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  • I would think that for someone in a weak state that stress is stress and being overly hot would result in stress hormones. When stress hormones are present there will be a drop in body temp as well, right? I mean think about when you get adrenalin/cortisol spikes, usually temp is low and extremities are freezing, most likely because adrenaline is a vasoconstrictor.

    PM, i think what Stephan recommends and what YB is doing is pretty dang extreme and certainly not for everyone. YB and a few others with chronically low temps and set point problems (flushing of face) that the protocol might work well. For others with a pretty standard response to temp, it is probably detrimental to try and over heat the body.

    Stick to the over-eating thing and listen to your body. If you feel some cold extremities or brain fog, take a hot shower/bath or eat a hot meal, no need to go to extremes.

    I think you were on the right path before the heat experiment. Keep it going, keep it relaxed and remember what your working towards.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
      What you describe sounds very different. I'm not having hot flushes, I'm just hot. Like I'm dressed too warm in a warm room, which I am When I take off a layer I feel all better. I don't get hotter or feel cold, I feel just right. When I try and keep warmly dressed to keep my body temp up I eventually seem to crash energetically. Allowing myself to cool off a bit though, does make me feel better. When I talk about my temp going down it is usually only to about 98. Only a few times did it dip down below that and when it did it came back up pretty quick.

      I got out in the sun today for a few hours. It is only about 50 degrees, but sunny and it still felt good. I did some really light weeding and left it at that.
      Oh, that does sound like you're dressing too warmly. Sounds like what I did on the initual resetting day - I heated up to the point of total exhaustion, and only felt better when I stripped down. Just be comfortable. You're already at a good temp. I'm just aiming to be cosy. Unfortunately for me that means wearing seven layers and a hat.!

      Just don't do the bare foot thing - i know you said you have a tendency to do that but I think that really fires the adrenals up.
      "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

      In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

      - Ray Peat

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Zach View Post
        I would think that for someone in a weak state that stress is stress and being overly hot would result in stress hormones. When stress hormones are present there will be a drop in body temp as well, right? I mean think about when you get adrenalin/cortisol spikes, usually temp is low and extremities are freezing, most likely because adrenaline is a vasoconstrictor.

        PM, i think what Stephan recommends and what YB is doing is pretty dang extreme and certainly not for everyone. YB and a few others with chronically low temps and set point problems (flushing of face) that the protocol might work well. For others with a pretty standard response to temp, it is probably detrimental to try and over heat the body.

        Stick to the over-eating thing and listen to your body. If you feel some cold extremities or brain fog, take a hot shower/bath or eat a hot meal, no need to go to extremes.

        I think you were on the right path before the heat experiment. Keep it going, keep it relaxed and remember what your working towards.
        Totally agree Zach.

        Edit: from what I know adrenaline raises your body temp, which is why it important to keep warm if you've got weak adrenals.

        Prolonged exposure to stress hormones can result in temperature dysregulation and low body temp.
        Last edited by YogaBare; 04-22-2013, 02:49 PM.
        "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

        In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

        - Ray Peat

        Comment


        • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
          My concern is: Does anyone ever come OFF of thyroid meds once they start? I do want to at least know more of what I'm dealing with. I'll see about getting some tests done.
          I'm sure it's possible, for some people, depending on a lot of factors-- cause, length/type of dysfunction, physical status of the thyroid gland, etc.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Zach View Post
            I would think that for someone in a weak state that stress is stress and being overly hot would result in stress hormones. When stress hormones are present there will be a drop in body temp as well, right? I mean think about when you get adrenalin/cortisol spikes, usually temp is low and extremities are freezing, most likely because adrenaline is a vasoconstrictor.

            PM, i think what Stephan recommends and what YB is doing is pretty dang extreme and certainly not for everyone. YB and a few others with chronically low temps and set point problems (flushing of face) that the protocol might work well. For others with a pretty standard response to temp, it is probably detrimental to try and over heat the body.

            Stick to the over-eating thing and listen to your body. If you feel some cold extremities or brain fog, take a hot shower/bath or eat a hot meal, no need to go to extremes.

            I think you were on the right path before the heat experiment. Keep it going, keep it relaxed and remember what your working towards.
            Yep, I think I was just adding more stress. Stress really is just stress no matter where it comes from. I can get just as worn out thinking too hard, or having stressful conversations as working hard with my body.
            PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
            http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

            Comment


            • Originally posted by YogaBare View Post

              Just don't do the bare foot thing - i know you said you have a tendency to do that but I think that really fires the adrenals up.
              Did I mention I have floor heat?
              PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

              Comment


              • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                Did I mention I have floor heat?
                Niiiice! Enjoy
                "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                - Ray Peat

                Comment


                • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                  Did I mention I have floor heat?
                  Floor heat is so luxurious. You could knock one of your walls down in the middle of winter and still be warm.

                  I experience the same thing when I get too warm from clothing. Immediate sleepiness. Just try to stay comfortable.
                  Is it weird in here, or is it just me?

                  Comment


                  • I just read Go Kaleo's book "Taking Up Space". It was short but good and has me thinking. She uses the calc linked below to calculate calories and says the body will settle at the weight you are eating to support. So, if I eat 2,800 calories that supports me at about 200 pounds, 1,800 calories whould support me around 100 pounds. She also says that if hunger or food obsession occurs that you are trying to eat at a level that supports a weight lower that what your body believes is ideal for you. Well, here I am maintaining around 146 very easily. No hunger, cravings, etc. She says that her body didn't want to go below 160 and when she got there she just started recomping. She lost all the extra fat, built muscle and still weighs 160.

                    Now, awhile back I had been trying to figure out what I would weigh if I gained about 10 pounds of muscle (I think I've lost some muscle now, and that might be more like 15 pounds from where I'm at currently) and had a fat percentage of about 18% ( this is from memory, so I'm assuming I would have figured 18ish) and I came out with 145 pounds. So, I'm now wondering if our bodies have a set point separate from body comp. Like it will allow less muscle, but try to compensate with more fat. If muscle goes up it will allow fat to come off, but please don't go below this weight or I'll make you OCD about food until you give in and eat.

                    Can I then expect to stay at this weight and slowly recomp (if I'm lifting) or else I will have to battle myself over my weight? I noticed on the ideal body weight calculator on the link below says that 143 is right in the middle of the ideal range for my height and 132 was at the low end. Perhaps the ideal fat percentage is easy to achieve if we give our bodies the muscle they want to maintain a higher weight and lowering body fat is only going against our bodies when lbm is too low.

                    Health-calc - Energy expenditure adv.
                    Last edited by PaleoMom; 04-25-2013, 08:24 AM.
                    PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                    Comment


                    • I do believe the more muscle you carry, the leaner you will tend to be. This of course depends on the type of muscle you put on. Lifting weights for hypertrophy will not accomplish this because your body does not care about leverages when moving a lighter weight for more reps, you could be 100 or 300lbs and the results would be the same. If however you work the density of your muscles via bodyweight and very heavy lifting, your body will strive to lower its bodyfat to become more efficient at moving itself.

                      The problem for someone like you is figuring out a way to add muscle without exhausting yourself.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Zach View Post
                        I do believe the more muscle you carry, the leaner you will tend to be. This of course depends on the type of muscle you put on. Lifting weights for hypertrophy will not accomplish this because your body does not care about leverages when moving a lighter weight for more reps, you could be 100 or 300lbs and the results would be the same. If however you work the density of your muscles via bodyweight and very heavy lifting, your body will strive to lower its bodyfat to become more efficient at moving itself.

                        The problem for someone like you is figuring out a way to add muscle without exhausting yourself.
                        I used to think more muscle made for a leaner body until I heard that muscle really doesn't burn all that much more than fat does, but thinking about it this new way gives it new importance for fat loss. Strength of course has its own advantages aside from fat loss. I don't enjoy feeling weak!

                        I usually do BBS type workouts. They don't wear me out unless I'm in a particularly low energy period. The light weights, high reps really do wear me out completely though. I have really increased my strength in the past this way but have found that I seem to lose all the gains instantly if I take a break. I now think this has to do with previously just not eating enough calories. I made sure to get the protein in but I was very low cal. Last summer I took a break from lifting because my gardening work was enough that I couldn't get in the recovery time I needed. Anyway, even though I was working hard in the garden I had practically lost all my strength gains by fall. I then started lifting again and only stopped when starting this eat more experiment because I was so tired. Yesterday I thought I'd see where I was at and did some push-ups. I could only do 2 real push-ups and 8 girl push-ups!! Yikes. I've really lost it! I'm hoping that now with the calories to back me up I can actually put on some muscle and keep in on. I'm lucky that the BBS workouts don't seem to damage my energy, sprints are completely out of the question! I'll have a lot less heavy gardening work this year, mostly just weeding now, and so I'll try to keep up the lifting through the summer time.
                        PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                        http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                        Comment


                        • Today is my weigh in day again. I'm the same weight and waist size as last week. I'm a bit surprised by that. I have done a ton of physical activity this week and have eaten just enough to feel satisfied. In general I feel like I should have had a calorie deficit this week and dropped some. I know I shouldn't be thinking that way again but I'm physically uncomfortable at this size. My stomach gets in my way and clothing is uncomfortable unless I stay in my pj's. I ate around 1700-2000 calories most days and burned a ton of calories in the garden. Why am I exactly the same?
                          PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                          http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                          Comment


                          • Hey PM, I totally know what you mean, and feel your pain. My advice is to forget weight loss: it's going to happen, it's inevitable. There may be nothing for a while on the scales, or by the measuring tape, but our bodies may be doing funny things inside to prepare to start releasing it's fat stores. One example: you could be retaining water and putting on muscle, which would mean no apparent physical changes.

                            If it's any consolation, since I stopped "eating a ton" my weight hasn't changed, and my measurements have been going up and down. But - something is happening to my body, because I am making huge gains in strength and flexibility. I have the feeling that there's a whoosh ahead for both of us Be patient. What's that thing they say in Astanga?
                            "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                            In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                            - Ray Peat

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by YogaBare View Post
                              Hey PM, I totally know what you mean, and feel your pain. My advice is to forget weight loss: it's going to happen, it's inevitable. There may be nothing for a while on the scales, or by the measuring tape, but our bodies may be doing funny things inside to prepare to start releasing it's fat stores. One example: you could be retaining water and putting on muscle, which would mean no apparent physical changes.

                              If it's any consolation, since I stopped "eating a ton" my weight hasn't changed, and my measurements have been going up and down. But - something is happening to my body, because I am making huge gains in strength and flexibility. I have the feeling that there's a whoosh ahead for both of us Be patient. What's that thing they say in Astanga?
                              I would like to think I'm secretly building muscle and just hiding it with a bunch of water retention. That is very optimistic of you! I don't show any signs of building muscle at the moment, but I'll think good thoughts
                              PaleoMom's Diet Recovery Journal
                              http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82059.html

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by PaleoMom View Post
                                I would like to think I'm secretly building muscle and just hiding it with a bunch of water retention. That is very optimistic of you! I don't show any signs of building muscle at the moment, but I'll think good thoughts
                                Keep thinking good thoughts!

                                I actually don't think I'm being optimistic Logically: people always talk about gradual weight loss, plateaus and whooshs when they are losing weight the right way. I've only ever starved myself, so I have no idea what real weight loss is. But I'm sure all these people can't be wrong. Don't start thinking youre "broken"!

                                Also, one thing I'm trying that you might be interested in: I'm putting a lot of emphasis on keeping my belly and lower back warm. My current theory is that excess fat accumulates on the areas that need insulation, and people carry belly fat cos' the stomach needs to be warm to work. Whenever I'm at home now my belly is wrapped in blankets. I'm hoping this will encourage my body to lose the weight from there. I can dream, can't I?!
                                "I think the basic anti-aging diet is also the best diet for prevention and treatment of diabetes, scleroderma, and the various "connective tissue diseases." This would emphasize high protein, low unsaturated fats, low iron, and high antioxidant consumption, with a moderate or low starch consumption.

                                In practice, this means that a major part of the diet should be milk, cheese, eggs, shellfish, fruits and coconut oil, with vitamin E and salt as the safest supplements."

                                - Ray Peat

                                Comment

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