No announcement yet.

Who Here Uses a Cheat "DAY"?

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16

    Not angry. Perplexed. As in confused and bewildered.


    Why are you so angry? As a Doctor of Pharmacy, I've done my fair share of scientific research and all of my suggestions/beliefs are backed by BOTH extensive research AND real world experience.

    At 4.3% body fat and having helped many others to achieve fat loss, I thought others may be interested in incorporating a cheat/fast combo worked into their primal diet for potentially better results.

    According to Mark himself, he encourages everyone to critically assess everything they come across, especially in regards to health and fitness.

    Am I not allowed in the forum if I have a slight variation from the PB?

    You are incorrect in saying that healthy carbs would lead to an equivalent surge in insulin and subsequent bump in leptin levels. All carbs would stimulate some insulin release, yes...but Baby Ruth's, pizza and other high GI carbs combo'd with fat produce an exponentially greater response.

    As you requested....

    <snip> ...

    Citations for my RESEARCH:

    Until I have a chance to go through your citation, I disagree that you cannot get an equivalent insulin spike from healthy carbs like potatoes; and if fat is a requirement then there is always bacon and potatoes. Baby Ruths are loaded with HFCS and trans fats and who knows what else. Trust me, I know that there are healthier ways to jack up insulin than gluten grains and sugars or Baby Ruth bars.

    Of course you are welcome to the forum. Who am I to restrict you. I am just awed and dumbfounded by advising people to eat half bags of Baby Ruth bars. That&#39;s all.

    Anyway, thanks for posting the list of references.

    “It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creeds into law if it acquires the political power to do so, and will follow it by suppressing opposition, subverting all education to seize early the minds of the young, and by killing, locking up, or driving underground all heretics.”
    —Robert A. Heinlein


    • #17

      Fair enough, have a look at the research and I think you&#39;ll find my points are validated. BTW, Baby Ruth bars are by no means a "cheat day requirement" and are simply what happened to show up in my kitchen that particular cheat day I was describing. Any high GI carbs combo&#39;d with fat will do the trick, as this produces a synergistic effect when it comes to resetting leptin levels.


      • #18

        Seriously? Do you think we&#39;re all "ready to eat off our own arms" and starving with calorie restriction?

        In your post you said "A typical diet has you fighting your own metabolism week after week and month after month."

        Primal Blueprint isn&#39;t a "typical diet." This way of eating is a "real food"-focused plan. And honestly, I don&#39;t see how you can go wrong eating what nature provides versus what guys in lab coats create.

        And the reason most of us feel like crap when we "cheat" (non primal foods) is because that stuff IS crap... industrial oils, refined grains, etc.

        Also, if you want a really high insulin response, wouldn&#39;t you just want straight-up glucose? I mean, fructose/sucrose doesn&#39;t affect insulin as much does it?

        You keep trying to sound like you&#39;ve done all this research that has led you to scientifically gorge yourself on pizza, nachos, and baby ruth bars... but are you sure you aren&#39;t just eating a too-restrictive diet that makes you want to chew off your own arm, and then rebelling in a way?

        Maybe you should try the Primal way.

        Eating lots but still hungry? Eat more fat. Mid-day sluggishness? Eat more fat. Feeling depressed or irritable? Eat more fat. People think you've developed an eating disorder? Eat more fat... in front of them.


        • #19

          Hmm, well I&#39;m not as saintly as some of the people here (I eat dairy) but I avoid grains like the plague. I don&#39;t touch fast food and avoid things like pizza, pasta and bread, not to mention cheap "candy" (or what us Brits call "sweets") - I no longer have any desire for them.

          Cheating for me is mixes of dried fruit and nuts, *very* expensive gourmet chocolates (the £20 a box sort) and in summer, I will eat ice cream (again, luxury brands made with real cream). I might occassionally have a baked potato but this is rare.


          • #20

            I don&#39;t really plan a cheat day... it reminds me of diet mentality. If I feel like some dark chocolate, I&#39;ll have chocolate. When I feel like something sweet (rarely), I have a piece of fruit. I don&#39;t actively plan to be really really good, then really really bad.

            If I were to overindulge on purpose, I&#39;d still prefer something primal - maybe avocados, mangoes or a whole roast chicken. I&#39;ll be feeling pretty full and heavy, maybe a little tired, but I won&#39;t be feeling -ill- like I would if I were to binge on pizza, lollies and french fries.

            Is there a need to go for the unhealthy (well, more like poisonous) stuff specifically? Like Asturian said, if creating an insulin spike with high carbs + fat is the intention; you can do it with natural food. Make a heaping serving of sweet potato mash with coconut milk, or tuck into a large and colourful fruit salad with yogurt. You&#39;re still getting an insulin spike and a whole lot of unneeded calories, but you&#39;re also consuming beneficial nutritients, too. With strategic gorging on junk maybe you&#39;ll lose fat in the grand scheme of things, but by selecting unhealthy choices it&#39;s hurting your body, too.

            Thanks for sharing your thoughts. It&#39;s an interesting theory, and I think it would work when applied strategically in a fat loss plan... but I disagree with the food choices.


            • #21

              Again @ Brad

              As Vick noted, there is another thread on leptin resistance. Perhaps you would care to join the discussion to give your views on the relationship between leptin production and insulin spikes as they relate to high GI carbs and fat intake. Perhaps provide an understanding of whether leptin resistance in any way affects this synergistic relationship between the metabolic hormones as you propose. And perhaps better still provide us with your views of what causes leptin resistance and how to fix it.

              “It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creeds into law if it acquires the political power to do so, and will follow it by suppressing opposition, subverting all education to seize early the minds of the young, and by killing, locking up, or driving underground all heretics.”
              —Robert A. Heinlein


              • #22

       one cheat day so far was Thanksgiving, and it wasn&#39;t even a "real" cheat day. I ate a lot more carbs than usual, but they were not junk: sweet potatoes and some pumpkin pie sweetened with a small amt of honey.

                I felt like crap for a few days afterward, so no, I&#39;m not tempted to do it again. But I&#39;m satisfied with my body fat percentage (~20%, I&#39;m female) and having no trouble maintaining it. So I can&#39;t see a good reason to mess with what&#39;s working unless it&#39;ll make a big difference to gain of lean mass.

                But reading about leptin is making me pay more attention to carb intake on a daily basis. Even though I&#39;m not struggling with weight loss, I feel my lack of knowledge of leptin is a big gap in my understanding of human metabolism. Must work on that.

                I&#39;m not sure I&#39;m understanding your thoughts on junk food vs healthier carbs and insulin/leptin. It seems as though you&#39;re saying there&#39;s a significant difference between the metabolic effects of the macros in a candy bar and the macros in a sweet potato with butter. Am I misunderstanding?

                My glucose meter tells me that a sweet potato loaded with butter makes my blood sugar shoot up fast, and then decline over a few hours, presumably under the influence of an insulin spike.

                If you don&#39;t mind posting a quick explanation of how a Babe Ruth and a butter-loaded sweet potato with equivalent carb/fat grams affect insulin/leptin differently, I&#39;d love to hear it.


                • #23

                  The food choices are pizza, hamburger, fries, ice craem, etc, because this is targeted to those who can&#39;t imagine living without these foods. Other "normal" people crave them all the time, so by saying that these are allowed, they&#39;re more willing to try this "diet".

                  Again, stop being hostile towards other ideas. Some of you are really rude.

                  ¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><((((º>¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><((((º>¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><(( ((º>
                  ><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><((((º>¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><((((º>¸.·´¯`·.¸¸><(( ((º>


                  • #24

                    @FlyNavyWife - clearly you haven&#39;t carefully read my threads, my posts or the literature provided.

                    I am not cheating b/c I&#39;m starving (although it is a nice mental break from clean eating) - I&#39;m cheating b/c this is beneficial to maintaining a high metabolism that is kept at an optimal fat-burning level.

                    Instead of snapping back "also, wouldn&#39;t you...."

                    ...why not read the literature yourself and find out the mechanisms behind a strategic cheat day?

                    Also, as you can see from my original threads, I did not state "a cheat day is for everyone and it&#39;s the only way to go."

                    I simply asked if others had tried this concept and if so, what their experience has been.

                    I&#39;m not TRYING to sound like I&#39;ve done all the research - I HAVE done sufficient research, there&#39;s no "trying" about it.

                    Yet, you, who apparently has NOT conducted any research, attack me with your emotional-based OPINION....which means nothing.

                    I&#39;m not asking for anyone&#39;s support or approval - I&#39;ve done the research, I understand the mechanisms, and most importantly, I&#39;ve had great success and have helped hundreds of others with my strategic approach.

                    Are you telling me that I&#39;m not healthy with 5 days of primal eating, one cheat day and one fast day...despite the fact that I&#39;m at 4.3% body fat and my recent physical suggests I&#39;m in peak physical condition?

                    hmmm, I&#39;d beg to differ.

                    Read the original post - where did I say I was starving on my diet or not using anything more than a PB diet with one slight variation (a cheat day)?

                    I was simply looking to have an educated and support-based conversation about peoples&#39; experiences and findings regarding strategic cheating to alter leptin and promote a high metabolism.

                    If you have something more contributory that is not solely your emotional opinion, I&#39;d be honored to discuss further.



                    • #25

                      I can&#39;t handle cheat days. Usually cheat days turn into cheat weeks, and then I have to pick up the pieces. I can handle a cheat meal now and then, but they are not planned. Just random, if I am with family who are not eating healthy for instance. Or last week, we had pizza for a lunch meeting. Just a few examples. I have made great progress in the last few weeks though. The guy who delivers our office supplies always leaves us "treats", little fun size candy bars. For the last few times he&#39;s been here, I have been able to resist eating the candy and give them to someone else. Also, I live with my grandparents. They always have sweet stuff around. My grandpa bought a huge pack of cookies from the bakery last week. I haven&#39;t had a single one. I don&#39;t really want one. My brain slightly wants one, but my body says no. As far as fruit goes, I eat it. I eat blueberries, and grapefruit usually, beacuse that&#39;s what I have this week in the fridge. Next week it may be strawberries and apples, or pineapple. Earlier this weeek I made a recipe from the website called "No-oatmeal" with a mashed banana. That was plenty fruit for the day. Bananas are very sweet. So far, I love this "diet".

                      Carpe Diem!


                      • #26

                        @Raphael - right on, it was merely a suggestion for the typical person who would enjoy indulging in comfort foods in a strategic and limited way and/or is experiencing a plateau with excessive clean eating. Like I said, it&#39;s not for everyone - I have nothing to promote here...just my findings and experiences that I thought might be helpful.

                        Not sure what all the hostility is about

                        Thanks Raphael


                        • #27

                          @beckinwolf - also a good point - this strategy would not be for individuals who cannot control their "cheats" and who have struggled in the past with excessive binging. thx for the feedback.


                          • #28

                            @ Raphael

                            If Brad did come to this forum to target "normal" people, maybe he came to the wrong forum? Let&#39;s face it. We are not normal. We are hostile towards the idea of junk food because some of us actually do go beyond imagining a life without junk. I don&#39;t think it is rude to express why we live a primal lifestyle and avoid junk foods.

                            “It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creeds into law if it acquires the political power to do so, and will follow it by suppressing opposition, subverting all education to seize early the minds of the young, and by killing, locking up, or driving underground all heretics.”
                            —Robert A. Heinlein


                            • #29

                              This is a really interesting thread, which made me think hard about my initial repugnance to the idea. After 6 months of eating primally, my entire mindset around food has changed. I simply don&#39;t think of candy bars, muffins, pizza, even oatmeal, as food anymore. They&#39;re about as appealing to me as the wrapping they are packaged in. The other day at work, someone brought in a box of waxy chocolate-coated donuts. Curiously, I read the ingredients on the box. I just shook my head and left the donuts behind, absolutely not tempted.

                              True, on "diets" of the past, I would fixate on what I could NOT have. Eating primally, I am completely satisfied with what I CAN have. Last night, we were out of fresh veggies in the house, so I cooked up some frozen broccoli to accompany the pork chops fried with onions in butter. The broccoli initially wasn&#39;t too appealing, but with butter and shredded sharp cheddar cheese, it was delicious. It was an easy, satisfying dinner, and I can&#39;t imagine trading it for a pepperoni pizza.

                              About the leptin: your ideas make me curious for more information. I&#39;m just beginning to feel like I understand insulin resistance -- indeed, I work hard to keep insulin surges to a minimum -- so I now must embark on the journey to understand leptin. As someone else mentioned, rather than poisoning your body with non-food, wouldn&#39;t it be as beneficial to your goal to simply drink glucose? <shudder> Assuming it&#39;s true that the insulin rush couldn&#39;t be provided by eating a whole, fresh pineapple, which is a theory I also don&#39;t understand.


                              • #30

                                @Asturian - how is the life w/o junk working for you? What is your current body fat%? Are you the epitome of optimal health? Are you living your life without the use of any prescription medications whatsoever, thanks to your 100% primal ways? Are you seeing 1-3 lbs of fat loss each and every week with no plateauing or setbacks?

                                I sure hope so - otherwise your inability to overcome your subconscious mind is hindering your success when it comes to achieving your fitness goals.

                                I presume that many people expressing their strong "opinions" aren&#39;t in the low single digits of body fat?

                                Just curious