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  • Yup. If I wasn't afraid, I would move.

    Hey, that book that you sent Ci--did you find that it was helpful? It looks interesting, and I'm thinking about getting it. I've read a few self-help books in the past, but I've never found any of them to be helpful.

    My journal

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    • I read it a long time ago, when I was 23, and I did find it really helpful back then. I'll see if I can find a PDF for you
      "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

      In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

      - Ray Peat

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      • So I have this one friend from law school. She moved to LA right after law school and hasn't been able to find a real job. Every time I talk to her, it makes me not want to move. She's so negative about the prospects of getting a job in CA. I just talked to her again...

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        • Aah, but how will you know for sure if you never give it a try? You know, if every time I had listened to my friends advice in similar situations, I'd probably be in a far worse place and state now.
          There is always an in-between kind of job you can find temporarily...... hugsssssss....(oops! that would probably sound like hissing....)

          Comment


          • Lol! Thanks, Gray! You're right--there's no reason why my experience would be exactly like hers. And I do have to try it myself to know what would happen...Take a leap of faith, like YB said. Scary though.

            My journal

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            • Originally posted by diene View Post
              8/2/13

              2 cups coffee
              3 tbsp unsweetened cocoa + 1 packet gelatin
              1 80-cal packet of tuna
              3 plums
              2 peaches
              2 pork ribs (I cut off all of the fat, which didn't really leave that much meat so it was really only like four bites of meat)

              Cynomel
              10 AM: ~3 mcg
              2:00 PM: ~2 mcg
              This was your entire day's food?!
              Disclaimer: I have read some info about Ray Peat and think it may help me, however if you follow any advice related to Ray Peat you may start spontaneously guzzling OJ and Mexican Coke by the gallon, eating bags of sugar with a spoon, popping aspirins 10 times a day and buying loads of stuff from him that he doesn't sell.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by diene View Post
                I haven't measured myself since stopping JUDDD either. Scared... Anyway, I'm pretty sure that I haven't lost any weight. I don't think Cynomel is magic. It helps you along if you try to lose. Right around when I started Cynomel was when I got off JUDDD so that was probably not a great idea. But I feel like I need another break from dieting. I'm kinda sick of JUDDD, to be honest, but not sure what else to try. I thought potato hack, but that will probably cause me to lose muscle. An all egg diet like that one girl was doing? Not enough carbs. So wtf, don't know what to do. Might give the fast metabolism diet a shot. Did you ever get around to reading the book?



                Yeah, that would be awesome! We shouldn't wait till we're 50 to do it though.
                You seem to yo-yo between diet ideas? I've only glanced at your blog so apologies if that's false. Have you ever just done 4-5 smallish meals a day with balanced fat,carb, protein per meal, low starches and no gluten?

                What are you trying to achieve? Have you got body composition analysis done? The multi-point calliper test is best, you can accurately track fat levels at the important sites. Scale weight and mirror is useless. You could be putting on muscle, losing total fat inches and measurement inches but be putting on weight, so you think you're "putting on weight" In a bad way.

                As a guy, I think all women look better with a bit more muscle - I don't mean body builder, it's v hard with your testosterone levels to put much muscle on, but I think a bit of extra muscle just makes the body look more attractive and healthy, yet majority of women I know are terrified of putting on any muscle.

                Your diet looks extremely unbalanced and lacking in calories. Do you track rough calories per meal and day?

                Edit: ok I read some more of your thread. You mention Peatarian diet, but to me it doesn't look like one. One thing, from your food logs I can't tell what you ate at each meal and at what times.

                It seems to me you don't stick to something and plan your meals ahead of time?

                I've just started religiously preparing all my meals the night before and weighing everything so I know my calorie splits perfectly with my peat style diet. Really useful. Tupperware is your best friend!

                I would suggest a regular 1500-1800 calories every day, maybe more on workout days, split over 4 meals, at around 30P-30F-40C .. I do 25-25-50 as I'm doing full Peat style now. Make sure you eat early morning...
                Last edited by simonb; 08-08-2013, 03:34 PM.
                Disclaimer: I have read some info about Ray Peat and think it may help me, however if you follow any advice related to Ray Peat you may start spontaneously guzzling OJ and Mexican Coke by the gallon, eating bags of sugar with a spoon, popping aspirins 10 times a day and buying loads of stuff from him that he doesn't sell.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by diene View Post
                  So I have this one friend from law school. She moved to LA right after law school and hasn't been able to find a real job. Every time I talk to her, it makes me not want to move. She's so negative about the prospects of getting a job in CA. I just talked to her again...
                  Don't take advice from miserable people! They will drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience
                  "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                  In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                  - Ray Peat

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    This was your entire day's food?!
                    Hey, simonb - thanks for dropping by! No, I just forgot to add what I had for dinner. It was a couple of crab legs and mojitos, in case you were wondering. Oh, and two raw oysters!! (They're actually pretty good if you put a shitload of horseradish on them so that you can hardly taste the oysters. That's how I used to eat sashimi--I'd put so much wasabi on that I could barely taste the raw fish.)

                    Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    You seem to yo-yo between diet ideas? I've only glanced at your blog so apologies if that's false. Have you ever just done 4-5 smallish meals a day with balanced fat,carb, protein per meal, low starches and no gluten?
                    That's basically correct. Within a generally primalish framework, I yoyo between different diet hacks. Usually, if something becomes popular on the forums, I'll be tempted to try it for a couple weeks/months. When it fails to deliver results, I lose interest and stop for a while or switch to something else.

                    I don't eat gluten, but I do love starches.

                    Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    What are you trying to achieve? Have you got body composition analysis done? The multi-point calliper test is best, you can accurately track fat levels at the important sites. Scale weight and mirror is useless. You could be putting on muscle, losing total fat inches and measurement inches but be putting on weight, so you think you're "putting on weight" In a bad way.

                    As a guy, I think all women look better with a bit more muscle - I don't mean body builder, it's v hard with your testosterone levels to put much muscle on, but I think a bit of extra muscle just makes the body look more attractive and healthy, yet majority of women I know are terrified of putting on any muscle.
                    I don't know how to do a caliper test, but I did get a bod pod measurement done in March. It's not accurate the way DEXA is, but it's comparable to the water immersion test, I think. I was at 25.9% body fat. I have definitely put on muscle since then so I don't know where I'm at right now.

                    While I agree that the scale is useless, I don't think the mirror is useless. Also, I measure my waist and belly circumference with a measuring tape (b/c those are my problem areas and where I put on fat/lose fat from). I determine my success (or lack there of) based on those measurements.

                    Don't worry, no one can accuse me of being afraid to put on muscle. I have even refrained from complaining on here about the fact that I've put on so much muscle around my chest area that a lot of my dresses are getting really tight around the bust (and, no, my breasts did not grow--yeah, I wish), and I'm afraid that they'll stop fitting.

                    Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    Your diet looks extremely unbalanced and lacking in calories. Do you track rough calories per meal and day?
                    Sorry, I don't track diligently enough, but it's definitely not lacking in calories. I was doing JUDDD (Johnson's up day down day) for a while, and, on JUDDD, you alternate between high-calorie days and low-calorie days so if you looked at my older entries, there were days when I ate almost nothing but that's cuz they were down days.

                    Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    Edit: ok I read some more of your thread. You mention Peatarian diet, but to me it doesn't look like one. One thing, from your food logs I can't tell what you ate at each meal and at what times.

                    It seems to me you don't stick to something and plan your meals ahead of time?

                    I've just started religiously preparing all my meals the night before and weighing everything so I know my calorie splits perfectly with my peat style diet. Really useful. Tupperware is your best friend!
                    I'm friends with many Peatarians on here, and I've incorporated some of Peat's recommendations, especially consuming lots of gelatin and minimizing omega-6s. But I haven't adopted the entire Peatarian diet. My macro breakdown is closer to PHD than Peat; I also prefer starches to fruits, which is also a PHD-esque thing. But I wouldn't say that I'm doing PHD either. You know, I have general dietary guidelines influenced by paleo/primal, PHD, and Peat, but I'm not strictly any of those things.

                    And you're right that I don't really plan out my meals ahead of time. I wish I were organized enough to plan out every meal the day before, weigh/cook everything, and put them in tupperwares to bring to work. But I am really not that organized...

                    Originally posted by simonb View Post
                    I would suggest a regular 1500-1800 calories every day, maybe more on workout days, split over 4 meals, at around 30P-30F-40C .. I do 25-25-50 as I'm doing full Peat style now. Make sure you eat early morning...
                    Interesting. How do you time your 4 meals? When I don't consciously restrict my macros, I naturally end up around 30P-30F-40C so that's what I'm usually eating these days.

                    Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                    Don't take advice from miserable people! They will drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience
                    I know. But it's sooooo hard sometimes! :/

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                    • In the spirit of tracking more diligently, here's yesterday's food:

                      8/8/13
                      1 coffee with 1 packet gelatin and 2 tbsp unsweetened cocoa
                      apple cinnamon tea jello (apple cinnamon tea, few drops of stevia, gelatin)
                      1 sirloin steak (with fat trimmed off)
                      3 vodka + club soda
                      1 small packet of gummy bears (sweetened with fruit juice and not HFCS )
                      handful of Enjoy Life chocolate chips
                      handful of sunflower/pumpkin seeds (I know, bad - I only have that stuff in the house cuz the bf insists on eating them despite the fact that I've told him a million times that it's bad for you cuz of the omega-6)

                      I had the coffee with gelatin and cocoa around noon, and that's the only thing I had all day. I wasn't even hungry. I ate the rest of the stuff between 6 and 9 pm. I'd like to see if I can recreate that today.

                      8/9/13

                      Food
                      1 coffee with 1 packet gelatin & 2 tbsp unsweetened cocoa

                      Cynomel
                      9:00 AM: 1mcg
                      11:00 AM: 1 mcg
                      3:50 PM: 2 mcg
                      Last edited by diene; 08-09-2013, 01:06 PM.

                      My journal

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by diene View Post
                        That's basically correct. Within a generally primalish framework, I yoyo between different diet hacks. Usually, if something becomes popular on the forums, I'll be tempted to try it for a couple weeks/months. When it fails to deliver results, I lose interest and stop for a while or switch to something else.
                        Consistency wins! You change a LOT, it was only May I think you were doing JUDDD, which to me is nuts! (see below)


                        Originally posted by diene View Post

                        Sorry, I don't track diligently enough, but it's definitely not lacking in calories. I was doing JUDDD (Johnson's up day down day) for a while, and, on JUDDD, you alternate between high-calorie days and low-calorie days so if you looked at my older entries, there were days when I ate almost nothing but that's cuz they were down days.
                        this just doesn't make sense, teaching your body that you're half-starving it, half-overfeeding it, to me is about as un-Primal as you can go. It would make sense to me the body holds onto fat during the over-feeding in preparation for the starvation. Stress hormones would go through the roof (if you believe the Peat/Roddy/Rubin explanation), especially if you do an un-fed Crossfit session.

                        Josh Rubin says he has Orange juice with gelatin and salt throughout his training (3 tablespoons of Gelatin in the OJ!), and a meal before. I love the OJ with sparkling water, gelatin and salt during training now. I have about 16 ounces (half OJ, half sparkling water)

                        Originally posted by diene View Post
                        I'm friends with many Peatarians on here, and I've incorporated some of Peat's recommendations, especially consuming lots of gelatin and minimizing omega-6s. But I haven't adopted the entire Peatarian diet. My macro breakdown is closer to PHD than Peat; I also prefer starches to fruits, which is also a PHD-esque thing. But I wouldn't say that I'm doing PHD either. You know, I have general dietary guidelines influenced by paleo/primal, PHD, and Peat, but I'm not strictly any of those things.
                        I don't think Gelatin is necessarily a "Peatism", I think the main thing about Peat is actually "eat to control stress hormones", at least the way Roddy and Rubin explain it, most easily measured by body temp and pulse (on waking, and 20 mins after meals). I think this overriding principle is much more important than things like Gelatin, they are only relevant in context.

                        FYI, Peat is adamant that starch causes more body fat than fruit. I don't know how to evaluate the science behind it. I prefer to take his word for it and test it myself over 3-4 months.

                        Related to below, eating something small on rising to stem adrenaline, and if you wake in the night, having something to control Adrenaline (a bit of orange juice with salt in), then eating regularly to control hormones through the day. How you do this is up to you, eg you could do a "peat" diet without any gelatin.

                        Originally posted by diene View Post
                        And you're right that I don't really plan out my meals ahead of time. I wish I were organized enough to plan out every meal the day before, weigh/cook everything, and put them in tupperwares to bring to work. But I am really not that organized...
                        I'm very disorganised myself, but I think the above is the difference between success and failure. The yo-yoing between diets, not knowing when and how much you eat, yes it's NORMAL for vast majority of people, but you obviously have invested, and are investing, a lot of time into your diet and health, and this is rule #1 . You can't improve anything without planning and tracking it. YOu'll start to see patterns - "oh, I ate 6 hours apart and felt crap", "I ate 60% fat that week, and got fat" etc... it's so easy to overdo fat calories because of 9 vs 4 in Carbs and protein.

                        You can make the meal for tomorrow at the same time as making dinner tonight. If it's to be eaten cold, add way more salt than you think (for taste), which also is a Peatism (for attacking stress hormones)

                        It's not that hard. All you have to do is prepare 2 meals the night before, which often is one large meal broken in two. See below.

                        Originally posted by diene View Post
                        Interesting. How do you time your 4 meals? When I don't consciously restrict my macros, I naturally end up around 30P-30F-40C so that's what I'm usually eating these days.
                        At the moment it's 5 "meals" with 2 small snacks, but 2 of the 5 "meals" are broth with fruit, so really it's 3 meals, 2 of them made at home.

                        1) small snack immediately on rising - bit of juice with salt or dried fruit
                        2) breakfast 30-60 mins later 8-9am, mix of protein, carb, fat
                        3) bone broth (with a bit of butter or coconut oil for fat) with some ripe fruit - around 10.30-11am
                        4) main meal - prepared in advance - 1pm, mix of protein, carb, fat
                        5) same as 3 - bone broth with fruit, or second half of #4 if prepared enough 3-5pm
                        6) main meal around 6.30pm - either tupperware if working late, or at home - 7-8pm
                        7) small snack before bed

                        So really you just need the bone broth either in a thermos or not if you have microwave, some fruit, and one tupperware main meal, which you could divide in 2 and eat 3-5 hours apart with broth and fruit once in between. The rest you have at home - breakfast, dinner and late snack

                        Bone broth freezes for 6 months, so you can make a HUGE amount of it, divide it into single zip-bag portions, and freeze it. You can get 2-3 weeks worth in one "production run" haha, and pull them out of the freezer as you need them.

                        It's pretty easy, and gets engrained after 1-2 weeks.

                        BOOM!
                        Last edited by simonb; 08-09-2013, 08:13 AM.
                        Disclaimer: I have read some info about Ray Peat and think it may help me, however if you follow any advice related to Ray Peat you may start spontaneously guzzling OJ and Mexican Coke by the gallon, eating bags of sugar with a spoon, popping aspirins 10 times a day and buying loads of stuff from him that he doesn't sell.

                        Comment


                        • Hey, thanks! Oy, that looks like a very rigid plan! Is the bone broth absolutely essential? I make bone broth sometimes, and I know you can make a bunch and freeze it. But the thought of freezing a gazillion ziplock bags of broth to bring to work everyday just seems too crazy for me to be able to handle at this point. (I'm about to make a big change in my life--going to break up with my live-in bf and move across the country, and the thought of having to freeze 60 individual portions of bone broth right now is just, uh, not going to happen.) Can I substitute the bone broth with gelatin?

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                          • Originally posted by diene View Post
                            Hey, thanks! Oy, that looks like a very rigid plan! Is the bone broth absolutely essential? I make bone broth sometimes, and I know you can make a bunch and freeze it. But the thought of freezing a gazillion ziplock bags of broth to bring to work everyday just seems too crazy for me to be able to handle at this point. (I'm about to make a big change in my life--going to break up with my live-in bf and move across the country, and the thought of having to freeze 60 individual portions of bone broth right now is just, uh, not going to happen.) Can I substitute the bone broth with gelatin?
                            Yeah, sure it would work.

                            Bone broth is easy to make (2-3 hours), can be done when making dinner at home, and you can make 4-5 days worth and keep in the fridge that week. Also you can add carrots/potatoes/onions etc and blend it all up at the end to have a soup which has extra carbs too.
                            Disclaimer: I have read some info about Ray Peat and think it may help me, however if you follow any advice related to Ray Peat you may start spontaneously guzzling OJ and Mexican Coke by the gallon, eating bags of sugar with a spoon, popping aspirins 10 times a day and buying loads of stuff from him that he doesn't sell.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by diene View Post
                              Hey, thanks! Oy, that looks like a very rigid plan!
                              Depends what you mean. Rigid in terms of you know what you will eat in advance, but not hard to do.

                              I think if you really are not happy with the effect of your current diet, you have to be rigid for a bit to change it.

                              I know that if I don't plan in advance, I end up grabbing food at odd times, undereating and having a messed up blend of macros.
                              Disclaimer: I have read some info about Ray Peat and think it may help me, however if you follow any advice related to Ray Peat you may start spontaneously guzzling OJ and Mexican Coke by the gallon, eating bags of sugar with a spoon, popping aspirins 10 times a day and buying loads of stuff from him that he doesn't sell.

                              Comment


                              • You're probably right. I just have to get my act together.

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