are worried about taking it in too high a dose then stick to very small amounts of it, tell us if you get any benefits from it, I'd love to read about that. If you want to go higher because of an illness or something feel free to try that too, lots of people have positive experiences from doing that as well, just know the problems that could potentially arise. Its not like this thread has kept the hazards of high iodine dosing a secret, for example in Grizz's first post on the front page is a big picture of a rash. Why all the hate between the two camps? Like vegans vs paleo, we agree that iodine is great but you are a horrible person and will kill yourself because you believe you need to take iodine in a high/low amounts.

                For me, I've seen great improvements in my menstrual cycle because of my iodine supplementation. For the first time ever this month I had no painful menstrual cramping. I've been taking iodine + the supplements for almost 3 months and i had some painful cramping in the first two months and I was supplementing with very low dose, about 0.5-4mg of iodine. Now, I've worked up to 12.5mg a my menstrual pain is gone. Some might tell me I'm too high, omg that's so unnatural I'm going to die, but I feel much better than before. I probably won't go any higher since I don't think I have a need for that much but that's up to me to decide. If I feel anything negative then I'll mention it, and I'd hope anyone else following this thread would mention their benefits/side effects so we all can be informed on peoples experiences on iodine whether that be in a high/low dose.
                I'm looking hard for these 'potential problems' of high dosages, and they do not appear to be readily accessible other than cryptic comments to see your doctor (presumably so he can talk you down off the cliff), all presented within a subtext of 'ignore your doctor, they don't know anything'.
                Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

                Griff's cholesterol primer
                5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
                Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
                TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
                bloodorchid is always right

                Comment


                • Originally posted by lizzychan5 View Post
                  Why the hell are the pro-low dose iodine group belittling/mocking/degrading the pro-high dose iodine group and vice versa. Can we stop bitching about other people and stick to just talking about iodine and your experience on it. If you want to try iodine but are worried about taking it in too high a dose then stick to very small amounts of it, tell us if you get any benefits from it, I'd love to read about that. If you want to go higher because of an illness or something feel free to try that too, lots of people have positive experiences from doing that as well, just know the problems that could potentially arise. Its not like this thread has kept the hazards of high iodine dosing a secret, for example in Grizz's first post on the front page is a big picture of a rash. Why all the hate between the two camps? Like vegans vs paleo, we agree that iodine is great but you are a horrible person and will kill yourself because you believe you need to take iodine in a high/low amounts.

                  For me, I've seen great improvements in my menstrual cycle because of my iodine supplementation. For the first time ever this month I had no painful menstrual cramping. I've been taking iodine + the supplements for almost 3 months and i had some painful cramping in the first two months and I was supplementing with very low dose, about 0.5-4mg of iodine. Now, I've worked up to 12.5mg a my menstrual pain is gone. Some might tell me I'm too high, omg that's so unnatural I'm going to die, but I feel much better than before. I probably won't go any higher since I don't think I have a need for that much but that's up to me to decide. If I feel anything negative then I'll mention it, and I'd hope anyone else following this thread would mention their benefits/side effects so we all can be informed on peoples experiences on iodine whether that be in a high/low dose.
                  That was highly edited by Grizz a few days ago. He has been telling people throughout this thread that they must do it his way (a la Brownstein) or the highway. And even saying that he would laugh at them when they developed serious complications and were taken to the hospital. Nice, right?

                  I think it's great to get the discussion back on a more even keel where people can discuss their individual experiences and make up their own minds. You can choose to get your iodine via foods as I do or choose supplementation at a level that suits you.

                  The thing that people need to be aware of is that most people, despite what Brownstein who is trying to sell you books and supps would have you believe, don't have a huge problem with iodine deficiency and that a very small amount is sufficient. If people are taking larger doses for specific medical conditions with a doctor monitoring them, great. If they are doing n=1 with a potentially lethal substance just because some ranting individual with a very tenuous grasp on reality on an MDA thread said to, that is a problem.

                  I'm glad you are feeling better.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
                    I'm looking hard for these 'potential problems' of high dosages, and they do not appear to be readily accessible other than cryptic comments to see your doctor (presumably so he can talk you down off the cliff), all presented within a subtext of 'ignore your doctor, they don't know anything'.
                    Are you serious? I was mentioning this, you must of skimmed passed it.

                    THIS COULD BE YOU IF YOU TAKE TOO MUCH IODINE TOO SOON:

                    Photo of Bromide Detox from excessive bromide toxins being released into the bloodstream.
                    If you don't understand what Grizz was getting at, he was trying to say this: If you take too much iodine too soon without the recommended supplements you may get this rash.

                    No one says you have to take so much iodine to give you that rash, no one is telling you to take iodine at all. It was a warning if you wanted to try iodine, and there are potential problems that might arise if you take iodine.
                    Last edited by lizzychan5; 07-23-2012, 02:17 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
                      I'm looking hard for these 'potential problems' of high dosages, and they do not appear to be readily accessible other than cryptic comments to see your doctor (presumably so he can talk you down off the cliff), all presented within a subtext of 'ignore your doctor, they don't know anything'.
                      Several posts have been made recently that have noted some of the problems with high doses of iodine in addition to the rashes etc, one of those issues is the fact that it can actually cause one to become hypothyroid.

                      I've never advocated the alarmist stance that taking the large doses is going to necessarily cause someone to keel over, but toxicity symptoms have been noted at even moderate "high" dosages, and messing about with ones thyroid with no idea of your starting levels or the effect of the supplement on the levels subsequently seems pretty risky to me.

                      I think that T2T's most recent post says it best when he references having blood panels taken to monitor TSH and T3/T4 while supplementing at higher dosages.
                      “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                      ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                      And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by lizzychan5 View Post
                        Are you serious? I was mentioning this, you must of skimmed passed it.



                        If you don't understand what Grizz was getting at, he was trying to say this: If you take too much iodine too soon without the recommended supplements you may get this rash.

                        No one says you have to take so much iodine to give you that rash, no one is telling you to take iodine at all. It was a warning if you wanted to try iodine, and there are potential problems that might arise if you take iodine.
                        NO !! NOT this photo again! It proves nothing - NOTHING. I have photos of my arms looking like that from midge bites. And if it IS from iodine - it could just as easily be from an overdose as from bromide detox.

                        And - Lizzy - you are now saying what I have been saying for many posts. This thread IS important - and we have to have room for those who want to take large doses, and those (like me) who want to take small.

                        It is ONLY Grizz who INSISTS we all have to take HUGE doses. I really think the rest of us tend to agree - go with what suits you.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                          That was highly edited by Grizz a few days ago. He has been telling people throughout this thread that they must do it his way (a la Brownstein) or the highway. And even saying that he would laugh at them when they developed serious complications and were taken to the hospital. Nice, right?

                          I think it's great to get the discussion back on a more even keel where people can discuss their individual experiences and make up their own minds. You can choose to get your iodine via foods as I do or choose supplementation at a level that suits you.

                          The thing that people need to be aware of is that most people, despite what Brownstein who is trying to sell you books and supps would have you believe, don't have a huge problem with iodine deficiency and that a very small amount is sufficient. If people are taking larger doses for specific medical conditions with a doctor monitoring them, great. If they are doing n=1 with a potentially lethal substance just because some ranting individual with a very tenuous grasp on reality on an MDA thread said to, that is a problem.

                          I'm glad you are feeling better.

                          Again, the voice of reason. Thanks, Paleobird. You stop me despairing!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                            That was highly edited by Grizz a few days ago. He has been telling people throughout this thread that they must do it his way (a la Brownstein) or the highway. And even saying that he would laugh at them when they developed serious complications and were taken to the hospital. Nice, right?

                            I think it's great to get the discussion back on a more even keel where people can discuss their individual experiences and make up their own minds. You can choose to get your iodine via foods as I do or choose supplementation at a level that suits you.

                            The thing that people need to be aware of is that most people, despite what Brownstein who is trying to sell you books and supps would have you believe, don't have a huge problem with iodine deficiency and that a very small amount is sufficient. If people are taking larger doses for specific medical conditions with a doctor monitoring them, great. If they are doing n=1 with a potentially lethal substance just because some ranting individual with a very tenuous grasp on reality on an MDA thread said to, that is a problem.

                            I'm glad you are feeling better.
                            When I started reading this thread 3 months ago that post looked like that, and I've read this whole thread. Grizz edited it a few days ago just to fix the disclaimer.

                            It must be nice to live in an area near the ocean where iodine rich foods is plentiful, and you don't have to worry about it. I live in the Midwest, this area very well known for being extremely iodine deficient, people here have to relay mostly on just iodized salt. Iodine rich seafood that's wild caught is very expensive to get shipped here. I don't take iodized salt because I believe its bad for me, I don't consume much fish because its so costly, so my typical diet is extremely iodine lacking. A bottle of lugol's plus the supplements is very cheap in comparison. Not so long ago a large amount of the population around here suffered from goiter.

                            I've read this whole thread and I have yet to read of one person needing to go to the hospital because of iodine. If there was such a person, I'd hope they'd share their story so we don't follow what they did that landed them in the hospital. I have read a lot of people taking large doses of iodine and not experiencing any problems, that doesn't mean a problem can't arise. If there was someone who just jumped right in and took a high dose of iodine all by itself with no supplements probably will have a serious side effect and need to go to the hospital, but no one recommends that. Its always been go very very slow, take the recommended supplements, back off if you notice a problem. And again, if your scared to take iodine then don't, stick to iodine in food-only. If someone would want to try to supplement Grizz has laid out a nice safe way to slowly do so.

                            Please, can we stop with all the negativity and talk about your experience on iodine, if you even have any.

                            Comment


                            • But Lizzy, if you've read the thread you will have seen several people (myself included) who use SMALL amounts of iodine - with excellent results. I agree with some of what you say - this thread should be for small and large dose iodine users. Let's see what the results are and who benefits from what.

                              I HAVE had a problem with some of the supplements; salt specifically. My blood pressure shot up over only 3 weeks - from 115/75 for YEARS to 150 / 115. And the only thing I have changed is - salt loading. Not for me, any more. It is plain dangerous - for me.

                              Any one else have bad results from supps?

                              Comment


                              • I cannot consume any salt due to medical reasons...

                                And I have a know history of severe reaction to B3 (ATP Cofactors = 100mg B2, 500mg B3) at even a moderate dose (the flushing- red itchy face/chest, complete with dizzyness, sudden drops in my BP which is already very low, and heart palpitations, nausea)... so I won't take that in any but the smallest amounts found in a normal multivitamin. NIACIN AND NIACINAMIDE VITAMIN B3: Uses, Side Effects, Interactions and Warnings - WebMD
                                Last edited by cori93437; 07-23-2012, 04:00 PM.
                                “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                                ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                                And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                                Comment

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