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  • Grains?

    I was just wondering what is classified as a grain. I know wheat, corn, barley, quinoa, oatmeal and rice (the obvious ones). What about soy, rye, lentils and chickpeas? The lentils and chickpeas are classified as grain legumes. Are those off limits? There is only so much "googling" I can do before I am overwhelmed and in too deep. If anyone could post an extensive list or even just help me out with those ones, it would be WONDERFUL. Thanks so much.

  • #2
    Soy, lentils, and chickpeas are legumes which some people consider to be better than grains, especially gluten grains, but they still have tons of lectins, saponins, phytates, and all of the other junk. Soaking removes some of the toxins, sprouting removes some more, and fermentation removes some more but even then they are hardly health food. We tend to prefer vegetables and tubers.

    Also soy is pretty damn poisonous. http://www.westonaprice.org/soy-alert.html

    Rye is a grain and a junky one at that.
    Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

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    • #3
      Lessee:
      Wheat, barley, corn, oat, rye, rice, quinoa, soy, beans (including lentils), chickpeas... If it's a bean, pea, or seed of grass, it's not Primal.
      Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, steak in one hand, chocolate in the other, yelling "Holy F***, What a Ride!"
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      • #4
        I didn't think quinoa was a grain. It's high in carbs so you don't want it a lot, but I thought it was ok (Mark did a post on it). Also, wild rice is NOT a grain - I thought that was interesting. Legumes you want to stay away from as well as grains. Peas and peanuts in there too. HTH!

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        • #5
          This is a decent list of grains:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grain

          Rye is a grain.
          Lentils and chickpeas are legumes, which are also off-limits... though a while back Mark described them as being in the "ok" (to eat occasionally) category with things like chocolate, wine, etc.

          I didn't know what soy was for sure, so I tried looking on wikipedia, which is usually a decent source if you want to know how something is technically classified. They call it an "oilseed" which I've never heard before in my life. =P Soy has some potentially harmful stuff in it too, so Mark advises against it, but he has mentioned eating some fermented soy on occasion (like tempeh and soy sauce).
          "mayness, you need to have a siggy line that says "Paleo Information Desk" or something!" -FMN <3

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          • #6
            True wild rice isn't. Most of the American black rice isn't wild rice. Quinoa I lump into the grain/ bean category because of the carbs and phytates (? there's something else.)
            Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, steak in one hand, chocolate in the other, yelling "Holy F***, What a Ride!"
            My Latest Journal

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            • #7
              Thanks everyone for the prompt and VERY informative responses !!!

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              • #8
                The main difference with Quinoa is that in and of itself it is a complete protein. Yes you need to soak and rinse it to remove poisons, but unlike the other grains and legumes it doesn't need to be combined to form a complete food.
                I didn't like the rules you gave me, so I made some of my own.

                Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general. - Mark Rippetoe

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by federkeil View Post
                  The main difference with Quinoa is that in and of itself it is a complete protein. Yes you need to soak and rinse it to remove poisons, but unlike the other grains and legumes it doesn't need to be combined to form a complete food.
                  But it is still a grain correct? SO it is off limits?

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                  • #10
                    Some foods, like quinoa, don't have to be cut and dry "off limits" because of their label.

                    I know that if I absolutely had to utilize a grain, quinoa would probably end up being my choice after a good soaking.

                    I also know that I like some seeds, even though they are "off limits".

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                    • #11
                      This is what my buddy has to say on the matter (he's been researching this stuff for the last 10 years or so)

                      "Quinoa is not a grain or legume. A seed of sorts. Its a complete protein which means it has complete digestion similar to animal protein. The pseudo-grain is ideal for people with liver congestion or stagnancy as it is not 'starchy' and has a 'bitter' flavor.

                      Often quinoa/amaranth are the only non-vegetable 'starch' that could be considered a fundamental food of a 'paleo' diet.

                      It suits mixed or carbohydrate metabolic dominant people the best. Notable though, is the combination of fat with any starch such as quinoa - ample butter, coconut, flax, or similar oil should be used."

                      the "bitter" bit is from Healing With Whole Foods which separates foods into "flavours" that match with different organs in the body (combining modern dietary knowledge with eastern philosophy)
                      I didn't like the rules you gave me, so I made some of my own.

                      Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general. - Mark Rippetoe

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                      • #12
                        quinoa is flower seeds.... :-)

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                        • #13
                          If the point is to avoid phytates and lectins, does it really matter whether something is a grain or not? Might some things that are not truly grains be higher in antinutrients than certain examples of actual grains? Is there any reference for the antinutrient content of various foods?

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                          • #14
                            If it's the seeds of a grass, it's a grain. Corn is hypergrown grass. All legumes are bad for you as well, including peanuts, beans, chickpeas and especially soy.
                            Primal eating in a nutshell: If you are hungry, eat Primal food until you are satisfied (not stuffed). Then stop. Wait until you're hungry again. Repeat.

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                            • #15
                              Now I'm confused and I thought I had this pretty much down. Do people here really avoid peas? what about green beans? Are all seeds off limits like sunflower/pumpkin?
                              I've been eating all of the above. I could do without the seeds but....peas, really? They can be eaten fresh out of the pod so they must be safe

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