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Conventional Dairy Milk?

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  • #16
    If you really don't want to give up milk, find yourself a local raw milk farm and by it directly from the farm. Probably the best overall for you. WAPF is huge on the benefits of unpasteurized milk and you can find your closest seller here: Where Can I Find Real (Raw) Milk?

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Rip City View Post
      If you really don't want to give up milk, find yourself a local raw milk farm and by it directly from the farm. Probably the best overall for you. WAPF is huge on the benefits of unpasteurized milk and you can find your closest seller here: Where Can I Find Real (Raw) Milk?
      Thank you for that website!!!

      Found a place right up the road with grass-fed beef, and free-range poultry and all associated products (eggs, butter, yogurt, etc.)! Don't have to drive halfway across town anymore -- which I actually wasn't doing because, well...I had to drive halfway across town
      iHerb.com 1st time buyer $5 discount code: GIS836

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      • #18
        Milk is a functional food intended to help infants to thrive, that is, to grow. Growth is only possible when the infant assimilates their food, the milk, easily. Assimilation of nutrients is driven by insulin. Type I diabetics, that is those who are insulin dependent, prior to the invention of synthetic insulin would starve to death. One symptom of type I diabetes is hyperphagia, or ravenous hunger, driven by the underlying pathology where irrespective of the amount of food ingested, none is assimilated.

        So, if you were to produce a food intended to promote infant growth you would probably load it up with the necessary fats, carbohydrates, definitely protein, and throw in some immune system promoting factors, just to be on the safe side. Then, the next crucial step is to make absolutely certain that it is insulinogenic so that the infant has a strong insulin response which leads to assimilation of the meal. Our first order of business is growth, we can worry about the baby fat later.

        The above analytical framework then suggests that milk would be highly insulinogenic, and this does in fact seem to empirically be the case.

        Unfortunately, I have yet to track down the entire doctoral thesis, but from the abstract:

        Recent data suggest that certain proteins and protein-containing foods e.g. milk, may exert insulinotrophic effects in healthy subjects, without a concomitant postprandial hyperglycaemia.
        Translating the seemingly obligatory academic speak into regular folk english ... milk stimulates insulin production without an increase in blood sugar levels.

        Dairy proteins, in particular the whey protein fraction, were found to be potent insulin secretagogues in healthy subjects
        But, it gets better. This study found that:

        Casein added to a fatty meal lowers free fatty acids markedly in the postprandial and postabsorption phases, probably via its insulinotropic activity.
        Free fatty acids (FFAs) in your blood are a good thing, because that means that they are available to be consumed for energy by every mitochondria containing cell in your body, which pretty much means every cell with the notable exception of red blood cells. Decreasing FFAs in your bloodstream, particularly after a high fat meal, is a decidedly bad thing because we can conclude that the FFAs that you've just ingested have been stored. Again, this is not a problem if you are principally concerned with acquiring baby fat that you can shed later.

        Between them, casein and whey respectively account for 80% and 20% of milk protein, so we have a nice insulin promoting cocktail.

        It's up to you whether you want to drink milk, but I would tend to stay away from it. If you do decide that milk is in your dietary future, then definitely go raw instead of industrially produced grocery store crap.

        One possible thing you could do to simulate milk is to drink organic heavy cream. Heavy cream is basically pure fat at 35% milk fat vs. full fat milk at 3.5%. The advantage to the cream is that is does not have any casein or whey, nor does it have much lactose. If you want to approximate full fat milk, then, take heavy cream and add 10 parts water to every 1 part heavy cream.

        As an aside, and for general amusement ... cheese in general is made by separating the liquid whey fraction of milk from the solid curds ( casein ). The curds are then pressed / formed and further processed into a bewildering variety of cheese. There is one type of cheese where this is conspicuously not the case, where the whey and casein are both used in the end product. What cheese is this? Why it's the traditional dieter's best friend ... cottage cheese. If you've ever read the nutritional contents on a package of cottage cheese and wondered why the protein to fat ratio is 3 to 1 where in regular cheeses it is roughly 1 to 1, well, now you know. It is due to the addition of "potent insulin secretagogues". Beware conventional wisdom.

        -PK
        My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

        Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

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        • #19
          If you like milk like I like milk you're in trouble. All the milk I see has 12 grams of sugar per cup. Whether raw , full fat , skim, whatever, thats alot of sugar especially if you down 3 cups at a time while enjoying Scottish shorbread before going to bed! No more shortbread since going Primal (a little over a month now) but I still love milk. I try not to drink it as much but when I do it's usually at least 2 cups. I drink skim, but I think no matter the fat content, milk just has too much sugar - 2 cups = 24 grams of sugar, 4 grams shy of an ounce ! I know I don't need that. Anyway, since modifying my eating habits, for some unknown reason, I don't tolerate milk as before. I need the bathroom pretty quick after indulging, even if I have some food with the milk..

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          • #20
            So the other day I saw for sale some raw "bath milk". I'm intrigued... anybody drink it? After some googling it seems like it's a clandestine operation to get around the law (Australian), by selling it as a cosmetic product.
            Meri bilong mi i belhot!

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            • #21
              Bath milk? That's a new one. I know a lot of Americans go to remarkable lengths to buy raw milk 'for their pets'.

              Someone asked why yoghourt would be better than milk. Because it's a fermented food, the bacteria have digested (some, most or all of) the indigestible parts for you, and the bugs themselves are good to have. Also, it's satisfying to save a spoonful and make your own yoghourt. (Only thing is, with raw milk yoghourt especially I find I have to eat it pdq, as it continues 'working' in the fridge even faster than the home-made stuff usually does.)

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              • #22
                Bah, the nearest place to me is about 1 hr. away. That site is a great resource though, thanks!

                I hate milk, wouldn't drink it as a kid, won't drink it now but, I use it for cooking and yogurt. I wonder if raw milk freezes successfully? If so, I could get several gallons at a time and make that 3 hr. round trip worth the time.

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                • #23
                  I drink whole milk every couple of weeks, I use to drink 1/2 gallon of skim milk per day from the age of 14-19 (now 21), mainly when I was doing wrestling to maintain weight. I'm not diabetic, and in support of pklopp, I've tested blood sugar after consuming a cup of milk with nothing else and have seen a marginal rise in glucose after 30 minutes

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                  • #24
                    If you absolutely must have milk, change your mind and don't have it anyway!

                    Organic is at least tolerable. I think most people here would answer that you should have full fat, but if you are doing Primal to lose weight, I'm still not convinced that is the best choice all the time.

                    Conventional milk comes from cows that are often given the milk-boosting hormone that is banned in Canada and Europe. The FDA is corrupted by Monsanto.

                    I tried the Greek yogurt (organic) since so many people mentioned it here. All the flavored ones have sugar so I bought plain and mixed in some electrolyte mix powder called Ultima (grape, 4g carbs per scoop, 1 scoop for about a cup of yogurt).

                    Damn, it's good! I have to put it away because I want to eat too much of it. I got the idea on a site where someone was mixing in Crystal Light to flavor theirs.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by DFH View Post
                      I think most people here would answer that you should have full fat, but if you are doing Primal to lose weight, I'm still not convinced that is the best choice all the time.
                      Protein synthesis increases more drinking whole milk than drinking a large amount of skim milk to match the calories. More protein for less calories is the only benefit skim milk has, but since the whole milk has a bigger effect on protein synthesis even with less actual protein this is moot. Vitamin A and D in milk are fat soluble so they will appear in much smaller amounts in skim milk. Whole milk also tastes much better and isn't just chalky water.

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                      • #26
                        I didn't drink milk regularly the last 20 years and have just decided to add it back. Kind of nervous but happy.

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                        • #27
                          Another thing to try if you are interested in experimenting, is to get some kefir grains and make kefir from milk. It is liquid unlike yogurt, has a pleasant taste, is particularly thirst-quenching in the summer, and choke-full of pro-biotics, plus bacteria eats up the carbs and sugars, leaving you with the protein goodness.
                          My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
                          When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by LJH View Post
                            Bah, the nearest place to me is about 1 hr. away. That site is a great resource though, thanks!

                            I hate milk, wouldn't drink it as a kid, won't drink it now but, I use it for cooking and yogurt. I wonder if raw milk freezes successfully? If so, I could get several gallons at a time and make that 3 hr. round trip worth the time.
                            Yes, you can freeze raw milk. As with anything it is not quite as good as fresh but is pretty darn close.

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                            • #29
                              Full fat goat's milk tastes great! Still has the carbs like cow's milk, but is very tasty.

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                              • #30
                                I drank crappy conventional milk from 7-11 last night, it was awesome.

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