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Some thing that confuses me

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  • Some thing that confuses me

    Ok, even though I've been a casual follower of PB this past year I'm still trying to wrap my brain around things I read here. As a preface, I've finally started incorporating lots of good fats in my diet recently. Mostly coconut milk/coconut oil, butter and fatty cuts of meat.

    That said, here's my confusion. I read here about how we need lots of good fats in our diets and don't worry about the calories, it's not about calories in/calories out. Then I read other threads were people tell others that are struggling with weight loss to cut back on the nuts and nut butters and because of all the calories. When I read stuff like this, it's very contradictory.

    BTW, I don't really eat many nuts but I there's still a part of me that worries about all the calories in the fats I'm eating these days. I just need some clarification.

  • #2
    Every "body" is different. Some people just cannot loose weight if they're eating dairy, some find nuts to be like a gateway drug to snacking. I find that myself. A small bowl of almonds leads to chocolate, leads to wine...then scavenging for other sweet things.

    If you have no weight to loose and are in great health, then you likely don't need to worry about any of it. Also, there is some concern with the levels of Omega 6's in some nuts, so some people avoid them for their own health reasons.
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    • #3
      Hmmm.

      The way I see it is that in an ideal world, calories wouldn't matter as long as you eat primal.
      However, for some of us, this doesn't quite work. The effects of the "normal" CW diet, other illnesses, can have a lasting effect. So in these cases, we may need to up the ante and watch things more carefully.
      Also, things like nut butter are very concentrated sources of a food that wouldn't be that available in that quantity / quality "in the wild".

      HTH

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      • #4
        There's a few different ideological splits in this community. That is just one of them. Calories in calories out is a failed model. Some have complete disdain for it, which imo, is missing the more important point. Some, no matter how they try to embrace the freedom of being primal, have to calculate their calories and track their macros, which imo, is also missing the more important point. My opinion may be right and may be wrong, but I think calories are more important than one side thinks and less important than the other.

        If you eat primal the fat content is so satiating you probably don't have to worry much about calories unless you have a portion control eating disorder. I was a BIG eater on my way to 368 pounds, but I have a tough time getting my calories up to 1800 IFing a little and eating primal. I am down almost 50 pounds in two months and while some don't want to hear it, I credit the natural calorie deficit of food elimination (sugar, grains) and fat consumption satiety for the weight loss.

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        • #5
          Yeah. I think we sometimes just forget to distinguish between good calories/bad calories. Also, maybe while we know that it's not as simple as calories in calories out, it still just slips into the arguments from time to time out of habit and because, frankly, it easier.

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          • #6
            I want to lose 40 pounds so although not as much as some, still a struggle. It doesn't help that I have a non-existent pituitary (tumor, surgery), on a full replacement therapy (which is never going to be the same as what a functioning pituitary would do) and I gained huge amounts of weight there after. It's been a constant freakin' struggle since to keep my weight under control. I mostly have hovered around 220-230 the last few years. I'd like to be 180 or in that ball park.

            I go real easy on the nuts, just used nuts for example purposes.

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            • #7
              I'm no expert yet, but I'd say forget about calories in/out and just keep the carbs low.
              One time http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/forum.php

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              • #8
                Nuts having a lot of calories isn't the reason why they aren't good fat loss food. They have a lot of omega 6 which will cause more insulin resistance and leptin resistance (I can't wait for Mark to talk about eicosanoid activity, omega fats and leptin resistance), unsoaked nuts have a lot of enzyme inhibitors and lectins that cause gut permeability (who soaks their nuts? Nobody I know of), and if they're roasted they're going to be highly reactive. Granted they do have some good nutrients like magnesium but if one can resolve their magnesium issues without resorting to high omega 6 nuts they're going to fare a lot better.
                Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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                • #9
                  something i notice....people who just eat and stop frikin analyzing everything to death are just fine, happy with themselves and their bodies. normal weight people have a good relationship with food, or they dont really have a 'relationship with it' so to say. those who need or want to lose weight have an intimate, downright groteque relationship with food, questioning and overthinking EVERYTHING. a person with a normal food relationship would not shun a handful of almond b/c they automatically think their omega 6 ratio will be thrown off and then theyre bound to get _____(fill in deisease)....they also would think about whether they should just have 8 almonds or should eat the whole can. they 'just eat'.

                  just....eat....primal. now dont get me wrong if you have diabetes, then worry about certain things, if your liver is fatty then worry about some thingsand if you have bad innflammation then by all means watch your omega ratio, but questioning everything from nuts to olive oil to potatos...
                  Get on my Level
                  http://malpaz.wordpress.com/

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by MalPaz View Post
                    something i notice....people who just eat and stop frikin analyzing everything to death are just fine, happy with themselves and their bodies. normal weight people have a good relationship with food, or they dont really have a 'relationship with it' so to say. those who need or want to lose weight have an intimate, downright groteque relationship with food, questioning and overthinking EVERYTHING. a person with a normal food relationship would not shun a handful of almond b/c they automatically think their omega 6 ratio will be thrown off and then theyre bound to get _____(fill in deisease)....they also would think about whether they should just have 8 almonds or should eat the whole can. they 'just eat'.

                    just....eat....primal. now dont get me wrong if you have diabetes, then worry about certain things, if your liver is fatty then worry about some thingsand if you have bad innflammation then by all means watch your omega ratio, but questioning everything from nuts to olive oil to potatos...
                    I think you have it backwards. Maybe they are happy because they DON'T NEED to over analyze everything, not the other way around.
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                    • #11
                      Rational people are going to do whatever is in their best interest based on their personal goals. Some people have loftier goals than others. It turns out that loftier goals require more critical thinking. It's a positive thing . What is not a positive thing is being overly critical of people who like to spread information like the best ways to restore health and normal weight or obtain a rocket-fast, efficient, hyper-metabolic state, degenerate as slowly as possible etc.
                      Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                      Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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                      • #12
                        I agree (to a degree) with over analysis, but, when you're already working behind the eight ball, like my self and so many others here are, you've got to really put a lot of thought into it. (run on sentence much?) If I was an other wise healthy individual, then I could more see the over analysis position.

                        I'll say this, what health I've achieved has been due to my own due diligence. If I sat back and passively waited for my doc to make all the decisions, I'd be much worse off for it. I poke, I prod, I push her and I'm much better off for it. I view my exploration of the primal life style much the same. It's such an absolute bitch for me to lose weight that I've got to really gather as much info as I can.

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                        • #13
                          mikebike, in another forum that embraces any diet that anyone wants to try to lose weight, my mantra is "whatever works". I think that applies within PB. There is a lot of room for customization. If you need to carefully analyze then do it. But there's big difference in customizing and changing or altering. In your first post you say you are a casual follower of PB. That hasn't been working. In your last you say losing weight is a bitch. Maybe you should be a more formal follower? It cannot hurt to embrace whole hog. You want to lose weight, get the carbs so low you start burning fats for fuel, and the weight WILL come off.

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                          • #14
                            I should clarify, was casual, now whole hog.

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                            • #15
                              I think the guy who said "just eat primal" is right. Then things should start to happen. But if you follow the primal diet "just a little" i.e. what i'd consider "casual" then things are less likely to happen. So the answer really would just eat primal and don't overanalyse this stuff. Just enjoy it.
                              One time http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/forum.php

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