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  • PAYSAN, What an interesting story. I too have had good and bad experiences with doctors. I am lucky to be alive as I got to the e-room with hours to live before they gave me oxygen, stablized me, then put a replacement aorta valve in my heart. The doctor told me that held my heart in his hand and he got a good look at it. He said there were no blockages, just the bad valve. He also said the defect was congenital and could have gone bad any time, but this was perfect because I was in my early 40s and could handle the operation and the rehab better. A little older, maybe not as well, a little younger and the technology was not there.

    It has left me with the need for warafin. In May, when I was newly without insurance, I unabashodly told my doctor I was only going to pay for one blood test to control the warafin. They told me get it done or find anew doctor.(Myway or the highway!) So as I was contemplating which way to go, 2 days latter, I got a registered letter I had to sign for. My office discharged me and made up excuses to base it on. So that has been the bad. It has all been since I came onto MDA that I have been a rebel. In the 18 month's since my stroke, I have seen the insides of too many hospital rooms. But since December when I had a meeting with my nuerologist, they put me on Actos, which made me incintinent and did nothing to control my fasting blood glucose, I quit it after finding the primal balance. My diabetes doc was fine with that and gave me permission to wean myself from Januvia. I am almost finished with that. So I have done nothing that has not been agreed upon by a doctor. My cholesterol was high, a(after starting on Primal Balance of course) I refused the statins. But this is not the first time I have refused them. I started taking cold(ish) showers, and that brought a need for less blood pressure medicine and for smaller pants.

    All the changes in my life in the past 7 1/2 months are because I knew there was a natural food based solution to my type ii diabetes. That brought me to MDA. And for those pushing Grizz's buttons, I made the decision consciously and without the help of a knowledgeable doctor. Hmm, I am thinking jumbo shrimp and army intelligence. Most people are on this thread because they are seeking a better way to their own health. I like to think they are intelligent based on the way they write. Based on Grizz's discoveries, I am feeling better than I have in years. So I can't fault his Paul Revere style. I have been their way before and have created that kind of rhetoric and hubbub for my own entertainment or bemusement. Whatever their motivation, I find it boorish when two obvious well meaning folks start sniping at each other. Yeah Grizz has his style, so what. If you don't like it, send a private message. Airing dirty laundry like this makes everybody look poorly to outsiders and I think colors the participants on both sides poorly. So if an iodine newbie should get the wrong impression, both sides are at fault. But Grizz has spent more time looking stuff up than almost everybody on here. I get time to read half of the links he posts. I dare anyone to meet the dedication he has put into this thread. Be nice people.

    Okay, ramble into a rambling rant over.

    LJ
    Learning the intricacies of healthy eating and nourishing my body the right way.
    I am not bald, that is a Vitamin D collector. Time to Grok and Roll!
    Eased into a primal diet starting at Christmas 2011. Goal weight - 205 started: 240 pounds waist 40, now 227 pounds and waist 38 Summer 2012 - weight =215 and waist is actually still 39"
    ljbprrfmof = LJ = Little John = John

    Comment


    • Well John, I was considerably older than you when my first heart attack occurred, but this was about a decade after a paralysing stroke put me in hospital for many weeks of recovery and therapy. That was my first experience with statins and blood thinners, each covered by our medical insurance, each discarded by me within short order by undesirable side effects. Since then, I've had a couple more heart attacks, obviously non-fatal (!) and the doc has prepared me to die any time. However, I went low carb over a decade ago and peeled off an unnecessary 80 lbs (gained back 12), and have always supplemented extensively. I have also tried various n=1 experiments, including my current iodine and leptin reset protocols. Oh yes, and icing my oversize love handles as a form of CT.! So if I fall silent on these lists, you'll know my experiments ended badly. And it won't be anyone's fault except mine. What is it they say? Too soon old, too late smart? That's me.

      Comment


      • Hi Paysan,

        Taking 8,000 IU’s to 10,000 IU’s of D3 at night only, in the last few months, has caused me to lose a total of 25 lbs. I had become Diabetic type 2 in 2010. My A1C was at 7.1. Not only has the D3 dropped my triglycerides to 125 but my A1C has now dropped to 6.1. One tenth away from the top-end of normal. Taking 10000 IU’s will bring me back to normal in a couple more weeks. I take magnesium malate and spray magnesium oil everyday too. I take K2-mk4 one MILLIgram, 3 times a day with a teaspoon of coconut oil. My wife uses olive oil in place of the coconut oil. K2-mk4 WILL force calcium into your teeth and bones where it belongs out of your arteries. (Note: if you are on blood thinners try and wait till you finish them before you start K2 therapy). Stay the course with the iodine and selenomethionine if you can.

        This is my personal experience and I am just sharing some of my protocol.

        Godspeed to some good health for you!

        P.S. I am working on getting my HDL above 30. I know I need B12 5000mcgs a day with B6 and folic acid. The magic bullet is TMG which I just received in the mail earlier today, and it is taunted to amplify B12, B6 and folic acid in a profound way to raise HDL. Have noticed a surge of energy after taking it, within 45 minutes! The energy lasted most of the day... I have taken B12 in the past and never felt it.

        t2t

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Gwynn View Post
          Princess,

          Can you point the way to the info posted regarding thyroid meds preventing iodine from getting into our cells? I looked and couldn't find it.

          Thanks,
          Gwynn

          "Thyroid Hormones and Iodine. If you take supplemental thyroid hormones, you inhibit the ability of the body to absorb iodine. That is why they recommend to patients about to received radioactive-iodine scans that they go off all thyroid hormones for two to three weeks prior to the scan. Women who take thyroid hormones have a much higher risk of breast cancer than other women."

          Post #3444 by Grizz

          Then I edited this post to add this paragraph contained in the link from that original post:

          "The thyroid hormones are synthesized in the follicular cells of the thyroid. The first step to hormonesynthesis is the import of iodide into the follicular cells. Thyroid hormone regulates mitochondrial protein synthesis through the stimulation of synthesis of mitochondrial protein synthesis modulators, and that the tissue specific modulators (stimulatory in liver and inhibitory in kidney) can be produced by the hormone.[xiv] Whole body iodine sufficiency is a critical means to counter the side effects of thyroid hormone medications (Synthroid, etc.). Long-term use of these drugs is associated with depletion of thyroid and tissue iodine levels, as well as increased rates of cancer. All thyroid patients should be on iodine therapy."

          http://www.life-enthusiast.com/index...ersal_Medicine
          Last edited by DuhPrincess; 07-19-2012, 12:47 AM. Reason: Added a link and a quote for clarification

          Comment


          • I'm going on a weekend trip to visit our son & grandson in their new house.

            Don't let the TROLLS disrupt this great thread while I am away.

            Grizz

            Comment


            • @ Grizz - that is an unnecessarily inflammatory remark. It's about time you worked out what a troll is and realise that there aren't any on this thread - just some people who have opinions which aren't necessarily the same as yours. That doesn't make anyone a troll.
              Last edited by breadsauce; 07-19-2012, 03:00 AM.

              Comment


              • Latest iodine skin patch test update (if anyone is interested!) . Painted a one inch patch at 10.00 a.m yesterday. When I went to bed at 10.00 pm, it was still clearly visible, and this morning at 7.30 there was still a very faint remnant - a sort of discoloured shadow. This is on one drop of Lugol's 3% three times a week in water, with brazil nuts, D3 and K2 as supplements.

                I am fortunate not to have any of the problems which a lot of people on this thread have, and which they have been taking large doses of iodine for, so haven't felt the need for large amounts, but I am very pleased that the patch test is indicating that my iodine levels must be pretty good.

                Comment


                • Hi Breadsauce,

                  Im glad that you feel good on your low dose of Iodine each week. Good for you. Very glad that you take K2 for it is so good for helping to prevent plaque in the veins which leads to heart attacks, strokes, and dangerous leg clots. And the D3 is wonderful too. I tried for years to get my triglycerides down and D3 did it in 8 weeks. D3 also help me lose weight, as well as my handicapped daughter and my wife. (She lost over 30lbs). I would talk about studies that show over 80% of everyone is deficient in D3 but instead I will say that blood work showed my wife, my daughter and I were all low on D3. One of the family doctors I used to go too, started including the D3 blood test on all her patients after she witnessed firsthand what taking D3 did for me and my family.

                  About a year later as she went over my blood work I asked her what she personally thought about D3. She responded that almost everyone she tested was low on D3, even construction workers who spent all day out in the sun.

                  t2t

                  Comment


                  • Hi T2t, I've been taking 5000 D3 for upwards of a year, but then saw here that I need K-2. Again. So I reordered some, but it's MK-7. After due consideration for Dr. Kruse's preferences, I opted for the MK-7 because the only difference, AFAIK, is the much shorter life of the MK-4. Since I am loath to increase my pill regimen by any more than necessary (taking multiple hits of MK-4 daily), I'll stick with my old favourite. And now I'll be able to increase my D3, or at least, hope I get more benefit from it. And from the iodine and the leptin reset. My iodine patch disappears overnight, except on scar tissue.
                    Last edited by Paysan; 07-19-2012, 11:32 AM.

                    Comment


                    • K2 mk4

                      Hi Paysan,

                      If at a later time you could change to the K2 mk4 I STRONGLY recommend it. I have taken the K2 mk7 and it doesn’t make your skin or gums or sinuses feel smooth like K2 Mk4.

                      Many people have allergies to the mk7 from the soy nuts, in the oil.

                      But anyhow if you can find a way to take 2 or 3 MILLIgrams once a night with your D3 you will be in for a pleasant surprise. Oh. And a tad of “olive oil or coconut oil”. (“They” help K2 to absorb better!)

                      t2t
                      Last edited by t2t; 07-19-2012, 12:40 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Gwynn View Post
                        Paleogirl,

                        I can't believe you said this. I attempted a Whole 30 a couple months back. I only lasted nine days, but ever since I got back to eating normally (not even Primal) I feel waaayy worse than before. I told DH I was imagining things. Maybe not?

                        Gwynn
                        Gwynn, you're definitely not imagining things! I didn't think that I had any issues with grains and dairy, etc. before going paleo. At first, I was still eating dairy. After a couple of months, I decided to take the Robb Wolf challenge (remove suspected offending item[s] for 30 days, then reintroduce and see how you feel) and cut out all dairy (except for butter, just can't do it!). Then I reintroduced full fat Greek yogurt, which I LOVE. Within half an hour, I got really nauseous and felt horrible for awhile. That was all the proof that I needed. So aside from butter, some cheese on occasion, and some full fat heavy cream here and there with my espresso, I really don't do dairy. I can tolerate small amounts of gluten, but it does make me FEEL heavy. Unless it's a special occasion (holiday dinner, special meal eaten out, etc.), I avoid gluten at all costs.

                        I recently did 3 weeks of a strict candida diet, which is similar to the Whole 30, except that I wasn't consuming any fruit, and actually am still not (no sugar allowed, even from natural sources). I loosened up recently and have had a few drinks and some chocolate, which has been nice, but I was feeling SOOO much better on the clean diet.

                        I think that we are less sensitive to things like dairy and wheat while we are continuing to eat them because our bodies are in a constant state of inflammation. I remember reading somewhere (I think it was in The Paleo Solution), that even a small amount of gluten here and there is enough to keep us inflamed. Once we've removed the causes of inflammation and our system gets cleaned up, I think it becomes much more sensitive when we reintroduce any of the offenders.

                        I'm thinking that the heavy cream may have been the culprit with my breakout. I stopped having it and didn't get any new pimples. This week I had a couple of cappuccinos with it and have got a brand new spot this morning. So now I know that it's definitely something that I can only do in moderation!

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by t2t View Post

                          P.S. I am working on getting my HDL above 30. I know I need B12 5000mcgs a day with B6 and folic acid. The magic bullet is TMG which I just received in the mail earlier today, and it is taunted to amplify B12, B6 and folic acid in a profound way to raise HDL. Have noticed a surge of energy after taking it, within 45 minutes! The energy lasted most of the day... I have taken B12 in the past and never felt it.

                          t2t
                          t2t, I know you mentioned that you are taking coconut oil already, but you may want to consider supplementing with more of it in order to increase your HDL. I had my levels tested at the beginning of the year, after a couple of months of supplementing with 3 tbsp. of coconut oil daily (I started with one, then increased to 3, then backed down to one). The first benefit I got from this was lowered blood pressure, so I was able to discontinue my medication (this was prior to going paleo). I told my doctor that I wasn't taking my bp meds any more and why, and he said as long as the bp doesn't increase, then fine, but he was concerned about me ingesting so much saturated fat (of course). At this point, my blood work appt. was a couple of months away, so he said he didn't think I could do much damage in that amount of time and we would see what the blood work said.
                          Well, the blood work said that my HDL is 99!! (and D levels 69k, but that's besides the point). He told me that whatever I was doing to keep on doing it. My LDL was also 99, but he wasn't concerned about that, and I'm fairly certain that it's the benign big fluffy LDL anyway.
                          I don't supplement with so much coconut oil anymore. My bp stays right at 120/80 (unless I go out for a few drinks!). I cook with it and will throw a spoonful into my coffee or tea a few times a week though.

                          Just something to consider that might help bump up your HDL levels!

                          Comment


                          • @Happy Paleo Girl,

                            Why thank you! I will increase it right away. Even though the high intake of D3 has all but cured my Diabeties type 2 and lowered my triglycerides to 125 my blood work showed my iron, B12 were a little low and of course my HDL was still 30.

                            BTW the 1000 mg's of TMG with 5000 MICROgrams of B12, and some B6 and folic acid has surged my energy and overall feeling of wellbeing.

                            Thanks again for the tip...

                            t2t

                            Comment


                            • Here is a wonderful, if long, completely scientific article about iodine(Iodine — Health Professional Fact Sheet ). Why we need it and why it is so important in our diets, many of the problems that it helps to remedy through natural ingestion and some supplementation, and also how supplementation can also be harmful to people.

                              I'll pop in a few excerpts and the link.
                              I highly encourage reading it. It is sound medical research on the good that iodine can do... and some unfortunate consequences that can arise from iodine overload.

                              "Iodine is a trace element that is naturally present in some foods, added to others, and available as a dietary supplement. Iodine is an essential component of the thyroid hormones thyroxine (T4) and triiodothyronine (T3). Thyroid hormones regulate many important biochemical reactions, including protein synthesis and enzymatic activity, and are critical determinants of metabolic activity [1,2]. They are also required for proper skeletal and central nervous system development in fetuses and infants [1].

                              ... Iodine may have other physiological functions in the body as well. For example, it appears to play a role in immune response and might have a beneficial effect on mammary dysplasia and fibrocystic breast disease [2].
                              (*Note: medical community statistics on fibrocystic breast disease are about 30-40% of women, state that it is an approximate 5% risk factor for breast cancer.)

                              (A great section on uptake and absorption of iodine/iodide, and how much the maximum body needs at any given time.)
                              Iodine in food and iodized salt is present in several chemical forms including sodium and potassium salts, inorganic iodine (I2), iodate, and iodide, the reduced form of iodine [4]. Iodine rarely occurs as the element, which is a gas, but rather as a salt; for this reason, it is referred to as iodide and not iodine. Iodide is quickly and almost completely absorbed in the stomach and duodenum. Iodate is reduced in the gastrointestinal tract and absorbed as iodide [2,5]. When iodide enters the circulation, the thyroid gland concentrates it in appropriate amounts for thyroid hormone synthesis and most of the remaining amount is excreted in the urine [2]. The iodine-replete healthy adult has about 15–20 mg of iodine, 70%–80% of which is contained in the thyroid [6].
                              ***I'd like to note that this particular line really speaks to me. If you feel that you may be iodine deficient, this number indicates that you do not actually need huge doses to become normalized in a timely manner, nor that huge doses are necessary even if some of the iodine is going to be lost due to "detox". It also indicates that the huge doses that are advocated in some instances may indeed be nuking and carpet bombing an internal system (the Thyroid) that is normally in a delicate balance. It's the old, too much of a good thing isn't so good anymore paradox... kind of the same way same way some people get into trouble with taking high doses of some vitamins.

                              (Short section on recommended intakes and food sources)

                              (Long section on iodine intakes... very interesting stuff... more than expected is found in foods still since the supermarket food supply has become very diverse...)

                              (Sections on the affects of deficiency, groups at risk, and iodine as necessary for health and treatment for health issues... such as... Fetal infant development, cognitive function, and fibrocystic breasts which I'll excerpt here... and radiation induced thyroid cancer)

                              Fibrocystic breast disease is a benign condition characterized by lumpy, painful breasts and palpable fibrosis. It commonly affects women (*30-40%, as noted above) of reproductive age, but it can also occur during menopause, especially in women taking estrogens [52]. Breast tissue has a high concentration of iodine, especially during pregnancy and lactation) [4,53]. Some research suggests that iodine supplementation might be helpful for fibrocystic breast disease, although a specific mechanism of action has not been established [54] and data are limited.

                              In a double-blind study, researchers randomly assigned 56 women with fibrocystic breast disease to receive daily supplements of iodine (70 to 90 mcg I2/kg body weight) or placebo for 6 months [52]. At treatment completion, 65% of the women receiving iodine reported decreased pain compared with 33% of women in the placebo group. A more recent randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial had similar findings. In this study, researchers randomly assigned 111 women (18–50 years of age) with fibrosis and a history of breast pain to receive tablets containing 0 mcg, 1,500 mcg, 3,000 mcg, or 6,000 mcg of iodine per day [54]. After 5 months of treatment, women receiving doses of 3,000 or 6,000 mcg iodine had a significant decrease in breast pain, tenderness, and nodularity compared with those receiving placebo or 1,500 mcg iodine. The researchers also reported a dose-dependent reduction in self-assessed pain. None of the doses was associated with major adverse events or changes in thyroid function test results.

                              Although the results of these studies are promising, more research is needed to clarify iodine's role in fibrocystic breast disease. Moreover, the doses used in these studies (approximately 1,500–6,000 mcg per day) are several times higher than the iodine UL of 1,100 mcg for adults. Doses of this magnitude should only be used under the guidance of a physician [2].

                              (And also Health risks from Excessive iodine...)
                              High intakes of iodine can cause some of the same symptoms as iodine deficiency—including goiter, elevated TSH levels, and hypothyroidism—because excess iodine in susceptible individuals inhibits thyroid hormone synthesis and thereby increases TSH stimulation, which can produce goiter [2,58]. Iodine-induced hyperthyroidism can also result from high iodine intakes, usually when iodine is administered to treat iodine deficiency. Studies have also shown that excessive iodine intakes cause thyroiditis and thyroid papillary cancer [2,58]. Cases of acute iodine poisoning are rare and are usually caused by doses of many grams. Acute poisoning symptoms include burning of the mouth, throat, and stomach; fever; abdominal pain; nausea; vomiting; diarrhea; weak pulse; and coma [2].
                              Responses to excess iodine and the doses required to cause adverse effects vary [58]. Some people, such as those with autoimmune thyroid disease and iodine deficiency, may experience adverse effects with iodine intakes considered safe for the general population [2,5].

                              (Followed by some important medication interaction information, sources, etc.)"

                              In spite of how the government is some times portrayed here it really is a fair and balanced account of the good and bad of iodine supplementation based on scientific evidence.
                              Iodine — Health Professional Fact Sheet (same link as above in case you read some and now would like to read the rest)


                              I'd like to add a link to a short description of iodine overload just so that the symptoms of that are available. Sometimes I see symptoms such as these labeled as "detox", and I just want to have the info available that the iodine itself can indeed make you sick if you take large doses.

                              Iodine – The RDA for iodine is 150 mcg (micrograms). While iodine is necessary for a healthy thyroid gland, when taken in large doses of two milligrams or more per day it can shut down the thyroid gland. Other symptoms of iodine overload are weight gain, metallic taste in mouth, dry skin and hair, rash, constipation, diarrhea, vomiting, mouth sores, swollen salivary glands, headache, breathing difficulties and excessive menstrual bleeding.

                              Remember that line from above? "The iodine-replete healthy adult has about 15–20 mg of iodine, 70%–80% of which is contained in the thyroid [6]
                              Even taking only 500mcg to 1mg per day... your bodily stores would be completely renewed in about 2-4 weeks. If you took that safe level long term you would always have excess iodine available to do any "detoxing" that your body needed.

                              Read more at Suite101: Dangers of Vitamin and Mineral Overdose: When Nutrients Turn from Healthy to Toxic | Suite101.com Dangers of Vitamin and Mineral Overdose: When Nutrients Turn from Healthy to Toxic | Suite101.com
                              You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.
                              ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                              And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Happy Paleo Girl View Post
                                Gwynn, you're definitely not imagining things! I didn't think that I had any issues with grains and dairy, etc. before going paleo. At first, I was still eating dairy. After a couple of months, I decided to take the Robb Wolf challenge (remove suspected offending item[s] for 30 days, then reintroduce and see how you feel) and cut out all dairy (except for butter, just can't do it!). Then I reintroduced full fat Greek yogurt, which I LOVE. Within half an hour, I got really nauseous and felt horrible for awhile. That was all the proof that I needed. So aside from butter, some cheese on occasion, and some full fat heavy cream here and there with my espresso, I really don't do dairy. I can tolerate small amounts of gluten, but it does make me FEEL heavy. Unless it's a special occasion (holiday dinner, special meal eaten out, etc.), I avoid gluten at all costs.

                                I recently did 3 weeks of a strict candida diet, which is similar to the Whole 30, except that I wasn't consuming any fruit, and actually am still not (no sugar allowed, even from natural sources). I loosened up recently and have had a few drinks and some chocolate, which has been nice, but I was feeling SOOO much better on the clean diet.

                                I think that we are less sensitive to things like dairy and wheat while we are continuing to eat them because our bodies are in a constant state of inflammation. I remember reading somewhere (I think it was in The Paleo Solution), that even a small amount of gluten here and there is enough to keep us inflamed. Once we've removed the causes of inflammation and our system gets cleaned up, I think it becomes much more sensitive when we reintroduce any of the offenders.

                                I'm thinking that the heavy cream may have been the culprit with my breakout. I stopped having it and didn't get any new pimples. This week I had a couple of cappuccinos with it and have got a brand new spot this morning. So now I know that it's definitely something that I can only do in moderation!
                                Thanks, Paleo Girl! We have decided to try another Whole 30 in a couple of weeks, AFTER vacation, of course.

                                Comment

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