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  • Long-term supplement use?

    So I've been taking Animal Pak vitamins (somewhat similar to one of Mark's Damage Control Master Formula), mainly as insurance in case I have deficiencies somewhere, but have been wondering about long-term use of supplements.

    So unless I'm mistaken, long-term consumption of certain things (some drugs, hormones, or other stuff) may affect your body's ability to produce or use that stuff as it tries to regulate the levels in the body, so in a sense it builds up a resistance to it. Which makes me wonder if the same thing can happen with over-consumption of all those vitamins and other ingredients in these supplements.

    For example, and maybe it's not true, but I've heard people who take melatonin for insomnia eventually get into a state where they need more and more melatonin because their body stops producing as much because of them taking melatonin, thus exacerbating the problem.

    i.e if too much sugar -> insulin resistance, then will too much vitamin/other nutrients -> other forms of resistance?
    Last edited by Dracil; 11-08-2011, 03:48 PM.

  • #2
    Good question...is it like putting oil into a car with a leaky engine? it keeps the engine from blowing up but the leak continues?

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    • #3
      Hmmm interesting. I tend to cycle my supplements. The only thing I consistenly take is O3s and pro-biotics. The rest is inconsistent, things like VitD3, magnesium, zinc and Q10. If I run out I might leave it another month before I buy another load.

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      • #4
        This is why I don't do supplements at all. You might need them for a specific medical condition (I needed extra bone building minerals after chemo) or you might need them for a short term situation (say a road trip where you don't get to eat right or a few weeks in the middle of winter in someplace very lacking in D) But I don't think that supplements are needed or are good for you on an ongoing basis.

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        • #5
          The only thing I've heard was Chris Kresser (I think) saying something about how fish oil should only be taken for a year, then you need to take a break or the excess goes rancid in your body. Or something like that. I'll find the link...

          Crap. I can't find it.

          Carry on.
          Durp.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by RitaRose View Post
            fish oil should only be taken for a year, then you need to take a break or the excess goes rancid in your body.

            sounds fishy to me, lol.

            It's not actually floating around your body as fish oil you know?!

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            • #7
              This is only true for certain supplements such as amino acids that affect your brain chemistry, as far as I can recall. Things like L-Tyrosine, or 5-HTP/L-Tryptophan, for example. Your body uses these from proteins to create dopamine, serotonin, etc. You wear out your adrenals from taking things like this for too long, apparently. Recommendations vary for cycling, from 3 weeks on to 1 week off, to a more equal ratio.

              L-Tyrosine and 5-HTP - Page 2 - Social Anxiety Forum
              This is where I read about it. Not the most reputable source, but I take what I can get and the 5-HTP and L-Tyrosine have been helpful for me.
              Depression Lies

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              • #8
                The same argument would apply to food, where we should be getting out vitamins.

                That being said, the only supps I take are Mg and D3. I think the case for Mg is pretty solid and I don't get enough sun to make my own D3.

                Also, I'm not a big fan of Marks supplements(not that he shouldn't offer them, he's just nowhere near selling me personally on them), but animal pack is completely different than DCMF from my understanding.

                Also remember that too many vitamins, especially unbalanced, or not from whole food sources is just as bad as not enough.
                Lifting Journal

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                • #9
                  Hmm, well Animal Pak does have the tryptophan and Tyrosine.

                  Here are the ingredient lists for it. I only take 1 packet per day, so half the amount. Mark's serving size is also 2 packets.




                  I might look into getting more specific supplements (e.g. Magnesium or D3 during the winter) in the future. I only started using Animal Pak back then 'cause people said it was useful for lifting, though honestly I haven't found much difference taking it or not (then again, I don't seem to be very in tune with my body changes, since I didn't really experience carb flu either, or really feel the increased energy from going Primal)

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by theMarvelousMoment View Post
                    It's not actually floating around your body as fish oil you know?!
                    Ya think?

                    Yes, I know. I was just throwing it out there as something I had read from (I thought it was) Chris Kresser, but hoping someone else actually knew what I was talking about and had also heard it.

                    Never mind.
                    Durp.

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                    • #11
                      Apex, I don't think that argument applies to food because (and I could be understanding this completely wrong) it's not like the protein you eat is infused with tryptophan or tyrosine or whatever. Your body converts what it needs, right? Maybe it just converts everything but if it doesn't need it, it discards it? I just feel like consuming straight up Tryptophan (or whatever, and L-Tryptophan is not the same, but I don't know what that's about) would affect your body differently than

                      Afterall it's not like it's a myth that people become dependent on SSRIs. They DO.

                      If you don't need the supplement, it won't affect you, as far as I've come to understand. Or you'll get adverse side effects. I don't take multivitamins because I want to be able to objectively rule out anything that might be causing problems for me, so I'm not a fan of those animal pak things.
                      Depression Lies

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by namelesswonder View Post
                        Apex, I don't think that argument applies to food because (and I could be understanding this completely wrong) it's not like the protein you eat is infused with tryptophan or tyrosine or whatever. Your body converts what it needs, right? Maybe it just converts everything but if it doesn't need it, it discards it? I just feel like consuming straight up Tryptophan (or whatever, and L-Tryptophan is not the same, but I don't know what that's about) would affect your body differently than

                        Afterall it's not like it's a myth that people become dependent on SSRIs. They DO.

                        If you don't need the supplement, it won't affect you, as far as I've come to understand. Or you'll get adverse side effects. I don't take multivitamins because I want to be able to objectively rule out anything that might be causing problems for me, so I'm not a fan of those animal pak things.
                        Your body doesn't distinguish between food and supplements. So if constantly encountering a substance caused a problem, it would cause the same problem whether it was in a supplement or food.

                        SSRI's are drugs, not supplements. The compounds in them are not found in food.

                        I don't understand your last statement. You seem to be saying that supplements will either have no effect, a good effect, or a bad effect, which I can't disagree with, but I'm not sure if it has any implications.
                        Lifting Journal

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Dracil View Post
                          Hmm, well Animal Pak does have the tryptophan and Tyrosine.

                          Here are the ingredient lists for it. I only take 1 packet per day, so half the amount. Mark's serving size is also 2 packets.




                          I might look into getting more specific supplements (e.g. Magnesium or D3 during the winter) in the future. I only started using Animal Pak back then 'cause people said it was useful for lifting, though honestly I haven't found much difference taking it or not (then again, I don't seem to be very in tune with my body changes, since I didn't really experience carb flu either, or really feel the increased energy from going Primal)
                          Remember those names are not the whole picture. There is a world of difference between chemically stripped compounds and whole food compounds which include all manner of related compounds that are in the food, but not chemically stripped.
                          Lifting Journal

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                          • #14
                            Poppycock!

                            I've been supplement my diet with the blood of unbaptized babies for centuries and it hasn't done me any harm!

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                            • #15
                              The Jaminets' book has a very convincing discussion of supplements (with references), some of which they highly recommend and some of which they argue are harmful.
                              Perfect Health Diet Recommended Supplements is a quick summary.
                              The carpet-bombing approach to supplements seems very unwise.
                              The trouble with the rat race is that even if you win, you're still a rat.
                              (Lily Tomlin)

                              I take life easier than almost anyone I know, but when I exercise I do it as though my life depends on it (which it does).
                              (Arthur De Vany)

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